I feel like if I get into college, I might not go to class

Parents Forum
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<p>Okay, I'm a high school senior, but I'm posting this here because I want advice from parents.</p>

<p>I'm a really good student, A's in AP classes, 2300+ SAT, etc.</p>

<p>I do expect to go to a top university/LAC this fall (I'm done applying), but I just recently came to terms with the fact that I have a peculiar learning "disability"</p>

<p>You see, I can't pay attention in class. At all. I'm usually a very low-energy/distracted/day-dreaming person in general, but it's simply terrible in school. </p>

<p>I cannot remember the last time I learned something of substance in class. When the teacher starts lecturing, my attention simply DIES. Sometimes I entertain myself with fanciful fantasies, but most of the time I become lethargic and nap.</p>

<p>I thought maybe I was just not an "audial" learner (I do get bored when people talk in other situations), but I realized this can't be the cause entirely. When the teacher begins talking formally, it's like they're speaking a different language. I try, but I cannot follow or comprehend their words (OR their chalkboard illustrations) for longer than a few minutes. It's like they're communicating in a foreign language. As such, I'm literally "bored to tears".</p>

<p>However, I do understand the material when I try to learn it on my own. Though it requires painful effort (the concentrating and getting to work part), I CAN manage to read the textbook after I get home from school and do very well on tests and such; just don't ask me to participate in class.</p>

<p>It's so bad that sometimes I copy the teacher's notes verbatim without trying to comprehend a word that she's saying because it sounds like high-tech gibberish. Then, I go back and reread my notes to myself and everything seems to click.</p>

<p>This also has nothing to do with me having no interest in the subject. For example, I can sit at my computer and read news articles for hours, but my eyelids droop immediately when my gov teacher starts talking about current events.</p>

<p>I know it's a little too late because I've already applied to colleges, but I just recently took the time to self-analyze myself a bit, and this peculiarity took a long time for me to recognize because it's been so natural to me all these years.</p>

<p>So what do you guys think? I can easily see myself just not going to class, let alone participating or providing insightful discussion on the spot.</p>

<p>I know I'm very intelligent, but I'm just INSANELY JEALOUS of my classmates who can go from class to class being fully awake, fully alert, taking notes, answering questions, and thinking critically throughout the day instead of requiring short bursts of brilliance at the end of the day.</p>

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<p>I sincerely suggest you have a psychologist evaluate you for possible learning disabilities, especially inattentive type ADHD. You could be just bored or you could have an LD that might be helped by either medication or behavior modification. There are lots of tips and tricks for kids who have trouble focusing in class. Look on Amazon for books on ADHD and college students... even if you do not have ADHD, it sounds like you may be helped by some of the same strategies ADHD kids use. If you are diagnosed, sign up with the Disabled Student's Program at the college you attend so you can take advantage of whatever help they offer (It varies from school to school). Skipping class will be the kiss of death for you and will lead to poor grades/possible dismissal from the college. You might arrange for someone reliable you trust to be your "accountability partner." They would check in with you on a weekly basis to see if you are doing what you intended to do that week and will follow your class syllabi and ask you how you are progressing. In any case, college is much better than high school (according to my kids) so you may find it easier to pay attention there. Good luck!</p>

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<p>You may find yourself in college in classes copying down word for word, what the prof says, and going over it later. I know I did that in classes where the profs' voices tended to lull me to sleep. Anything like this can be dealt with, as long as you're willing to take the extra steps... I don't know if it's a learning disability or not, but I think it's something you can deal with.</p>

<p>With your intelligence level and grades/SAT to prove it, you may just be incredibly bored. Even in AP courses, you've been treated like a high school kid. College is different--really. Hopefully, wherever you choose to go will give you credit for the AP exams you've taken, and you'll have fewer required general ed courses. Once you get into tougher classes, in areas you're really interested in, things will probably pick up for you, too.</p>

<p>All this said, way back when, my H took 3 different Calculus courses in college with the same prof. He couldn't stay awake in there. He moved to the front row, directly in front of the prof's lectern, and still fell asleep. He still got A's in there...</p>

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<p>I had the same problems all during my undergrad education and continuing into my graduate studies. I use the same strategy you do of just copying down everything the professor does in order to force myself to stay awake. It only gets to be a real problem when they stop scribbling formulas on the board and doing all these hand-waving arguments. I'm in a really technical field and it makes me worry about the future when I'll be attending a lot more technical conferences and, unlike in class, it'll be considered a lot more rude to fall asleep.</p>

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<p>is this a new thing or has it been going on all through HS....</p>

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<p>Sounds like my son. A 'diagnosis' of ADD (if that is your case) often is delayed in very smart kids, boys usually. At age 21 on the downswing of his college education a psychologist gave him the news, not terribly surprising. When you're going through grade and high school with good grades, and high test scores, the last thing people, even in your own family, suspect is you may have any type of learning problem.</p>

<p>One major difference between hs and college...my son told me on average he WOKE UP somewhere around lunch time. Hardly remembered anything that happened the first half of the day. In college he was diligent in scheduling later classes, no early AM classes. Said night classes actually were by far the best...he was awake. You may be a natural night owl---typical hs schedules work counter to your body clock if that's the case. It was a major consideration for my son.</p>

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<p>There have only been a few posts before mine, but you've already received some excellent advice. The only thing I'll add is a suggestion that you focus on LAC's when finally selecting your school. A LAC is most likely to hold you accountable for attendance (important even if all you're doing is copying the lecture word for word), and you shouldn't have many (if any) classes where you sit in a lecture hall and listen to someone drone. Depending on your major, you might have a lot of discussion based courses. Discussion set-ups might not eliminate your problem, but they could improve things...lots of different people talking, never having to listen to one person for too long, less formal, often less rigidly structured. The difficulty I have in lectures doesn't seem as serious as yours, but I'm definitely prone to zoning out (and occasionally falling asleep), even when I'm interested. Discussion-based courses keep me on the ball, even when I'm bored out of my mind :p Then again, you say "just don't ask me to participate," and a LAC is also probably more likely than a larger uni to factor participation into your final grades (although I suspect that professors would be willing to work with you to make sure you weren't punished for having a different learning style).</p>

<p>To be clear, I don't mean to imply anything negative about larger universities. I know that you could find small and/or discussion-based courses there, too. I just suspect that a LAC, generally known for giving lots of personal attention both inside and outside the classroom, might be the best learning environment for you. </p>

<p>If this doesn't end up being an attractive or realistic option, it's clear that you're a very capable student and I'm sure that you'll succeed wherever you go. I do hope that you're able to figure out what's going on...ease your path a bit! Best of luck :)</p>

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<p>It's a little late, but you might want to re-evaluate your college choices -- even consider a gap year. Maybe you would learn best at a college that emphasizes cooperative learning or project-based learning, giving you plenty of opportunities for independent research. Alternatively.... you might just want to choose a place where class attendance is not mandatory --at many larger universities, the lectures are videotaped and can be viewed online later on. </p>

<p>I have a learning style very similar to yours, and quite frankly I skipped class a lot when the profs were not able to engage my attention. I ultimately went to a top law school and there were some classes that I probably attended less than 10% of the time -- of course, the content of law school courses is fairly standardized, so I could use other resources to cover the material. </p>

<p>I think it is great that you are evaluating your own learning style and considering its impact on your studies. Keep this in mind when you decide on a college in the spring -- the most prestigious schools may not be the best fits academically. </p>

<p>I'd note that even though I cut class a lot I had pretty good grades-- I did generally keep up with reading and I attended classes that were more engaging. It really wasn't an all-or-nothing proposition -- it came down to specific teachers or profs. So one other piece of advice is to choose your college courses by the profs who teach them, even if it means deviating from a planned major.</p>

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<p>People commonly suggest small LAC's to ADHD type kids so they will be held more accountable in small, intimate classes. As the parent of ADHD kids, I can honestly say that was the last thing they were looking for. They needed the ability to get lost a little when they needed to and to not have professors breathing down their neck like in high school. For some, the pressure brings out a better performance and they should seek it out, but for others, like my oldest son who chose a huge academic school, they like to choose how involved they are in class on any given day. I remember when I was in college, I would feel terrible if I missed my Chaucer class because I knew the professor would be talking to herself with no one to participate. That got me to class a few times when I would rather have skipped so perhaps I would have been a good candidate for a smaller LAC. Figure out what type of motivation/pressure you work best with and choose accordingly.</p>

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<p>There are also little "tricks" that ADHD kids are taught to help them concentrate. One is excercise before you need to concentrate (jog/run to class) rather than relax. Another is chewing gum or sucking on a hard candy - something about the oral stimulation helps concentration. </p>

<p>I would think, though, if you could get As on tests and such high SAT scores without losing focus on the exams that there may be an issue other than ADHD.</p>

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<p>Hey I appreciate all the responses</p>

<p>Right now, I am unwilling to get myself tested for ADD/ADHD because the last thing I want is to answer a few subjective questions and take a bunch of pills (I have an irrational fear of mood-altering substances, such that I often avoid large amounts of sugar even)</p>

<p>Do I think I have ADD/ADHD? Nope, not unless you can somehow acquire it. As a little kid, I was years ahead of my classmates in term of concentration and focus, so I wasn't always like this. The only clear explanation for my deterioration is that school lost its sense of awe and urgency, and I no longer felt it was an absolute imperative to pay attention all the time. So basically I grew up.</p>

<p>Someone mentioned SAT's and tests... yes I can concentrate on things that I already know. I can pay attention pretty well on review days too. It's just the initial barrier of learning new information that I get sucked into a comatose daze for. So no I'm not a genius who knows everything already.</p>

<p>I really am torn about the university/LAC decision, though. I don't know how I'll react in each scenario, and while I do want to start being active in discussions (again I seriously envy people who can be on the ball all the time), I do need a lot of private time to myself</p>

<p>Projects? Co-ops? Nah, I'm not particularly fond of labs, so my best learning style is probably:</p>

<p>Isolated, un-pressured, slow reading of textbook for 25% of the time
Laid-back rumination and digestion of material for 75% of the time</p>

<p>Is this just chronic laziness? Sometimes I feel like maybe I'm just too lazy to think fast enough to understand the lectures. If anyone could shed more light on this type of personality, that'd be great. All I know is I'm a slow-reacting thinking-type person who finds it hard to make decisions quickly. Oh, and I'm a hardcore procrastinator.</p>

<p>Racin and Calmom, I'm very interested in hearing more of how this affected you in college (and even other areas of your life?), especially since I plan on going to law school.</p>

<p>I'm not worried about failing college or anything; it's just that after 4 years of plodding along and wasting my potential, I really want to SUCCEED. But old habits are hard to break.</p>

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<p>You really do need to go to class in college because many college professors do not follow the textbook when they lecture, as high school teachers often do. You are likely to be held responsible BOTH for the content of the lectures and for the (different) content of the textbook.</p>

<p>Your strategy of simply writing stuff down during class without attempting to understand it and then trying to understand the material later when you read over your notes is a perfectly valid one. I did the same thing all through college and ended up with a 3.8 GPA. Some people simply can't assimilate the content of a lecture and write stuff down at the same time. That's OK.</p>

<p>I don't think there's necessarily anything "wrong" with you. People have different styles when it comes to what works best for them when doing academic work. Yours is different from your friends'.</p>

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<p>Marian:</p>

<p>I do agree that I'll probably be "fine" in college if I continue what I'm doing now. But I do want a bit more.</p>

<p>For example, I realized that if I could get by by skimming the textbook a night or two before the test (even skimming would take me hours because 75% of the time is spent in idle thought or getting food), I could probably have saved myself so much TIME by just paying attention in class. Furthermore, how am I supposed to develop any meaningful connections with professors/classmates when I'm clueless until test day?</p>

<p>Also, what about in the professional world? Sure, taking notes and getting ready for a test will work fine in a college setting, but I think it would be rather hard to find this scenario anywhere else. People who are quick to learn, quick to internalize the information, and quick to act on new knowledge will have an enormous innate advantage, no?</p>

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<p>People who can get 2300+ on the SAT and who can get As in AP classes also have innate advantages.</p>

<p>They're just different innate advantages.</p>

<p>People's heads are screwed on differently, that's all. </p>

<p>When I was in college, somebody started a huge discussion one night by asking the seemingly simple question, "Which did you find easier in high school, algebra or geometry?" Almost everyone had an instant, definite answer to that question (with about 2/3 saying algebra and 1/3 saying geometry). The more we talked about it, the more we realized that the "algebra" people had one mental style and the "geometry" people had a different one -- and that this difference was also reflected in which types of college courses each group had found to be easy or difficult, in the way that they write, and even in their career aspirations and hobbies. </p>

<p>I mention this simply to illustrate that there are different mental styles. One isn't better or worse than another. They're just different.</p>

<p>You may be able to help yourself have a better college experience, though, if you force a certain degree of self-discipline on yourself. For example, you may benefit by doing the reading before you go to class (if the professor gives out the syllabus in advance, which most do). That way, when you're in lectures, you only have to write down the stuff that wasn't in the reading. Also, since you've already been exposed to some of the material, you may find it easier to actually understand what the professor is saying, instead of spending all of your time just copying stuff.</p>

<p>Also, once you're in college, you probably won't be able to get away with skimming the textbook the night before the test. The quantity of material covered on college tests is too large for that. (Many college courses have only three tests in a semester, and a semester course in college typically covers as much material as a year course in high school.) So you're going to need to be disciplined about doing the reading (including reading your notes) over a period of time, not all in one night.</p>

<p>And if you want to develop connections with professors, the best way to do it is to go to the professor's office hours and ask questions about anything that you're confused about in the lectures or readings. If you want to make connections with classmates, try to find people to study with. Some people find that forming a study group is helpful because it forces them to prepare for the study group's meeting so that they don't embarrass themselves. Not looking like a jackass is very good motivation. Other people find study groups to be an utterly worthless waste of time, though -- but you won't know until you try.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
You see, I can't pay attention in class. At all. I'm usually a very low-energy/distracted/day-dreaming person in general, but it's simply terrible in school.

[/quote]
wow, that's like...me...completely</p>

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<p>I'm sure boredom has a lot to do with it. Have you ever had a truly dynamic teacher, where you genuinely wanted to pay attention in class?</p>

<p>What do you plan on studying in college? Any idea? </p>

<p>I assume you don't have an academic passion for one single area in particular?</p>

<p>I wonder if things will be different once you start taking classes in something that truly interests you, or when you're pushed by classmates who are all smart like you.</p>

<p>I mentioned you remind me of my son. LAC wouldn't have worked for him imo. I shudder to think how many classes he probably cut in college, but he did fine, graduated 2 yrs ago. Work just seems to be different for him. I worried about that transition and I think he did too. Maybe it's just that he isn't sitting there listening to someone drone on...he is, by necessity, thinking and doing all through the day as far as I can tell. Seems happier, just misses the social aspect of college.</p>

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<p>First, I second all of this:</p>

<p>
[quote]
And if you want to develop connections with professors, the best way to do it is to go to the professor's office hours and ask questions about anything that you're confused about in the lectures or readings. If you want to make connections with classmates, try to find people to study with. Some people find that forming a study group is helpful because it forces them to prepare for the study group's meeting so that they don't embarrass themselves. Not looking like a jackass is very good motivation. Other people find study groups to be an utterly worthless waste of time, though -- but you won't know until you try.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Second, when it comes to the LAC/uni decision, is there any way that you can squeeze in some campus visits before May 1? Even if you can't make it to the campuses you applied to, but can make it to a semi-local LAC and larger university, it might benefit you to sit in on classes at each. The admissions office should be able to help you select a "normal" style course. The set-up won't be perfectly representative, but maybe it'll help you get a feel for what you like (since some of us have said that we'd look for accountability and discussion, others have said the exact opposite!).</p>

<p>Finally, out of curiosity, do you have any idea what you'd like to study in college? Topic could make some difference in how much (or little) trouble your learning style brings about. Then again, as with the LAC/uni debate, I can think of major perks and pitfalls to most subjects, so maybe it's irrelevant. (ETA: cross-post).</p>

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<p>You are getting great advice on coping skills for something you may or may not have: a learning disability (coupled with giftedness) which might or might not be combined with ADD. </p>

<p>One of my kids had some of your attributes and got all the way to sophomore year (at a top LAC) before a half dozen peers said, "go home and get tested for ADD." The psychologist found not only ADD but a great big learning disability. This kid claims the diagnosis was a huge epiphany, solving a cognitive dissonance, answering teacher laments...boosting self-esteem... (Why am I so smart and acting so dumb?)</p>

<p>Learning disability is different from ADD. Subtasks on an IQ test can tell you if some parts of your brain are overcompensating for others. An LD means more than a 20-point gap in some subtasks although in general your IQ is very high (hence the SAT scores).</p>

<p>You might be wearing yourself OUT by all the brain compensating going on in class; hence the fatigue. </p>

<p>If you have a bona fide LD, you might be entitled to a note-taker in college, or time-and-a-half for tests, or other accommodations to do your best work, which WILL get harder than at h.s.</p>

<p>If you also have ADD, a doctor might prescribe medications, which is your choice to take or not.</p>

<p>Two different, but possibly overlapping diagnoses.</p>

<p>My advice, in addition to listening to everything these wise parents are saying, is use this time now to get tested by a capable adult psychologist who knows something about adult ADD and learning disabilities. It's up to you how you handle the results. </p>

<p>This kid of mine was under much less stress once the brain wiring was better understood by us all. I'm only sorry as a parent that I missed it. There was so much intelligence there the situation was masked until SOPHOMORE YEAR of college. Yeesh.</p>

<p>IF you proceed correctly, should you choose to, the testing might be covered by your health insurance already. A family doctor could recommend, or you could find a psychologist and bring the name you find to the attention of your family doctor for a referral.</p>

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<p>Yeah, i'm a high schooler with the same problem and like you it hasn't really affected me. I literally do nothing during calculus, history, english, and language except maybe copy down notes if i'm really motivated. I've maintained A's in 8 Ap's the last two year's scoring 5's on the ap tests (i do work at home). I sorta know why now though... 1) I'm right brained (ironic considering my math level) and have no interst in the material. Right brained people listen to "how" people are talking instead of "what" people are saying. This couple with apathy in a subject renders half my periods useless...</p>

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<p>paying 3 tuitions</p>

<p>Do you mind if I ask what type of LD your child was diagnosed with? My son has the same problems being discussed here. He gets decent grades only because he does well on tests. He does absolutely nothing in class and says everything is completely boring. We had him tested and he was diagnosed with inattentive type ADD and is on medication. The medication has helped some, but he continues to be unmotivated, lazy and unorganized. I'm not sure how he will do in college if we don't find something else to help him.<br>
He cannot seem to tolerate homework or studying for more than a few minutes and then he has to walk away from it usually to never go back.
He acts like he doesn't care about school sometimes, but deep down I think he is frustrated that he is not able to do what other students around him can even though he is very smart.
After your child was diagnosed with the LD what has been done to help him to turn things around?</p>