<p>My son wrote two essays, one describing a moment in time related to his ECs, another a thoughtful discussion of philosophy. He and my husband prefer the second, his dean and I lean towards the first. I think even if you mention your ECs elsewhere in the app, if they're an integral part of who you are and what you bring that's unique, they should be highlighted in the essay. Any thoughts on whether one of your essays should spotlight your ECs (if they're really important to you and to your app) and should avoid hot button topics like philosophy?</p>
<p>Which essay sounds more like a real teenager wrote it? Why does he prefer the philosophy? To me, from my experience, essays are a place where you let the kid speak for themselves. Oh sure, words of advice on weaknesses etc., but don't second guess them. I think most people say you should write something about ECs, but there is usually a place to put that stuff. And face it, almost every EC in the word, adcoms at the most selective places have read over and over again.</p>
<p>This is just IMO.</p>
<p>"Hot button topics"</p>
<p>There are many in the field of philosophy who would be thrilled to hear their field described as "hot" anything!</p>
<p>The essay that is most in the "voice" of your son is the best to use. The one that, without his name on it, someone who knows him would read and say "I know immediately who wrote that" </p>
<p>There is also some consideration for the schools he is using this essay for. If a broad range of schools, either would probably be OK. For a more humanities-oriented LAC, the philosophy one might be great.</p>
<p>The issue is not that philosophy is a hot button but discussing other people's ideas is not the ideal way of showcasing one's own personality, achievements, experiences.<br>
It is hard for a 17-year old to write really well on a philosophical topic (can one top Heidegger or Wittgenstein at that age?) in a highly personal way that makes the adcom readers feel that they "know" the writer. But if he can write in an engaging way, Chicago might be just the right place for him!</p>
<p>My understanding is that the topic is less important than how the student's self and voice emerge through the essay. Also the experience or thought, per se, is less important than the impact this has had on the student (In the words of Annie Hall, "Did it change your wife?") and how well this is expressed.</p>
<br>
<blockquote> <p>The issue is not that philosophy is a hot button but discussing other people's ideas is not the ideal way of showcasing one's own personality, achievements, experiences.<<</p> </blockquote>
<br>
<p>Agree with Marite--never forget the whole point of the essay--"Pick me!"</p>
<p>The topic does not matter. I've seen terrific essays on everything from weeding a tomato patch to Marilyn Monroe, and everything in between. </p>
<p>What does matter are the following:</p>
<ul>
<li>The essay is well written and grammatically correct.</li>
<li>The essay shows something important about your son, whether it be the way his mind works or an important experience that has shaped him.</li>
<li>The essay sounds like your son.</li>
<li>The essay shows a certain amount of thought and self-knowledge.</li>
<li>The essay adds an extra dimension to his application that can not be found elsewhere in his application materials.</li>
<li>The essay is focused and does not ramble.</li>
<li>The essay will not be easily misinterpreted as being obscene, rude, whiney, or self-serving.</li>
</ul>
<p>ANY topic can accomplish the above, if handled well. </p>
<p>However, I'll add one more important thought: This is your SON'S college application, so the final decision of which essay to use should be his, whether or not you, the dean, or your next door neighbor agrees. It's hard to step back and let our children make this choice, I know, but ultimately, this is THEIR choice to make, not the parent's. Think of it as training for next year, when they won't have your input on which paper topic to use, which girl to date, or which study group to join. You've let him know your thoughts on the matter, now let him make the decision he feels comfortable with, even if it also means taking a riskier path.</p>
<p>By the way, I don't know if she's around, but I vividly remember Sac, a poster here, lamenting her son's choice of an essay on Wittgenstein a few years back. He did very well in admissions, and is now at Columbia. So, yes, some teens can indeed write a great essay on philosophy. :)</p>
<p>It's easy to say it's his essay, but when your college counselor who you've been with since tenth grade says go with essay #1 over #2, it's hard to ignore. She's the expert. But I did think he should save the philosophical one (where he discusses forming his own belief system, he doesn't discuss other philosophers) for a school like Chicago. For the EA to Yale, 500 words on his Latin/Classics EC is probably the best bet. I do want to support him, though, and he definitely prefers the other essay. As to the difference in the essays, they both sound like him. One is more amorphous and general (how his thinking has developed over time), one is specific (moment in time). They both tell you something about him, one that he's smart and thoughtful and a bit iconoclastic, the other that he's committed to his EC -- but the latter is already evident from other things in his app. </p>
<p>I'm focusing on that idea, pick me. What would make you do that? Good question!</p>
<p>I would say that the clue to the better essay topic is: which is the one your son prefers, the one he feels best captures what he wants to say about himself, the one he feels he "nailed" and wants to send. Agree with Carolyn that it has to be his choice. </p>
<p>Had similar issue with S1 in the early stages of struggling to choose a topic for the main essay. While brainstorming ideas, we talked about an EC (jazz and improv), about travel experiences, about trying out for Jeopardy (almost made the cut). He made a stab at each and found it just didn't flow. He found himself writing instead about the death of a friend and how much friendship had come to mean to him during his four years of high school; the ending was philosophical in a 17-year-old boy kind of way -- both know it all and naive. I was nervous about him picking such a somber topic but it was his choice and it turned out to be a moving essay that said a lot about him as a person.</p>
<p>Carolyn,
Just to elaborate, he seemed resigned to follow his dean's advice -- I'm the one debating with myself whether he should have given up on his essay so easily when it was clear that he preferred it. You're right, it's ultimately his choice, even if that choice is just to do what the counselor says. Both essays hit most of your key points, except one just reiterates something that came be gleaned elsewhere whereas the philosophical one adds another element to knowing him.</p>
<p>I'm not so sure it's "Pick me", but maybe rather, "Here I am". If your child does a great job at that and the school says, "No thanks", I'd say your kid is better off elsewhere.</p>
<p>When my D applied to Yale last year she had to submit two essays, one on the Common App and one supplemental. Has that changed?</p>
<p>Booklady,</p>
<p>It's still two. The first one he wrote a week ago. It's a funny peek into another side of him, totally unrelated to his brain or his ECs. He wrote it in one sitting, in about a half hour, it just flew out from somewhere onto the computer. It's the supplemental essay that's been causing all the problems. That, "what else do you want to say about yourself" essay.</p>
<p>Actually, Carolyn, I believe that Sac's S decided to ditch the Wittgenstein essay. Much as he loved W, the essay was flat, if I recall what Sac said.</p>
<p>BurnThis: If your S feels that he does not come across as naive as he grapples with philosophical ideas, but instead is able to convey his personality well, then he should stick with the philosophy essay. We are all giving advice in the dark here, based on very little knowledge of the actual essays.</p>
<p>What should the essay convey: that the student is thoughtful, engaging, smart, that s/he is someone one would like to know, someone who will bring something to the community, whether or not s/he has some special talent. Some essays bring tears to one's eyes, others make you chuckle, still others make you laugh out loud. And some make you smile at the creativity and imaginativeness of the writer.</p>
<p>
[quote]
It's the supplemental essay that's been causing all the problems. That, "what else do you want to say about yourself" essay.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Ah, gotcha. Well I'll just throw this out there: my D did her supplemental essay on the <em>very</em> hot-button topic of religion. Neither my husband nor her GC thought she should send it, but it really showed something about who she is that her transcript, etc. didn't. She liked it, so she sent it. Yale didn't seem to mind. :)</p>
<p>My vote would be to pick whichever essay has been seen fewer times by those overworked, brain-fried admission officers.</p>
<p>If he's already decided to go along with the counselor's recommendation, it doesn't much matter... but I have some comments:
[quote]
It's easy to say it's his essay, but when your college counselor who you've been with since tenth grade says go with essay #1 over #2, it's hard to ignore. She's the expert.
[/quote]
Not really. GC's and high school English teachers tend to be conservative in approach: most are going will opt for the "tried and true", more prosaic topic.... they don't want to risk offending anyone, and are uncomfortable venturing into unfamiliar territory. </p>
<p>The colleges, on the other hand, have seen it all and ad coms at schools like Yale have way too many apps to read every season... its easy to get jaded. So an essay that stands out and grabs attention is much better, IF it is also a good essay.
[quote]
one just reiterates something that came be gleaned elsewhere whereas the philosophical one adds another element to knowing him.
[/quote]
Reiterating facts that can be gleaned elsewhere on the application is a waste of paper... it won't help the application at all. That doesn't mean that the student can't write about the EC, IF the essay reveals something extra -- but "I did X, Y, & Z and this is important to me" is no help if X, Y, & Z are already listed on the activities sheet. On the other hand, "what I learned from doing X" might be very valuable, if it isn't cliche. </p>
<p>That is, learning the value of helping others from doing community service is useless ... but a kid who writes something unexpected that stems from his observations or experiences may have a very powerful essay. </p>
<p>If you have time and want to be confused even further, why don't you ask your son whether he would like to have some CC old-timers review his essays. I'd be happy to receive a PM from you or him, and I promise to be brutally honest in my assessment of which I think is the better essay. It probably would help to have someone who doesn't really know your son take a look at the philosophy essay, anyway -- given the fact that the ad com doesn't know him either.</p>
<p>I really believe, as others have said, that what is important in the essay is that the counselor reading it can come away with a feeling that they "know" something about the writer. It is a given that whatever the subject, that grammer and flow is important. When they look at the application they are looking at the stats. The best purpose of the essay, in my opinion, is to put a "face" to the raw numbers. They will know the student in a non personal way by the courses and grades they receive. To write an essay on any subject matter that can enlighten the reader as to the individual that is applying is what I believe results in the best type of essay.</p>