How well-reputed is Northeastern's Computer Science Department?

Colleges and Universities A-Z Northeastern University
1

I already asked a similar question before, but I have 2 particular questions on my mind.

First, how accessible are the undergraduate research opportunities at Northeastern? I read that at some schools, these research opportunities for undergrads are very competitive and it may be hard to even get opportunities altogether. How do the research opportunities compare to other CS colleges?

Second, how do top employers from companies like Google, Facebook, and Amazon view Northeastern’s curriculum and co-op? Which companies recruit on campus? How many students get co-ops from these top companies / Is co-op to these companies competitive?

2

I will answer the co-op question. Top tech firms do recruit for co-ops at Northeastern and not just in CS. Amazon, google, hubspot, intel, wayfair, etc. full many co-op positions each year with NEU students (at locations across the country.) They all have relationships with the school and many make offers to these co-op students for full time jobs after graduation and are on NEU’s jobs database recruiting for post grad jobs also. That being said, as you would imagine these are top jobs and they are very competitive. You won’t get them as a first co-op and you won’t get them if you don’t have a good GPA, don’t interview well, and don’t have a polished resume. To sum it up, the opportunities are there you just need to do the right things to get these jobs (both co-op and post grad).

3

Thx! Anyone have an answer for the first question?

4

CS student here - research is also very accessible, as the school is generally very undergraduate-focused. Even though I’m not incredibly interested in research, I have had the opportunity to work on two projects now just from talking with professors. PL, Networks, and Systems research are the main areas you will find opportunities in given the strength and focus of the subjects here, but you can work in just about anything if you talk with your professor, express interest, and have some skills to contribute. I can’t say how this compares to every other CS college around, but if you are interested in research, you won’t have any trouble here.

Adding to the second, while it is good not to assume you can get a top co-op on your first go, some do, particularly those with prior experience or lots of side projects. I know people who worked their first co-ops at Google, Facebook, Apple, and Snapchat.

Adding to that list of companies, this year SpaceX began recruiting for both engineering and CS. Facebook and Intuit also regularly take co-ops and full-time positions. I believe both Intuit and Hubspot both hire about 15 each co-op cycle, so those positions are often more attainable than some of the other big name companies. Considering that CCIS is about 300 majors per year (last I checked, probably growing), and between different co-op cycles and class distributions only about 500 CCIS students will be on co-op per cycle, 6% of co-ops will go to those two companies alone, per cycle.

5

I was heavily involved in research all through undergrad (though not in CS). In general, professional are eager to take on undergraduate students interested in research, and there are plenty of opportunities. I agree with PengsPhils that Northeastern remains undergraduate focused, and this is one of the places where that shows. It’s definitely something you can get into your first or second year. There is also competitive funding available from the university to fund a research co-op, if that interests you. (The professor may also have money for this.) Research can also be a work study job. I did a research co-op on campus, and it was a really great chance to experience what it’s like to work in academic research full time and helped convince me to go for a PhD.

Side note on research - they’re also investing in expanding robotics, so if that’s your interest there are growing opportunities available there as well.

6

Parent here. The top employers come to campus and recruit hard for CS students. And some first time co-ops definitely do get these jobs - my son was very lucky to land his dream company last year as a second year and many of his friends had similar success. Companies love NEU’s 6-8 month co-op model, which gives students so much more time to be productive than the typical summer model. Northeastern gives the students the classes they need and a way to get in front of these companies - the rest is up to the students.

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I would not go to Northeastern and go into large debt with the goal of majoring Computer Science. Northeastern isn’t really known for STEM. What are your other options? For example, if you are a resident of Michigan, Illinois or Wisconsin, those flagships would be FAR better options. Even UMass would be better for CS.

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@WildestDream

And this claim is based on…?

9

@WildestDream , I see the moderators have given you another chance to put your opinion in context, politely. Taking as a given that it’s a bad idea to go into “large debt” for just about any school, from where are you getting your impression that NU isn’t well-regarded for STEM? The school has changed dramatically in recent decades, so it would be helpful to know whether you are relying on recent information or on historical “reputation.”

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My point is that a CS degree from Northeastern will likely not move your resume the top, against, say a similarly qualified UMass CS grad. Also, a UMass degree will not require a Massachusetts resident to go into six figures of debt (if you get merit-aid from NU, then it changes the equation)

Feel free to disagree with me, but that’s MY opinion based on my experience in tech circles. Also, reputations in the tech industry, historical or not, DO matter. Many of the people hiring, especially outside Silicon Valley, will be older.

I just don’t want students taking on enormous debt without opinions on both sides heard.

11

That is fair - I think it’s understood that an NU CS degree does not carry the gravitas, based on name alone, of the very top-tier CS schools. However, from the parent perspective, those top-tier schools are now able to be so selective that many of the kids they’re admitting are employable in the industry before they ever arrive at college. As a parent of a CS-interested kid who is not already a “code warrior” going into college, what interests me is the quality of undergraduate teaching, the access to resources, the support provided to promote the individual student’s success, and the opportunities available to build a strong resume, both by acquiring a degree from a college with a solid reputation, and by building experience through research, internship and/or co-op opportunities.

I agree that I would never advise any student to go into six figures of debt, for any degree from any school. And I would not advise anyone to pay more for NU purely on the premise that a CS degree from Northeastern will be more prestigious than one from a well-regarded public university. On the other hand, the experience, both in and out of the classroom, is quite different at NU from what most large public U’s offer. I think the individual has to look at the overall path through a CS education at the different schools they’re considering, and try not just to compare the value of the degree, all other things being equal, but to attempt to project the ways in which all other things may not play out equally. In what environment is this particular student likely to thrive, stick with their original plan to achieve that CS degree, seize the available opportunities, and develop into a strong job applicant with enthusiasm for their chosen field and area of focus? My kid, for example, is energized by intellectual variety and by interdisciplinary pursuits. I can see her loving a CS+X major at NU, and having co-op experiences that could solidify her interests and position her well to find work she will enjoy. Conversely, I can see her going to a well-regarded public U with a strong CS program that washes out 70% of aspiring majors (graduating only the most monastic and single-minded CS enthusiasts), and becoming disillusioned and deciding that CS just isn’t her thing after all. Sure, many of those graduates are excellent job candidates, but then again, how many of those 70% who bailed out or washed out might have stayed in the major and loved it at a school like Northeastern? Obviously nobody here can answer that question, but I think each student needs to take their best shot at finding a program that will get them where they want to go, and will do so for a cost that they can reasonably take on.

As for reputation, it all depends who you ask, in what part of the country and in what generation. @WildestDream , you offer a lot of opinions and advice on these forums, but you are quite reticent about your firsthand experiences beyond working in tech and presumably being a Northwestern grad and/or parent. There are a lot of opinions offered here, and people need context to frame and weigh those opinions appropriately. A midwestern tech person who has always heard of Northeastern as the second-tier commuter school that people get confused with his/her alma mater is not likely to be an evangelist for NEU. People in the areas where NEU has been making inroads as an up-and-coming program may have a different impression. Obviously students and parents need to be realistic - companies do not hire based on the cash value of a degree, and top students from virtually any reputable program can do well - only a very few top schools give a significant “name” edge, and Northeastern isn’t one of those. Since we all know that NU is in that second-tier gray area, it’s good to hear a variety of perspectives about “reputation”; but understanding who those perspectives are coming from and why is a great help in putting together the big-picture “scattergram” of how reputation varies and evolves, and how it should figure into a particular student’s decision.

12

Thank you for the responses guys!
Money is really not a concern for me and my state school isn’t particularly good for CS so out-of-state State schools will be around similar costs to Northeastern.
So far, I’ve been accepted at Northeastern, UIUC, and Purdue. I know UIUC and Purdue are generally more prestigious for CS, but I’m not a big fan of public schools (esp. if im paying out of state tuition) because I assume there are more larger classes, less individualized attention, and weed-out environment as a result.
For some background, I haven’t had any programming experience whatsoever, but I’ve only recently been convinced by my parents to study CS. For this reason, I don’t know if I will be able to handle the competitiveness of UIUC and Purdue because I’d assume it attracts the top CS students with years of experience.
I am attracted to co-op at Northeastern because it will give me a ton of experience with CS.
Now, it comes down to Experience vs Overall better CS prestige.
Any additional insights that will help me make my decision would be greatly appreciated!

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@saltedpeanutz , what are your other areas of interest besides CS? What did you think you would study before your parents convinced you to go for CS? Given that it’s an untested interest, I think you should look at it from both angles - 1) which school will give you the best chance of going from CS novice to successful CS graduate, but also 2) which school offers the best opportunities in your alternative areas of interest, and the greatest ease of mobility if you should choose to make a change? Think about which CS-adjacent fields might interest you (i.e. info science, bioinformatics, applied stats…) and what your greatest areas of interest are, completely outside of CS. (Life sciences? Hard sciences? Social sciences? Humanities? Pre-health? Etc. etc.) What breadth would your CS program have at each school, and what would your path look like into your most likely Plan B?

UIUC and Purdue both have a wealth of great programs. (Neither of my kids ever considered UIUC, so I haven’t looked closely there, but my D who’s considering Northeastern also looked into the Landscape Architecture and Industrial & Interaction Design departments at Purdue - there are a lot of really interesting programs there. Ultimately, for her, Indiana just didn’t fly as a destination, but that’s an individual thing.) One or both might turn out to have something NU doesn’t have, that calls to you as a potential minor, double-major, or alternative major. Do your due diligence in terms of your larger “decision tree,” because your interest in CS seems fairly hypothetical at this point.

Are you thinking of starting out in a straight-CS major at NU, or a combined major? Starting out in a CS+X program might be a good way to keep your options open, as it wouldn’t preclude switching into straight-CS if you decide to go all-in, but it would also let you explore a secondary area of concentration. The ease of mobility among these options is definitely a plus for NU, in my mind, but I don’t know how the specific public U’s you’re considering compare in that regard.

Overall, while the CS departments at your other schools are well-regarded (CCIS Dean Brodley used to teach at Purdue, FWIW), I wouldn’t say the prestige gradient is steep enough one way or another to make a lot of difference - your individual performance and experience gained at the school you choose will far outweigh the reputation factor. (As @WildestDream said, NU’s reputation will not leapfrog you ahead of candidates from good public U’s, but neither will it disadvantage you - it will come down to what you have done with the opportunities at hand.) Focus on setting yourself up for success, for having the range of options that best fits your interests, and where you think you’ll be happiest. Even the fit in terms of extracurriculars is worth considering, because in reality, one club team or music group or Greek organization or whatever your thing is, that really becomes your “tribe”, can end up being the thing that energizes your college experience and helps everything else to flow and fall into place. If more than one school satisfies your academic non-negotiables, those non-academic factors can be perfectly reasonable tiebreakers.

I’m totally rambling, obviously, but hope that helps. :slight_smile:

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@saltedpeanutz

Wow, congrats on all the acceptances! That’s incredibly impressive, and you should do well no matter where you go :slight_smile:

UIUC is one of those schools in that top tier. Purdue more or less falls in with all the other schools being mentioned outside of them, as well as with Northeastern, when it comes to CS prestige/reputation. Given your environmental concerns when it comes to teaching and experience, and the similarities between Purdue and UIUC, I think it would be fair to simplify it down to UIUC vs Northeastern.

I’m a huge advocate for Northeastern, but I would strongly recommend a very close look at UIUC given how known of a program it is. Marginal fit differences probably should be negligible here.

As far as Northeastern, I TA the intro course here, and the teaching approach really does have a great path for introductory students, and co-op will get you experience. UIUC will also get you just as many opportunities though given its strength in CS and how many companies from all over will recruit on campus.

As far as NEU’s CS program, I believe I’ve already linked you to the essay on the program and commented on many of your threads at this point, so I think it’s much more important you look at UIUC closely now.

This part is a bit of a red flag to me. I see this all the time and said students almost never stay in CS. What are your thoughts on CS? Can you try out programming on some online tutorials and see if you enjoy it? How did they convince you? If you aren’t 100% sure you will always be a CS major, I would caution making a school choice based on a particular program, as UIUC is not nearly as strong in many of its programs school outside of CS/Engineering compared to some of your other options.

As far as the rest of the thread, @aquapt put it best in post#10. I had typed up a lengthy post a while ago and then saw it :slight_smile:

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@PengsPhils , do you have a sense of how the CS graduating class at NU compares to the entering class 5 years earlier? What does retention look like for those who start out in CS, and how many eventual graduates started out in something else but switched after taking Fundies as an elective? Are there many fewer graduates than entering majors, or does traffic into the major balance traffic out? I realize there probably aren’t official stats available on this, but I’m curious about your impressions.

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@aquapt

I don’t see the full upper levels in as much depth as I see others, but I can give you what I see in the introductory class, and what I see in my peers as I have gone through :slight_smile:

In the introductory class, it really boils down to a few main archetypes. There are the people that have been coding since they could walk, those that just got into it at the end of high school, those who are trying it out just for the hell of it, those who are doing it for the money, those whose parents told them to major in CS, the ones taking it as an elective, and those as a minor.

The experienced veterans are usually in for a rude awakening since we don’t teach “Programming 1” or “How to Code” like a lot of other schools, and they often struggle to unlearn bad habits. Some take it in full stride, but others struggle through the whole course.

The ones who are trying it new quickly learn if they enjoy it or not, and are actually the top students usually. They commit themselves to learning how to problem solve and design, not just make it work. But for every one of those, there are at least 3 students who realize CS is not for them and usually drop before the W period, or just before that deadline. Interestingly, a good deal of minor and elective students usually end up taking more CS classes. Some of our best TA’s are actually only CS minors. The most frequent to drop are the ones in the “parent told me to” category, which is why I mentioned that as a big red flag. Of course, parents can convince students when they are truly into it as well, so the case really depends.

In the end, I would estimate the Fundies drop rate around 15-20%, more or less equal parts of the following:

  1. Students who took it as an elective, not realizing what class it was. CS1100 is usually better suited for these students, which focuses on complex Excel use, and gives a small taste while also giving useful skills for them.
  2. Students with prior experience who didn't really understand what high-level CS was, and now realize they don't enjoy it truly but like the creation / hacking aspect of it, not the field as a technical discipline.
  3. Students who decided CS was their major for the money or because of their parents and realized it was not for them quickly.
  4. Students who didn't keep up with the class and began to fall behind the content. CS is like a Math class in that it often builds on itself, and missing a week or two of material is a big hole to climb out of.
  5. Students who just didn't enjoy it or have a knack for it.

The cool thing about the introductory program is that it introduces you to pretty much a taste of everything CS in the first semester, and if not in the first year with Fundies 2. So after that initial loss, you don’t find many dropping. A few students switch to the BA or a combined degree, or a concentration in another area like game design or interactive media, but in general the major slowly grows as people switch in. I don’t think it’s nearly enough to even out the initial loss, so I would estimate the CS class size shrinks by 10-15% probably.

Fundies 1 is a really unique class because it manages to treat those without experience equal to those with experience, yet still cover a lot of the subject in a no-nonsense way. I link to this tirelessly, but for others who haven’t seen, this is the best summary of the program out there:

http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/matthias/Thoughts/Growing_a_Programmer.html

I believe both the OP and @aquapt have seen this, so sorry for the repost for them.

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I agree with #4 and #5 above. My daughter took Fundies one (her last semester as an elective) - she really enjoyed the class and did excellent. The homework assignments were done in pairs (they rotated partners during the semester - so she had 4 or 5 different partners over the course of the semester) I think all her homework partners were freshman (so most likely looking to major in CS.) They were either lost (just couldn’t get a handle on the concepts) or overwhelmed (fell behind at some point during the semester and couldn’t catch up or were swamped with work in other classes so they skipped some of the Fundies work and then couldn’t catch up). She basically ended up writing every line of code for every homework for the entire semester. I am not meaning to scare anybody from CS but want to emphasis it is not for everybody and it is going to require hard work!

That being said - if you are successful in CS at NEU, you should graduate with solid co-op experience and a good post- graduation job!

18

Thank you so much, @PengsPhils - that is super helpful!!

I definitely recognize my D in your demographics: she is the classic “just got into it at the end of high school” kid. She never saw herself as a “hacker” type - I convinced her to take AP CompSci over Stats (conflicting “singleton” classes) to get her feet wet and see for herself whether CS might be a path to consider. She applied to NU as an Urban Landscape major, but by the time EA decisions came back, she had decided she definitely wanted a major with a CS piece (which at NU would be a CS+X - at some of her other schools it would more likely be in the form of a computation-heavy CogSci program). But this AP class is a mixed bag for sure. It has solidified her interest, which counts for a lot, but as you say, she will have bad habits galore to be shed. The teacher is a lovely person who is passionate about creating opportunities for the kids at our majority-URM school, but has little CS background herself and honestly could not code her way out of a paper bag. There are very bright kids in this class who are struggling mightily, and they are alternately frustrated with the teacher (who has no intuitive understanding of the material at all) and with my D (who is acing the class on raw intuition but can’t explain to her friends how she knows what will work).

Obviously, the raw intuition approach to CS will hit a wall before long, without a more disciplined foundation. But I’m still hoping that her “knack”, and her newfound love for the elegance of CS as a way of thinking, will hold up through the more rigorous experience of a course like Fundies, and that the bad habits won’t be too entrenched. I have indeed read the “Growing a Programmer” article, and it definitely resonated with my own experience - my sense is that if my first CS course had been taught this way, back in the day, it might not have been my last!

By the same token, I can easily picture my D’s still-nascent interest in the field being snuffed out early by an overly hacker-ish or hyper-competitive “weed-out” environment at a less novice-friendly school. I obviously can’t say whether she’d stay in CS at NU, but if she didn’t, I would have reasonable confidence that she had given it a fair chance and wouldn’t have stayed in it at any other school either. Whereas if she veered away from CS at a school like UW Seattle, that washes people out of CS in droves, I would always wonder if a program that was more supportive in the early stages would have made the difference.

Anyway, @saltedpeanutz , I hope these thoughts are at least a little relevant to you and that I’m not just hijacking your thread. :slight_smile:

One last question, @PengsPhils - how worthwhile do you think the CCIS presentation at the Welcome Day is? I know those events are nice for drumming up enthusiasm for the school and camaraderie among the admitted students… but does it really impart insight into the merits of the program, that can’t be acquired in other ways? As seriously as my D is considering Northeastern, we’re both ambivalent about traveling all the way from CA for this.

Thanks again!!

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Thank you all for the insightful comments!
@aquapt A lot of your questions are the same ones that I have, so feel free to ask as much as you want :slight_smile:
@PengsPhils My parents didn’t convince me to study CS in a forceful way or anything. They showed me what kinda stuff they do at work (they both are software engineers) it seems like something that I would enjoy doing, so I am pretty sure I will stick with CS.
I’m a bit concerned with WildestDream’s comment that Northeastern isn’t particularly strong for STEM. I am definitely leaning to Northeastern, but I need some convincing reasons. What are some advantages that Northeastern CS offers that UIUC doesn’t? What kind of student should choose NEU and what kind should choose UIUC? How do class sizes compare?

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@saltedpeanutz , there will be people, especially from my generation, who are dismissive of NU. It has beefed up its programs and attracted a very competitive student body in recent years. There are plenty of examples of STEM students who have gone on to great jobs and grad schools. But in my day (speaking as someone who studied at both MIT and BU), it was considered lightweight by comparison, whether that was fair or not, and that reputation still lingers. There are folks who will argue that NU has grown so competitive, not because of the quality of its programs, but just because so many students want the Boston college experience. Obviously that’s a factor - if you put NU where Purdue is, it would not be attracting the same applicant pool. But it’s also clear that NU’s rise in the rankings reflects a real investment in programs, faculty, and infrastructure. There is substance as well as marketing and “location, location, location” - in what proportion, people on CC are happy to debate at length - you be the judge.

You have to decide for yourself and not be overly swayed by any one person’s opinion. Opinions that are informed by direct experience are obviously valuable, and @PengsPhils is extremely generous with his time on these forums. As far as I know, he’s not getting a commission for increasing NU’s yield :wink: , so it’s not really his job to convince you - I think he’s articulated his perspective very thoroughly. If you want counter-perspective, you’ll have no trouble finding people on the forums who are transferring out of NU and who will tell you why they were disappointed. Same will be true for every school you consider. “YMMV” is the name of the game.