@becca3 At Penn there is also the option of doing an uncoordinated dual degree in engineering and business, as an alternative to the coordinated dual degree option (M&T). M&T is insanely hard to get into, so many people who are not able to get into M&T but are able to get into Penn in general, have the option of applying to pursue an uncoordinated dual degree once they are in. They have the same curriculum as the M&T kids, but they have to take more courses because the M&T program double counts some requirements between the two schools (SEAS, Wharton) while that option is not available to uncoordinated dual degree students.