Invitation to Freshman Orgo...

<p>Hi, I'm an incoming freshman at Emory. Just like most of Emory students, I'm thinking about majoring in Bio and going Pre-med.</p>

<p>Orientation is just one week away from now, and I got an invitation letter from Dr. Soria about joining Chem 221 (freshman organic chemistry class) just few days ago.</p>

<p>I've got 4 on AP chem in my junior year at high school, and 4 on AP Bio in Senior year,
But I wasn't planning to skip Gen. Chem or Gen. Bio, because all the medical schools require General Chemistry & Biology courses, and I forgot most of the materials over the last few months. </p>

<p>So my original plan was...
1) Take Gen Chem & Bio during Freshman year with Math and English
2) Take Physics over the summer
3) Take Orgo and higher-lever bio or chem in Sophomore year.</p>

<p>But Now I got this invitation letter, I don't know what to do. Maybe I should take orgo during freshman year and take upper classes later. OR Would that hurt my chance to get into Medical school somehow??</p>

<p>Which one is better in terms of getting good grades?
Which one is better in terms of applying to Medical school?</p>

<p>I'm very confused right now. Someone please Help!!!</p>

<p>Read what me and Collegestu say here: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/emory-university/1192130-course-scheduling.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/emory-university/1192130-course-scheduling.html&lt;/a&gt; and here: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/emory-university/1192401-lot-scheduling-questions-freshman-pre-med-bio-major.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/emory-university/1192401-lot-scheduling-questions-freshman-pre-med-bio-major.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Going the Vanilla track when you don’t have to normally screws you out of the opportunity of associating w/a stronger group of peers and having greater faculty-student interaction useful for recommendations for med. school in the future and even research/internship opps (Soria can also help suggest and perhaps organize such opps. Gen. chem profs. will have nothing to do w/this despite being good lecturers). If you work hard both are awesome for good grades. If you don’t you’re screwed, especially if you don’t do well in gen. chem. At least screwing up a little in organic chem (especially as a frosh in a section where the number indicates it is the same level or higher than sophomore sectons). is forgivable. A great number of Goldwater Scholars and those who go on to more prestigious medical schools seem to have taken Soria’s lab or class. The number is shockingly disproportionate (seriously, for 2-3 years between 2008-2011, both of Emory’s Goldwater Scholars took his course. And some/an abnormal amount who entered between 05-07’ went on to Ivy League schools for med or grad. school. If you perform well and accept the faculty-student interaction Soria tries, it seems to make being pre-med or w/e science at Emory more interesting). It inspires critical and creative thinking and will make for much smoother transitions to other courses at Emory (plus your peer group will generally take many of the same classes in the future and enhance the success and experience much more than the more Vanilla group). Just take the oppurtunity, don’t be wimpy/vanilla lol. If you don’t like Soria’s style for 221-Z or can’t accommodate his 222-Z class in your schedule, you can switch to another 222 class, ideally Weinschenk. Oh, by the way, gen. chem is hardly relevant to orgo. which is why schools like Williams College actually have the frosh take it first and then gen. chem/inorganic, so forgetting gen. chem shouldn’t harm you. Soria will reteach the material that is relevant to the organic chemistry context. And this context is often more useful and more sensible than the minute of gen. chem. It puts a pictorial spin on those concepts. It is awesome lol.</p>

<p>Thanks Bernie12</p>

<p>Ok, so If I do take Soria’s class, I would be taking upper level classes in my soph/junior year right? Courses like Inorganic chem, Analytic chem, and biochem.</p>

<p>How hard are those classes compared to Gen Chem and Orgo?</p>

<p>And Is taking Physics over the summer good idea or bad idea?</p>

<p>and How exactly does “peer-group from soria’s class” different than Vanilla group?
Do you think Gen. Chem students will be a bad influence or something?
Lastly, How big is the Gen. Chem class compared to Orgo class?</p>

<p>Sorry for asking hundreds of questions and THank you!!</p>

<p>They are easier (maybe not conceptually, but workload wise. Actually 260 is questionable. Weaver is teaching it starting this year. My friends are taking him this upcoming year. They’ll need to keep me updated on how it’s going) and less “rigorous”. They basically only have exams, so all you need to do is study. No tedious p-sets (actually, I think P-sets are good) and material is sometimes spoon fed. Nice curve/generous grading scale as well. </p>

<p>The group is self-selected. A significantly higher percentage of Soria’s students perform at a much higher level and easily develop that level of thinking needed to be very successful in academic achievement, research, and various other ECs (a reasonable amount of them get research that year or already have a research job). They already have the potential, Soria helps push them to the level they need to be. Gen. Chem students seem to expect ease and certainly don’t like being “pushed” or surprised. They get really mad, for example, when a prof. designs a difficult, but fair exam. And when they get to orgo., the complacency/ entitlement gets worse. I personally blame it on the professors. I honestly think they should have break-out sessions that expose students to modern research or something or make them work on problem sets that apply certain biological or special concepts (seriously, Other peers do it, and their gen. chem sections are far larger, and I believe they used tenured profs. We pre-dominantly employ lecture track profs. which are supposedly dedicated to teaching, so they can’t claim they don’t have time. I’ve seen tenure track profs. try harder). The fact is, they don’t demand that much, and thus it is surprising when they design a tough exam. It is also surprising when most students take their first orgo. exam. When you take an upperlevel course exam, you won’t be surprised. You’ll know how to handle it and inquire further about info, because you were in a community encouraging that type of learning among a very strong peer group. Seems that many profs. and characters in highered actually perceive general chemistry as rather useless the way it is taught at most institutions today. It isn’t too challenging (not to say it’s easy. It’s one of those courses w/non-stimulating material that you may not make an A in even after having AP. And that’s what sucks), doesn’t inspire inquiry, and is almost too broad. Lab sucks. Nothing interesting happens there except for perhaps the alternative fuel project 2nd semester, but then, the same could be done in orgo. lab. </p>

<p>Soria’s class is normally between 35 and 70 (I think he shoots for 50-55 now, but allows it to balloon to 70 if there is increased interest. Class of 2013, a very strong class, for example, was 68 in the fall) students, gen. chem in fall is generally 105-125 (depends on how many frosh enrolled. Last year, too many enrolled in CAS, so 125. Even labs needed overloads. Really embarrassing). Basically, as good as these lecturers are, don’t expect interaction unless you join chemory. In Soria or W’s class, you need not do that. They try to do it in the classroom. And w/Soria, he does it in lecture and lab. He learns all names (gen. chem profs. won’t do this, they are already skeptical of your level of interest, and don’t want to reciprocate what is nearly a non-existent level of interest in the broad material they teach) and is willing to assist or discuss career, academic plans, etc. Uses his own version of Socratic method vigorously in class, plays students in sports, takes them to lunch sometimes, etc. Basically, the man believes in the undergrad. experience and what high-level teaching, learning, and mentoring can do. He doesn’t just pay lip-service to it. Luckily, he isn’t the only science prof. at Emory like this. I think Emory is special in that it has a surprising amount of science profs. w/this philosophy at least for a research institution. It’s trying hard to straddle that liberal arts/research school fence successfully. Some profs. try to offer the benefits of both experiences. Soria and W. are just a couple of those.</p>

<p>Is is possible to take Orgo without having taken AP Chemistry? I would assume its not, but I was mailed one of the invitation letters to take it rather than the normal Chem class. It says right on the letter that you have to have achieved a 4 or a 5 on the exam, but I wasn’t sure why I would be mailed the letter if I wasn’t eligible? Orgo definitely sounds better, but I just wanted to know if I have any chance of taking it :slight_smile: Thanks!</p>

<p>If you were e-mailed it, then take the shot I guess. Maybe they saw strengths in other areas. I have no idea. Sit in it for a week (2 classes) and see if you feel comfortable. Get out of there if you feel screwed or uncomfortable. If you think you are really interested in chem./science (as in learning it, not completing the courses b/c they are requirements for w/e), you can go for it. Some students have successfully done so in the past. It was likely a mistake, but it could end up a happy mistake. If you are uncomfortable after say Friday’s class, alert someone like thestudent1 that you are giving up your spot, that way, they can immediately negotiate getting in as they qualify for an invite in the first place.</p>