<p>I don't see why bio, physics, ES, chem majors etc have such a hard time finding a job. Science is the future and science is the only way we'll advance. I understand that a BS won't get you very far, but I refuse to believe that there are people with PhDs and masters in certain science degrees that can't find jobs in their field. It just seems ridiculously stupid.</p>
<p>Biology graduates have trouble finding jobs in biology because there are so many biology graduates relative to the number of (good and even not so good) biology jobs. Biology is the most popular major at many schools.</p>
<p>What ucbalumnus said. Postdocs were invented decades ago to delay entry into professorship, so that PhDs would have some sort of research job without there being new tenure-track positions with the related salaries, administrative and teaching duties and perks. Now in fields like biology there are plenty of people doing one postdoc after another, and it is expected to do a postdoc before getting a “real” research position. My colleagues in pure math were surprised that our open position in statistics attracted so many finishing PhD candidates without a postdoc because it is one of the rare fields where there are plenty of jobs for PhDs outside of academia, and so postdocs are not yet the norm. Elsewhere, the number of PhDs far outweights the number jobs available. An acquaintance of mine, with a PhD in marine biology, is now teaching in high school (and he’s almost lucky to have that job, because there are plenty of education graduates looking for jobs; the list of substitute teachers for the public schools in this city has at least 900 people in it, for those who want to join…).</p>
<p>ETA: my PhD supervisor was reminding me how few of the pure and applied math PhDs in the last 15 years from my alma mater actually ended up working in academia (usually in not so great universities), or doing research altogether. No such problem in statistics, my classmates who did not get a research position at a university are those who didn’t want to stay in academia, and probably make more money working for companies Google and Bell Labs.</p>
<p>[Chemical</a> Jobs Disappear | Latest News | Chemical & Engineering News](<a href=“http://pubs.acs.org/cen/news/87/i15/8715news1.html]Chemical”>http://pubs.acs.org/cen/news/87/i15/8715news1.html)</p>
<p>@ucbalumnus Actually Psychology is the most common major, but Biology is definitely a very common one too…</p>
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In fairness, science is pretty much a solved problem. All that remains is to find more significant digits. Kids make more money on Wall Street than in labs. I blame the people who cancelled Beakman’s World.</p>
<p>@aegrisomnia That is so not true! There are SOOO many things that we do not know about or have yet to discover. Every time we learn something new, more and more questions arise. I couldn’t tell you how many times my Bio Professor said, “Last year, this wasn’t on the PowerPoint slide.” or “We still do not know why this is.”</p>
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That’s because science majors can’t <em>do</em> very much. Change bio, physics, chemistry and math to biomedical engineering, mechanical engineering, chemical engineering and electrical engineering (or operations research or finance or statistics or…) and you are looking at an entirely different ball game.</p>
<p>Basically Businesses have no respect for scientists. They see them as an expense to be minimized rather than a member of the team. Companies pay them worse than almost any other function even Human Resources. Now a days they found a way to deprive them of benefits even by hiring through temp agencies and using them to dodge employer laws.</p>
<p>There is a good reason why the majority of science graduates don’t persue science jobs and most of the rest dump the field within 5 years of graduating. The field is simply does not pay a living wage and certainly not a wage commensurate with the education and intelligence that are prerequisites. Rather than address this companies whine to congress for more scabs from India via the H1b program or just ship the job to China or India.</p>
<p>I sincerely regret getting my science degrees and will certainly never allow anyone in my family to study it again.</p>
<p>Just curious sschoe2, what degree(s) would you recommend?</p>
<p>Bio/chem only as a prerequisite for med, pharm, dental or other professional school definately not science graduate degree or science + education.</p>
<p>Accounting/finance/economics</p>
<p>HR-those who can’t add value to a company live in HR and are paid well (too well).</p>
<p>The trades are better than chemistry go vocational plumbing, electrical welding etc…</p>
<p>Actuary-</p>
<p>Engineering there are still some nice salaries in engineering especially if you are willing to relocate.</p>
<p>Nursing-again you may need to live in a rural area due to saturation in cities with a lot of colleges.</p>
<p>Any thoughts on Geology? It seems it would have many corporate and govt applications, and I’m guessing it’s a niche that isn’t over saturated?</p>
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<p>Isn’t this exactly what’s causing the problem with too many bio/chem graduates? People do it as a major prior to professional school, but then wind up not having the grades or losing the interest, so you get a glut of people with those degrees.</p>
<p>Perhaps so but Biochemistry is probably the most relevant major for medicine and pharmacy. You will enter the program better prepared and it will take pressure off you.</p>
<p>Great article on choosing a college major, and it does not lean towards “practical” majors.</p>
<p>[How</a> Art History Majors Power the U.S. Economy: Virginia Postrel - Bloomberg](<a href=“Bloomberg - Are you a robot?”>Bloomberg - Are you a robot?)</p>
<p>SS, so then why don’t people who don’t want to enter the field of science, just not major in it. All you need are the pre-req courses. This way it lessens the supply and opens the doors for us who truly want to do research. Common sense supply and demand. The professional school’s don’t give a crap what you majored in, as long as you have pre-req courses. Sometimes the stupidity of the people in this country irks me.</p>
<p>You haven’t set foot into an academic lab yet outside of class work have you? Why do you think the labs are filled wall to wall with many immigrants from countries with lower standards of living than here? It’s because there is a huge glut of scientists for not enough faculty positions and a dying manufacturing and R and D base in this country. Wages for post docs are very low and no one wants to toil away in low paying post doc gigs for years on end. That’s why we exploit cheap foreign labor in academia just like how the restaurant and agribusiness do it too.</p>
<p>Discover a field that truly interests you, whether it be physical sciences, medical sciences, environmental sciences, and then find a niche within that field that you have some aptitude in and that cutting edge or is not saturated by others. For example, get a bachelors in biology and a masters in statistics (many biologists are allergic to math). Alernatively, few science students have an aptitude in writing; those who can do science and write about science have a leg up. I’m sure you can think of other examples. Think integrated science because that is how science is done. Develop your skill set to fill niches that are in demand and complement others’ skills in your chosen field. I’ve been in an environmental research lab for almost 20 years, and we look to hire folks who have cutting edge skills or who can contribute to team efforts in a variety of ways because they possess a variety of skills.</p>
<p>I will concur with BlindWilly. For example, we have a biostatistics program at my university of employment, and what they are really looking for is people with the math and programming skills that are able to deal with complex data and interpret them. Too often, those who come from the epidemiologic background lack the math skills, and many who’ve come from a pure math background are in a mindset detached from applications, or, more often, lack the communication skills to give data analysis reports that are both mathematically sound, answer the research question and are understandable to the researchers. (It is one issue with a non-negligible portion of foreign students in fact: some may work hard for cheap, but have severely lacking language and communication skills).</p>
<p>The only problem in STEM fields is when expectations do not match reality for science careers. The root problems of the misalignment in expectations and reality are:</p>
<p>1 - Degree proliferation. More and more people are earning advanced degrees in fields for which there is no industrial demand. The main causal factor is the overabundance of grant money for academics and the slave labor PhD system which promotes the overproduction of PhDs in most fields. Because there’s not enough industrial demand to pick up all the graduate students coming out of our universities, corporations hire PhDs and MS candidates instead of BS candidates as they did previously. The net effect of the entire process effectively creates massive downward pressure on both career trajectories and salaries for budding young scientists. </p>
<p>2 - Misleading salary and career placement information. Too often people are told that STEM fields are high growth and have high salaries. While that is true on average, most STEM fields are NOT high growth fields, and do not have obscenely high salaries, especially if you do not have a graduate degree. Unfortunately, most students only learn about this when they go to graduate and cannot find a reasonable job to pay off their student loans.</p>
<p>3 - Student loans. Too many students are using easy credit to finance their degrees. The real problem here is when they take out too much credit, to finance a degree with miserable job/salary prospects. The worst case scenario is that they take out so much money that there is no conceivable way for them to live off their salary after struggling for four years to earn a degree in a STEM field. </p>
<p>4 - The promise of a career. STEM fields are overhyped. Having a degree in a STEM field does not magically make you employable, nor does it guarantee a life of comfort and happiness. No degree can reasonable make those promises either, but STEM degrees often are sold in that fashion.</p>
<p>I can understand that people are upset about STEM fields in general and their particular degree programs, when they thought they were making a good choice by studying STEM only to find out that the career prospects are dim (either in salary or in what they actually work on), they have basically screwed themselves over by taking out too much money in student loans, and they are not materially better off than when they first started college. The reality is that no degree can guarantee you a job post-graduation, much less a satisfying career for the next 40 years of your life. </p>
<p>That being said, I don’t believe that STEM fields are dying. If anything, they are becoming more important in our day-to-day lives. The only question is where the jobs are going to be, and what you will be doing. There will always be jobs for Chemists, Biologists, Engineers and Scientists in the US, but they may not be what the average student envisions, but they will exist in some form. Does that mean that everyone who graduates will get a job? No, but there will always be openings and jobs for STEM graduates in the US, much like most college degrees.</p>
<p>At the end of the day, the people who are most likely to emerge from college happy (regardless of the outcome) are those who:
1 - Do their homework and pick majors with strong industrial demand, avoid student debt like the plague, and develop marketable skills by taking internships, etc. OR
2 - Approach college as a learning experience, and not a ticket to a better career. If they land a better job after college, then even better, but their main goal was only to be better educated about the world. </p>
<p>In either case, the best thing you can do to ensure that you don’t regret your 4-6 years at college is to minimize your student loan debt.</p>