<p>"If you consider the USA Today and Intel awards "lottery-style", I guess you haven't taken the time to read about the students that receive them. Once again, you have shown that you shoot from the hip with statements that are nothing short of ridiculous."
I've read the USA Today academic team coverage, and I know several of the students. I will say, though, that I know several other students who were not given this award and were just as deserving. I compare it to the Rhodes Scholarship: if you win, great, but it's not everything. There are hundreds of students out there as good as the ones featured in USA Today and not all of them earn that recognition.</p>
<p>As for Intel STS and S-W, again, there are many deserving students who do not take the top prize. Who are you, or I, to say that the winners are really "the best"? I don't think so.</p>
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...there are many deserving students who do not take the top prize.
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Of course, but that would be true of any type of award that isn't purely quantitative. And that's a lot different from calling it a lottery. Yes, not every amazing kid can be the final winner(s), but those that are are so deserving...you had made it sound like a complete crap-shoot. When you talk like that, you have absolutely no credibility. Think before you post.</p>
<p>Zephyr--You or I can't say the winners are the best, that's why we're not judges. But I'm pretty sure the legions of Ph.D.s who are judging these competitions can tell which projects are the "best". I mean, not every deserving student can be, say, an STS finalist. But if someone wins Intel or S-W, you can be pretty sure they're the best of the best of the projects entered.</p>
<p>Donemom, my son and I had a very similar reaction to the Harvard students we met when he was looking at schools last year. Very down-to-earth and unpretentious despite some amazing accomplishments. There was one young woman I remember in particular, a senior, who talked about how grateful she was that Harvard had allowed her to fashion a joint music-government concentration. She explained that she was "into" music, but didn't want to make that her sole major, and that the joint major had allowed her to explore some of her other interests, including how government policy impacts the development of music. One of the parents in the room then asked what she was planning to do when she graduated. Well, it turned out that her near term plans included performing a violin concerto with the Pittsburgh Symphony, followed by a concert tour in Europe. I guess she was sincere about being "into" music. I just smiled to myself and thought, ah yes, Harvard.</p>
<p>alright, now that we've had that nice romantic moment of veritas, who wants to step in and shatter the tranquility? We can't be having Harvard sound too good, now can we? zephyr151, you're slacking. Tell us something great about Stanford, quick! We can't have people on this forum think Harvard actually lives up to its billing. Someone, quote some random stat about Princeton and its non-pretensious (sic lol), all-inclusive Eating Clubs and undergrad focused-"grads are nonexistent" philosophy. Please, help me. I can't go to sleep without witnessing the daily dose of Harvard Bashing!</p>
<p>Yeah, "tell us something great about Stanford" is good advice for someone who likes Stanford and who wants to make a POSITIVE, CONSTRUCTIVE comment in a discussion of the merits of various colleges. This is what appalls me about some of what has gone on in this Harvard Forum for some time: to see that there are young people who are evidently very proud of being Stanford students but who cannot say anything good about anyone or anything--including Stanford. That doesn't reflect well on Stanford. </p>
<p>(It's a good thing that a local friend reminded me the week before last about the young men from my state whom I had heard about before they went to Stanford. They are a credit to their alma mater.) </p>
<p>P.S. Stanford has a really cool stained glass window on its campus, and I am very proud to have a personal snapshot of that, taken during my business trip there in 1986.</p>
<p>If Harvard feels right to you, go ahead and go. But base your decision on your own feel for the place and what it has to offer and not on what Harvard haters on CC are saying.</p>
<p>When my daughter got in two years ago I was worried because of all the negative stuff I'd read on CC. Well, nearly all those things that people love to hate Harvard for just haven't proven true for her. She LOVES it there. She gets depressed to think that in another semester her time at Harvard will already be half over. She says that there are unhappy people at Harvard but they are pretty rare - perhaps one in 20 or 30. All her friends and roommates like it there too. I've met many of them, and I must say that they are an impressive bunch: kind, polite, extremely smart, confident and yet humble, and very, very witty. I've never met a Harvard student who wasn't very quick-witted and fun to be around.</p>
<p>Unlike the Harvard haters, one thing you won't get from me is bashing of Harvard's peer institutions. HYPSM - they are all great schools. I would have been thrilled to have my daughter attend any one of them. And my younger daughter may yet wind up at one of them. You can get a great education and have a very good time at any of these schools and hundred more besides. But if in your heart you want to go to Harvard...well, it's up to you to decide.</p>
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They made a special point of telling us how Princeton has so much money that they'll fund anything you want, even pleasure trips if its presented in the right way. It was a turn off.
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<p>Yale does the same thing on its tours and the student body is, for the most part, extremely happy with the school. A particular Princeton tour doesn't necessarily convey the true Princeton atmosphere.</p>
<p>My harvard tout was quite an anti-climax to what I had anticipated. The guide was more interested about talking about how to get into Harvard than what its like once you got in. There's a real seriousness about Havard and it can be unnerving at first. </p>
<p>What make Princeton special was that at people there were like human. Like they did smile and they did socialise and the atmosphere is much much more relaxed. I may be biast... after all - i did apply ED to Pton!</p>
<p>But ... I'm going to Princeton. I don't care if anyone tells me Harvard or Yale or monkeys are better than Princeton. I made a choice and I really don't believe the difference between the 2 are all that noticable for undergrads anyhow. Both are the best in the world. Full stop</p>
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I also have to say that when we visited Princeton, there was a much more show-offy, elitist air to the way things were conducted. For example, they had the info session in one of their massive, stain-glass cathedral type spaces, and then later toured us to see all the others just like it. They made a special point of telling us how Princeton has so much money that they'll fund anything you want, even pleasure trips if its presented in the right way. It was a turn off.
By contrast, at Harvard, the info session was conducted in a regular, small lecture hall, in the most low-key way by an admissions person and a student. The tour person was also very down-to-earth, and took us to relevant places, but didn't try to show off every cathedral ceiling. Everyone we dealt with, and most that my son has since met, have been unpretensious and not anxious to talk about their past or present accomplishments. In sum, my son describes his impression of Harvard as "elite, without being elitist".
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<p>That's exactly the feel that I got. At Princeton, we did the info session in that giant meeting room with like 20 murals on the walls around the benches and the center table. At Harvard they did it in a pretty crappy lecture hall actually, and we were one of two sessions going on at once because 300 people had gone at that time on that day for info sessions and tours and we had to be split up. My father and I pick the worst days for tours...I think our Brown one had like 100 people.</p>
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Yale does the same thing on its tours and the student body is, for the most part, extremely happy with the school
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<p>I think that you just made my point for me: certain people will be drawn to that kind of thing,(or at least not mind it) and want to go there. They will then be happy amongst like minded people. Now, obviously, this may be an oversimplification about one point made on a visit, but I do think that certain consistent vibes are given off from a school, and that impacts the kind of people it draws and the culture that prevails there.</p>
<p>Kjoodles I think your guide imparted the wrong impression. Most Harvard students I've met have been bright, creative, and funny. Of course there are tons of uptight stiffs there but I think they tend to hang out with each other. </p>
<p>The last time I visited Harvard, I ate dinner with my sister and her roommates. We ended up wearing tissue paper crowns and blowing cheap plastic whistles while throwing confetti into each other's food. (Side note: water changes color pretty quickly when you drop a piece of confetti in it.) And all that without a drop of alcohol, haha.</p>
<p>I was orignially focused on going to Dartmouth. I loved everything about it, except for the binding early decision. So, I decided to apply to Harvard (which was definitely #2 on my list). However, when I thought about location, I decided Harvard was for me. Sure, Dartmouth has some appealing aspects (such as no TAs in teaching classes), great campus life, quarter system, etc--- but it really can't compare to Boston in terms of location. I was also very interested in applying to the College of William and Mary, however the location entirely turned me off from the college. I just can't imagine myself living there. </p>
<p>My point is that location can be an extremely important factor in admission. As I said, the location of William and Mary actually made me decide not to apply there. When I was accepted to Harvard, I decided that nearly all other aspects equaling Dartmouth, it's metropolitian location was the deciding factor. Needless to say, Harvard is my number # 1 choice, and I will be attending there this fall :).</p>
<p>I don't think location should matter THAT much. most people i know spend most of their time on campus or around the small town of cambridge anyway.</p>
<p>OK I understand that Harvard Square doesn't have as many random shootings as LA or Atlanta, but did you seriously just call Cambridge a small town? I mean, I'd have trouble calling Summerville a small town, and Summerville's a suburb of Cambridge.</p>