Intellectual Property/Copyright Law

Graduate School Law School
1

<p>Hi folks,</p>

<p>I've been trolling the board for a little while and have come across numerous posts that discuss what you need to do to get into a good law school, but few that address what to expect when you get out.</p>

<p>Based on my UGPA and practice LSATs, plus other factors, I think I have a pretty good chance of getting into a top 20 law school, possibly even a t14 (though not likely toward the top of that group).</p>

<p>Assuming I can get into a school ranked between #20 and, say, #9 or so, what can I expect to face when I get out? I know that people coming out of the t14 are basically guaranteed strong starting salaries. But if you graduate from a school under the t14, do you need to be in the top 10% of your class to get an excellent first job (perhaps coming out of UCLA or George Washington, for example)? And are there enough good jobs to go around, considering the saturation of the market?</p>

<p>Next, what can I expect my day-to-day work life to be like? My plan is to go into Intellectual Property law, with an emphasis on copyright law. (I do not have a science background and don't have any interest in patent law. My background is actually in media and the arts, so copyright law would be a natural fit for me.) I'd like to know what kind of work I'd be doing day-in and day-out as an associate in this field.</p>

<p>Also, can anyone give me any insight into how Media law differs from IP law?</p>

<p>Finally, I'm thinking of applying to UWashington and Lewis & Clark as my safe schools, because I have heard both have strong IP law programs, and because I love the Pacific Northwest and wouldn't mind getting "stuck" there. Can anyone tell me whether the IP programs at these schools get any recognition/respect nationally? And are there any other schools outside the t14 with particularly strong IP programs I should look into (I think BU is one)?</p>

<p>As my user name suggests, law school will represent a major life change for me (I am 30 now), so I want to do this right, and I want to know what being an IP lawyer will be like day-to-day before I give up my relatively low-key (though not entirely rewarding) current lifestyle.</p>

<p>Thanks so much!</p>

2

<p>What, nobody who reads this board is involved with IP or coyright law?</p>

3

<p>I'm a mom- so take the info with a grain of salt -</p>

<p>if I can assume that your interest in media may also lead into entertainment/music industry issues, you may want to familiarize yourself with the programs at UCLA and Vanderbilt in Nashville (They don't call it Music City for nothing). From what I hear, they both have strong entertainment law divisions and are considered top 20 schools.<br>
Cordoza in NY is also supposed to have a strong IP and entertainment law program too.
Hope someone else adds to this discussion as I'd like some more info on this subject matter.</p>

4

<p>
[quote]
I know that people coming out of the t14 are basically guaranteed strong starting salaries.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Actually, you are not guaranteed anything, particularly in a bad economy. Many of the big law firms that pay the big salaries to which you refer are going to be reeling from the Wall Street fallout of the past year and, particularly, the past several days. When your biggest clients are going bankrupt, you lose those clients forever. </p>

<p>Here's the reality check:</p>

<p>Many big law firms have cancelled their on campus interviewing and summer programs for this fall and the following summer or have cut way back in different ways. Some firms have reduced the number of schools at which they interview, some firms have reduced the size of their summer classes (and, therefore, the number of offers that they will make to 2Ls to become summer associates) and some firms have shortened the length of their summer programs (reducing the amount of compensation you can bank during the summer). Some firms have also forced their incoming new associates this fall to wait until as late as January until they can begin working. Ouch! </p>

<p>Many firms have also either overtly or stealthily "downsized" associates, forcing them to look for new jobs in a terrible economy, when lots of other associates have been similarly forced to look for new jobs. It is ugly out there and getting uglier. As clients are squeezed, they are paying more slowly, and are demanding rate cuts and general discounts on their billings.</p>

<p>The result will likely be leaner staffing by law firms, fewer associates hired overall and more work and longer hours for those who do manage to get hired at these big law firms. </p>

<p>Interestingly, as in most times when the economy is strugling, I imagine that law school applications will now go through the roof as graduating seniors search for alternatives to the job market and recent grads (1-3 years out) search for something to do in lieu of lost jobs. </p>

<p>My point is simply that you shouldn't go to law school if all you are looking for is a big pay day. The pot of gold at the end of the rainbow may turn out to be an illusion.</p>

5

<p>Sally- at this point, I am so glad my kid was an ILR major and is working for a labor union. I think I'd be a bit more nervous if my kid graduated from the AEM program. I know too many recent college grads who have lost their jobs already or just couldn't find one.</p>

<p>and I agree- this year is going to be very tough for law school admissions and possibly obtaining student loans too.
It's going to be a real rough year for everyone.</p>

6

<p>Sally, I appreciate all the info. Reality checks are indeed good. Just to be clear, however, I didn't say I'm only considering law school for the "big pay day." I am interested to know, however, how my chances of getting a top-notch job would be affected if I went to a school beneath the t14. I am curious as to whether you <em>need</em> to be top 10% in schools beneath the t14 to have a chance at a high-paying job.</p>

<p>That said, you are absolutely right to point out that there are really no guarantees -- though everything I have been reading on the topic implies that the better the school, the better your chances. Would you argue that's not true?</p>

<p>More importantly, though, the main thing I'm looking for with this thread is to hear from a practicing IP/copyright lawyer about their day-in, day-out work schedule and their opinion on what law school programs carry high esteem within this field. I was also looking to find out how Media law differs from IP/copyright law. Anybody out there?</p>

7

<p>The better the law school that you attend, the better the chance that you will be able to land a coveted high paying job with a big law firm. That said, there are also lower ranked (by USNWR, for what that's worth) law schools that also do fairly well placing students in big law firms (for example, Fordham does fairly well in NYC). The more difficult the economy gets, the more likely it is that big law firms will by choosier about who they hire, both because students are more likely to accept their offers of employment (higher yields) and because they are likely to need and/or want to hire fewer associates (and the "or" is important, because it means fewer attorneys doing more work). </p>

<p>I would highly recommend reviewing recent information (i.e. 2008 recruiting and placement information) from the career offices of law schools you would consider attending to determine which law firms are interviewing on campus and how many students from a given law school were given offers of employment by those law firms.</p>

<p>I am not an IP lawyer, though there are a few who frequent this board. Hopefully, one or more of them will chime in to help you with your question about practicing IP law. My experience with IP and IP attorneys has been that their day-in, day-out schedule varies tremendously depending upon the setting in which they practice (small versus big law firm, in house, type of clients, type of company, etc.), the subarea within IP they practice (copyright, patent infringement litigation, patent prosecution, licensing, etc.) and the geographic area in which they practice.</p>

<p>My experience is also for many IP attorneys, their undergrad major and the quality of that program often matters more than the law school they attend, though, of course, if you want BIGLAW or a well regarded, high paying boutique IP firm in a big city, your best bet is also a highly ranked law school. </p>

<p>I'm not sure what you mean by media law. Are you referring to first amendment, copyright, transactional (M&A, securities, etc.), or another area of practice?</p>

8

<p>Sally, again, thank you for your reply. Very, very informative.</p>

<p>As for my question re: Media law -- I am interested in focusing on copyright law in my studies, but I have noticed that some schools have <em>both</em> IP programs and Media law programs, even though both such programs seem to deal with copyright law (at least to some extent). On the other hand, some schools have specific programs in only one (IP law) <em>or</em> the other (Media law). </p>

<p>Hence, I have a little confusion about how these two areas overlap/differ. Is it that those who study copyright law in a <em>Media law</em> program will be more concerned with First Amendment issues vs. those who study copyright law under an <em>IP law</em> banner? Any insight appreciated!</p>

<p>To your point about how law frim size affects hours/day-to-day tasks/job satisfaction: indeed, and I hope those who do practice copyright law will be specific about their situations when they respond to this thread so I can get a sense for how the work (and its personal costs/benefits) differs in differing situations. Hopefully your bringing up this point will inspire others to respond accordingly. :)</p>

9

<p>Still waiting for a copyright lawyer to chime in on this . . .</p>

10

<p>Just to be clear, in law school, you don't typically study a "major" or even have a concentration of any kind. You take the kinds of classes that you want (copyright/trademark and patent classes are typically offered to 2Ls and 3Ls) and then take a job in the area in which you wish to specialize. Without thinking about it very much, I know of three IP attorneys (all PTO-admitted) who never took an IP-centric class in law school. I also know plenty of people, including me, who did take courses in different areas of IP in law school but who are not IP practitioners. You might also participate on a journal that focuses on IP issues or in other activities that focus on IP. </p>

<p>I would be less concerned with the courses you take in law school and more concerned about your internship opportunities and career prospects in your chosen area. </p>

<p>Your undergraduate major is often all important, too, in determining your area of specialization should you decide to become a patent lawyer.</p>