I need some advice...

Pre-College Issues Summer Programs
1

<p>I'm currently a sophomore with very little research experience, if any. My school does not offer a research class. I am currently applying to high school programs set up to allow students create their own independent projects, papers, presentations, etc. But the only problem is it that they take up a large bulk of my summer. I want to participate in Forensics Speech workshops, as well as some journalism workshops as well. Science is my main passion, but I also have other interests I'd like to pursue. Some of these high school internships go way into August, leaving no room for anything else. And besides, won't my chances getting accepted to say NIH or HSHSP as a sophomore with no experience be very, very slim? I'm taking AP Bio, Psych, and Enviro, and have completed Chem and Bio Honors, but I don't think I have a profound background as of now. Should I hold off until next year, with a full internship under my belt, some more standardized test scores, and a more solid resume? (Also take note that participating in the forensics speech workshop would greatly improve my forensics).</p>

<p>I'm about to email some professors in the local area. Provided that one of them is willing to work with me, my schedule will be so much more flexible and I can begin right after my exams and end right before all my journalism/speech camps start. However, my concern is this: Since they barely even know me and I have little experience, I'm guessing the most I can do this summer is learn with the professor, help out around the lab, and basically take the b*tchwork off their shoulders. I'll gain some insight into the whole researching process, laboratory environment, and gain some ideas for future projects. My only concern is whether or not I just pursue this, will it be better to have my own independent research? I'm planning on doing a full-out 8 week structured, research paper yaddayadda in my summer before senior year, and then submitting it to fairs, contests, Intel/Siemens, etc etc., regardless.</p>

<p>In a nutshell...</p>

<p>Proposed Summer Schedule A
-June 10th-July 24th Research Internship (not independent) 7 weeks
-July 25th-August 7th Stanford National Forensics Institute 2 weeks
-And after August 7th, hopefully I'll be able to do 1-2 weeks of Journalism workshops.
-Shadowing local doctors/surgeons/journalists and possibly writing for local newspapers</p>

<p>Proposed Summer Schedule B
-End of June - End of July/Beginning of August High School Summer Research Program** 7-8 weeks
-If the internship ends at the end of July, I might be able to do one workshop. Probably not.
-Possibility of shadowing doctors/surgeons/journalists. Would be limited to a span of 2 weeks.</p>

<p>**This is basically a set up, independent research program. </p>

<p>As a sophomore, there probably aren't that many availabilities. Should I apply anyway, see what happens, and still contact professors? What should I do this summer?</p>

2

<p>Rebumps. :P</p>

3

<p>Don’t start all at once now.</p>

4

<p>Do you not want any downtime? You’re a sophomore–pick one thing to do this summer for several weeks or a few of the one/two week institute/workshop things, and then enjoy your time off! I spent six weeks at camp this year, which I loved, but the summer before, I spent 3 weeks at camp, one week on a mission trip, and one week on vacation. The summer with scattered activities was soooo much more exhausting (even though it actually took up less time–5 weeks versus 6). </p>

<p>Moral of the story: Bouncing from summer opportunity to summer opportunity isn’t going to allow you to recharge for the school year. Pick which EC is most important to you–science, I assume–and pursue that avidly with whichever research opportunity most interests you. Leave the supplementary ECs for the school year. (You can learn an awful lot about debating just by exploiting the Internet, watching past Nats, etc.) </p>

<p>Remember: Just as colleges don’t want a laundry list of ECs, they don’t want kids who’ve been to every summer camp imaginable to bolster their app. Let them see you through your application by keeping your summers clearly focused on your most significant interest.</p>

5

<p>Yes, I understand that, but by going to the forensics camp (it’s for speech, not debate) I’ll get proper coaching and training… something that’s not available at my school, really. We don’t really have a well organized team, and going to the speech camp would help me tremendously. I’d have a shot at winning more tournaments, and doing better at larger ones as well. If I’m going to list forensics as one of my extracurriculars, why not try to add more substance and accomplishment to it? Likewise, I really like journalism and writing… and I’m most likely going to be Editor in Chief for the school newspaper next year. I want to try to transform our newspaper into a more regular, well organized, and structured one and hopefully submit it to Quill and Scroll. And of course in 11th grade I’m going to spend the entire summer dedicated to a single hardcore research project, which would show that I do have a strong interest in science. Helping a professor and maybe experimenting on my own for seven weeks is still a substantial amount of time dedicated to my passion for science… (Note, I’m not saying I won’t do an independent project, it’s just that the likelihood of it happening is probably less than if I go to HSHSP-type programs). I’m going to just apply to all of them and send out emails, and see what happens. Chances are I’ll probably get rejected from the programs anyways.</p>

6

<p>In that case, why not just focus on the speech institute and journalism workshops and use your remaining time to brainstorm and start reorganizing the paper? You can study for the SAT as well. </p>

<p>Just know you can spend your summer well without attaching the title of a thousand camps to it.</p>

7

<p>But I’d have no scientific experience? Doing 2 camps and 1 internship is not a lot at all, dont you think?</p>

8

<p>If you’re doing this to bolster your app, I think you have the wrong mindset. Quality over quantity! Over the summer, plenty of people simply stay at home and get jobs (an experience considered perfectly acceptable by adcoms–indeed, many say it shows initiative and hard work). Others spend anywhere from a day to a week to eight weeks at camp or interning. </p>

<p>Some students engage in myriad summer activities, but it’s certainly not expected of you and won’t put you behind the ball for admissions. In fact, focusing on a zillion summer activities can backfire. You should look passionate and involved to adcoms, but they know that you’re human. You should do as many or as few activities this summer as you can truly devote yourself to. Personally, I would limit this to one internship or the debate/journalism combo and put the rest of the summer to use–relaxation and preparation for the year ahead. You don’t want it to look like mommy and daddy paid your way into every summer camp imaginable just to pad your app.</p>

9

<p>I don’t mean to sound rude or anything, I appreciate you’re input, I really do, but I would like to interject…</p>

<p>By journalism camps I mean ones I don’t have to pay for. They’re one week seminars that train you… I’m doing this out of pure interest, not necessarily to pad an application. They don’t cost anything except the airfare to get there. </p>

<p>For forensics, yes it’s a couple thousand dollars, but who says I’m doing it to say I spent my summer doing it? I’m doing it to improve my speaking skills, which may or may not show in the following year. I’m not doing this solely to put it on a college application. I’m probably only going to say I did my internship. But the information and experience I gain from going to the journalism/speaking camps will be just as valuable, but in a different way. And spending 3 weeks of my summer going to two camps is, at least in my opinion, not a valuable use of time.</p>

10

<p>I think you should apply to 1-2 research programs that you like, and also email some professors. If you get into the programs, you can decide then whether you want to attend or not. They often have waiting lists in case people opt out. Plus the chances are very slim, but it doesn’t hurt to apply.</p>

<p>if you do independent research, (this depends on the field) 7 weeks may or may not be enough time. I know alot of programs are that long, but they only provide a limited scope of research that can actually be done, particularly in fields like bio. So maybe do the research at a local lab, and ask the prof. if “independent” research is feasible, because you would really like to do some. If it isn’t, you’ll still gain a ton of valuable lab experience, and learn alot. actually, I did some “independent research” in about that much time (8-9 weeks I believe). It was very focused and small, but it was still great. And I say “independent” because I was still learning- the first 2-3 weeks in the lab I was learning how to use all the stuff.</p>

<p>I frankly don’t see a problem with your proposed schedules at all. Just apply to everything you’re interested in at this point, and decide once your options are set in stone (this is generally my philosophy to life…haha)</p>

<p>good luck!</p>

11

<p>Honestly, this is exactly the problem with the college application process these days! This kid is truly interested in pursuing all of these areas - and has the time management skills, the financial resources and the pure talent to do it. But instead of using his/her teenage summers to improve valuable skills and explore many different pursuits, thereby helping to narrow down his/her true interests, he is being encouraged to choose based on creating a successful college app! UGH. Truly frustrating and not at all reflective of the true pursuit of knowledge the schools say they are looking for but really can’t seem to discern in a college app.</p>

12

<p>:P Thanks for the nice post bff, but you’re making it sound like doing a 7 week learning internship isn’t really impressive. And the journalism camps are all-paid for, so if I get accepted to one of them… they’re still fairly prestigious.</p>

13

<p>Stoompy, can you possibly look for an after school internship in the fall of your junior year? Sounds like newspaper & speech are big extracurriculars for you. At our school, those do not have big after school commitments on most days Speech practices are whenever you schedule individual time with the coaches, most tournaments are on weekends. And newspaper is a class, with after school/evening time a few days a month when a deadline is looming. I realize that if you have other activities (sports or drama, for example), or already have a job, this suggestion might not work.</p>

<p>So maybe you could look for something late in the summer with a professor for the fall. Esp. if you are willing to do it unpaid.</p>

<p>Then you could be lined up for next summer to do something more substantial with the prof when you can devote more time.</p>

<p>I’m just thinking of that old adage for working moms :slight_smile: You can have it all, just not all at the same time.</p>