Is Dartmouth is a sub-standard school?

[ammarsfound]

<p>Like wise, I have been arguing for ages that any course at Dartmouth does not match that rigour of the equivalent courses at Caltech, and that's for the undergrads.</p>

<p>What're you on? Harvard, Princeton, Stanford, Yale, Dartmouth, penn, duke, brown ALL of them are MUCH easier than caltech. What does that have to do with 'quality of education'? Recruiters and professional schools care more about gpas than which school you come from. Caltech is at a DISADVANTAGE. Do you not understand? It's a BAD thing if a curriculum is rigorous. Its one of the reasons caltechs performance at getting people jobs and into grad schools is abysmal. A 3.5 (the cut off gpa) is IMPOSSIBLE at caltech, but professional schools/ recruiters dont care. They will look unfavorable on a 2.9, no matter WHAT university its from.</p>

[Big_Brother_1984]

<p>
[quote]
It's a BAD thing if a curriculum is rigorous.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Well I wouldn't say it's a bad thing if the curriculum is rigorous. I would say it's a bad thing if the grading is ridiculously deflated :)</p>

[ammarsfound]

<p>yeah sorry thats what i meant. The ivies are renowned for grade inflation. Rigor depends on the courses you take obviously.</p>

[pinku2002]

<p>@ammarsfound: I am amazed you guys have had that great a result with Imperial , because frankly its not that easy a school to get in. </p>

<p>Honestly though , anecdotes aside its very hard to start comparing "prestige" and capability of colleges simply because a lot of factors play up , such as the field you are looking at and what the hell do you define as prestige. And to be very honest , recruiters arent so dumb as to recruit in absolutes of a 2.9 , there is always a relative comparison and people who are in this field KNOW the fact that certain schools are tougher than others and what a 2.9 at one school relatively means for another. And if all you guys are gonna compare is recruiting opportunities then one of the key factors quite honestly is location location LOCATION!!</p>

[Big_Brother_1984]

<p>I agree that ammarsfound has just but one anecdote. However, I do know one recent Imperial admit from Britain, and he really isn't the brightest guy in the world. I often times get confused by what he says on MSN IM simply because his writing is just so incomprehensible. He also had mediocre grades, and dropped out of a lot of classes in high school. I strongly suspect that even a moderately good student from Britain can make it into Imperial. Not so for the Ivy Leagues. You have to be exceptional to make it here.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Honestly though , anecdotes aside its very hard to start comparing "prestige" and capability of colleges simply because a lot of factors play up , such as the field you are looking at and what the hell do you define as prestige.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Google defines prestige as: "Social respect accorded to an individual or group because of the status of their position."</p>

<p>I agree about considering your major for the colleges you intend to apply to. That's why I've always told prospective engineering students that they should not go to Dartmouth.</p>

<p>But like I've always said, associated prestige is such a huge market value indicator partly based on cognitive biases, whether we like it or not. Top recruiters are going to hire at the places where they think they can get the best students for the job offers that they give. In this respect, the Ivies beat Berkeley. Hey, I wish this overlying cognitive bias wasn't true. But sadly, it is.</p>

<p>
[quote]
And to be very honest , recruiters arent so dumb as to recruit in absolutes of a 2.9 , there is always a relative comparison and people who are in this field KNOW the fact that certain schools are tougher than others and what a 2.9 at one school relatively means for another.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Oh I don't know about that. sakky did an interesting case analysis with med school admits from Berkeley vs. those from HYP. HYP students were accepted to med schools at an average GPA lower than the Berkeley average for med school admits. However, Berkeley pre-meds tend to have higher grade deflation! You would expect the reverse to happen - that med schools would compensate for Berkeley's tougher grading. Sadly, this isn't so.</p>

<p>This goes back to one of my points - that the economy runs effectively on market signals. HYP students are basically given the benefit of the doubt because as a collective group, they have proven to be excellent at whatever they do. Obviously, there are still a lot of students HYP that underperform. But hey, what can you do.</p>

<p>Basically, recruiters tend to recognize institutions of prestige. But it's honestly like purchasing a 2 L bottle of soda. Certainly there are some bad bottles of Coca Cola out there. But would you tend towards the no-name brand, or the Coca Cola brand? What would your brain tell you?</p>

<p>
[quote]
And if all you guys are gonna compare is recruiting opportunities then one of the key factors quite honestly is location location LOCATION!!

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Oh I don't know about that. Dartmouth is in the middle of nowhere New Hampshire, but still probably has the best Wall Street recruiting outside of HYPSM. Name branding definitely goes a long way.</p>

[Big_Brother_1984]

<p>I would also like to point out that humans are very impressionable, and tend to value things that they deem very difficult to obtain by their cognitive biases. This is why people always seem to want more. Even 1st generation Americans from China, who you'd think would have some perspective coming out of their impoverished circumstances - and I say this as the son of Asian immigrants. Not so!</p>

<p>So referring back to pinku, a lot of factors do play up with people's perceptions.</p>

<p>For example, I've lived in Ontario my entire life. I don't deem the University of Toronto as relatively prestigious at all per my preferences. However, it seems as if a LOT of international students would jump at the chance to go to UToronto, perhaps because of that big city, mysterious allure. This could be an explanation for the extremely biased THES rankings. Toronto = the name of a big city.</p>

<p>Similarly down in Georgia, people "meh" at Atlanta schools GA Tech and Emory, preferring to go out of state to lower ranked schools instead.</p>

<p>I also know a lot of people from Connecticut who chose other Ivies over Yale. I know several from Boston who preferred Dartmouth over Harvard.</p>

<p>It's like when the Atlanta Thrashers traded Dany Heatley over to the Ottawa Senators after his big "disaster". A change of scenery is always good, and people tend to enjoy more what they don't have. Because let's face it, matriculating to Harvard even though you've lived in Cambridge your entire life isn't exactly the most exciting move in the world.</p>

<p>But we have to downplay our cognitive preferences, and face the facts.</p>

[pinku2002]

<p>"Not so for the Ivy Leagues. You have to be exceptional to make it here. " - I Lol'ed! Being a multi ivy admit , im sorry I disagree!</p>

<p>"Oh I don't know about that. sakky did an interesting case analysis with med school admits from Berkeley vs. those from HYP. HYP students were accepted to med schools at an average GPA lower than the Berkeley average for med school admits. However, Berkeley pre-meds tend to have higher grade deflation! You would expect the reverse to happen - that med schools would compensate for Berkeley's tougher grading. Sadly, this isn't so.
This goes back to one of my points - that the economy runs effectively on market signals. HYP students are basically given the benefit of the doubt because as a collective group, they have proven to be excellent at whatever they do. Obviously, there are still a lot of students HYP that underperform. But hey, what can you do." - Honestly dont know much about med schools to say the least , but as far as recruiting is concerned , companies are not as brand concious as you would hope. If you are an achiever through and through , being from Berkeley or Imperial is not going change your situation much if you were from Dartmouth (again as far as jobs go). </p>

<p>"Oh I don't know about that. Dartmouth is in the middle of nowhere New Hampshire, but still probably has the best Wall Street recruiting outside of HYPSM. Name branding definitely goes a long way." - Go to the career centers of universities and you will realize what I mean by location. A lot of companies dont want to travel far and wide to recruit from certain campuses.
"For example, I've lived in Ontario my entire life. I don't deem the University of Toronto as relatively prestigious at all per my preferences. However, it seems as if a LOT of international students would jump at the chance to go to UToronto, perhaps because of that big city, mysterious allure." - Again personal prefrence cant really establish if a school is good or not , I definitely see the advantage of UofToronto being a foreigner i.e bypassing the H1B miracle. Heck , I even think Uof Waterloo is a great school cuz of its specialized programs.</p>

<p>Anyways , bottom line is there is no FACT stating Dartmouth has more prestige which is pretty much an intangible asset of any college, so either way its a moot point. As far as rankings go , they all have their own methodologies which I havent bothered into. College isnt about what the college is , its about what you make of it, you can be a Harvard Graduate and do nothing with your time there , or you can drop out and become a billionaire, its all upto you .</p>

[1of42]

<p>Big Brother: For the record, Berkely is probably among the top 10 hardest schools in America for Internationals to get into. For example (statistics come from the Chancellor of the university, whom I know personally), 79 students applied to Berkely for engineering this year, and 1 was admitted - the international acceptance rate at Berkely is <5%. While not all disciplines are as tough to get into as impacted majors like engineering, the level of difficulty is still far higher than the average statistics of students at the school and admit rate they would suggest.</p>

[slipper1234]

<p>THES and Shanghai are GRAD SCHOOL RANKINGS. Dartmouth is an UNDERGRAD school. Dartmouth beats out most Ivies in UNDERGRAD areas, which is 90% of what's relevant in college. Dartmouth throws grants at its students, spends the most of any school in the country, and is hyper selective (much more than Cal OOS). It only has professors teach (no TAs), and because of this its grad placement is the highest of the non-HYP Ivies.</p>

<p>Dartmouth has the best record of placing its grads into top grad schools and into top jobs of any school outside of HYPSM.</p>

<ol>
<li>Dartmouth spends more per student than any other Ivy and Cal by a SIGNIFICANT margin (COHE). This means more money for UNDERGRAD grants and research, better UNDERGRAD facilities, and more UNDERGRAD resources.</li>
<li>Dartmouth is richest non-HYP Ivy with 800K per student, This is 5 times richer than Cal on a per-student basis.</li>
<li>Dartmouth gets the more elite recruiters (consulting and finance) than all the Ivies except HYP and Wharton (4/5 elite consulting, 5/6 top banks)</li>
<li>Dartmouth has the strongest alum network outside of Princeton</li>
</ol>

<p>Dartmouth is a COLLEGE and it excels in all areas revelant to UNDERGRAD.</p>

[Big_Brother_1984]

<p>
[quote]
"Not so for the Ivy Leagues. You have to be exceptional to make it here. " - I Lol'ed! Being a multi ivy admit , im sorry I disagree!

[/quote]
</p>

<p>So what are you saying? That you don't have to be exceptional to make it? That you yourself are not exceptional? Honest questions really.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Honestly dont know much about med schools to say the least , but as far as recruiting is concerned , companies are not as brand concious as you would hope. If you are an achiever through and through , being from Berkeley or Imperial is not going change your situation much if you were from Dartmouth (again as far as jobs go).

[/quote]
</p>

<p>I agree that most companies aren't precisely "brand conscious", but that's because they're only striving to hiring the best employees that they can get. I think sakky can elaborate on this more, but he's posted several times already about engineering companies trying to hire at MIT, but stopped because they simply could not get any students there to accept their job offers. A lot of MIT students run off to consulting firms and iBanks, because let's be honest here, they're pretty sweet deals compared to being an engineer. It's almost become sort of a running joke that a lot of MIT engineering students will never actually become engineers themselves, opting to go off to Wall Street or something instead.</p>

<p>But you can check in with suze if you don't believe me. She'll tell you that Wall Street employees from the top firms mostly come from top-tier schools. Infact, during her internship, she didn't see anyone coming from lower tier schools. Companies like McKinsey, Google, Goldman Sachs - you better believe they're prestige conscious. It's the economically rational thing to do.</p>

<p>Most companies recruit the best students they can get. I should've been clearer - I wasn't talking about most companies.</p>

<p>
[quote]
If you are an achiever through and through , being from Berkeley or Imperial is not going change your situation much if you were from Dartmouth (again as far as jobs go).

[/quote]
</p>

<p>If only that was true. But hey, I don't make the rules to seem unfair. I'm only pointing out stuff as it is. Besides, it's not like you're at a huge disadvantage going to Berkeley. Plenty of graduates there do fine for themselves with Wall Street recruiting, med schools, etc. I'm only telling you that Dartmouth has always had the upper hand with IB Analyst recruiting and other post-graduate opportunities. </p>

<p>However, what if you're an all-star student at a no-name university? That's when it gets interesting. But Berkeley is not a no-name university. Far from it infact.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Again personal prefrence cant really establish if a school is good or not , I definitely see the advantage of UofToronto being a foreigner i.e bypassing the H1B miracle. Heck , I even think Uof Waterloo is a great school cuz of its specialized programs.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Hey, I think UToronto and UW are great schools too. But they're not the greatest in my mind. The UofT allure seems to be with people from outside of Canada. I know that I wouldn't want to be at UofT after living in the city for almost half of my life.</p>

<p>
[quote]
While not all disciplines are as tough to get into as impacted majors like engineering, the level of difficulty is still far higher than the average statistics of students at the school and admit rate they would suggest.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>That's very interesting 1of42. My friend was planning on going into Architecture. I'm not sure if you've taken notice, but there are a LOT of Canadians that made it into Berkeley this year. Personally, the price tag was a major turnoff for me. But that just probably means that the applicant pool was financially self-selective. For instate students (which comprise 93% of the population at Berkeley - thereby taking a lot of seats away from out-of-state and International students), a superb academic record and solid SAT scores are usually sufficient enough for an acceptance. If you're a good student from California, you're going to get into Berkeley unless something fruity happens (and stuff like that happens all the time).</p>

<p>But hey, the International acceptance rates at most top-tier colleges in the States are abysmal. It's a pretty tough call for us Internationals.</p>

[spencer11111]

<p>

@Big Brother 1984

I also dare you to tell me, a Canadian, that the University of Toronto is better than Brown, Dartmouth, or Seoul National.</p>

<p>Come on, I dare you.

I have no idea why you mentioned Seoul National here. May be it is one of the most "selective" school around, rejecting many people from the top 0.5% of the cohort, but this fact alone does not make it a top school! UTokyo is infinitely better than Seoul National in all aspects, and SNU is at most a second-tier university when compare to all those in Japan. Oh... so you are an Asian, may be you are a Canadian-Korean? Who knows.</p>

[spencer11111]

<p>

@Big Brother 1984

Well, you can believe what you want. But other posters on CC also have eyes and brains, and they can interpret what they see. They'll see UC Berkeley being ranked higher than Princeton, or Imperial being ranked higher than Princeton. How do you explain that? UC Berkeley is a great school but come on, at the undergraduate level, it's no Princeton.</p>

<p>I think what you're trying to say is that the THES is a valid ranking system. Most of us here aren't the biggest fans of rankings at all. But hey, you started the argument with them, so let's deal with them.</p>

<p>You also haven't answered my question about UT Austin being above Dartmouth. Are you going to tell me now that UT Austin is unequivocally, the better school?</p>

<p>Invoking the the rankings is very weak to begin with. But hey, if you're such a huge follower of them, then we'll all deal with them just for your sake. But first, answer the question above.

You have a huge cognitive bias against Berkeley and Imperial, and you are placing Dartmouth above them solely because you are going there. Yes I believe that Imperial is slightly over-ranked for 2006. Its rightful position should be about 12-14, sharing place with LSE, and above Cornell, Duke and UPenn, Brown and definitely Dartmouth.</p>

<p>In my country, both UTAustin and Dartmouth are unknown, unlike all the other schools placed in the top 20 :D. I don't know how many even bother to apply to them.</p>

[spencer11111]

<p>

@Big Brother 1984

I would argue that prestige is an important market value indicator to employers, professions, etc. and that prestige and opportunities are more correlated than you would think. It just so happens that the THES and Jiaotong rankings don't really do a good job of documenting these market values.

THES and Shanghai Jiaotong did a good job of documenting these market values from an international perspective. Harvard, Cambridge and Oxford are all household names. Dartmouth? And you are placing Dartmouth on top of Cambridge and Oxford on another thread!</p>

<p>What are some of the world leaders/presidents/prime ministers graduating from Dartmouth? Care to list some?</p>

[spencer11111]

<p>

@Big Brother 1984

That isn't the case though. UChicago Math may be top notch, but MIT and Harvard aren't a walk in the park either, you know. Even though UChicago Math is top notch, we can all agree that the general student body population at Chicago is weaker than the ones at Harvard and MIT. Along with general prestige, Harvard and MIT are just better indicators of high market value.</p>

<p>Because let's face it, if you're an employer looking for top-notch employees, you'd like minimize your search costs, but still get good workers. So if you're McKinsey or Goldman Sachs, where would you go to get the best people who will take your job offers? At the Ivies or other top-tier schools. The fact stands that although UChicago has some great programs, it doesn't have as strong of a market value as say - most Ivy Leagues. It's called name branding.</p>

<p>But can you see how this would affect those MIT/Harvard math majors? Although their curriculum may not be as rigorous, those math majors can just ride under the MIT/Harvard brand name. Would you say that Coca Cola is "over-valued" compared to some no-name brand? But people would purchase Coca Cola anyways huh?

Yes Harvard and MIT have great brand-names, no disputes of that. In THES, Harvard and MIT are #1 and #4 respectively. But how about Dartmouth?</p>

[brand_182]

<p>
[quote]
Anyway I am going to attend Imperial College, UK this coming autumn, as it is more prestigious than lower Ivies like Cornell

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Perhaps that is the public thought in England since the nation only has ~10 world-renowned schools. Here in the US, where there are many excellent educational institutions, people choose their undergraduate college based on many things, often in addition to or besides research. </p>

<p>The premise of your argument is that, in order for a college to be "good," it must be a strong research institution and, for some reason, must rank highly on the THES ranking. I inquire then why top LACs and other universities less known for research (Brown, Amherst, Dartmouth, etc.) all turn out people that have a dramatic impact on the world. Are the graduates of the college education not also a testament to the excellence of the school? You give too much credibility to research when in fact there are other measures that reflect a school's quality.</p>

[spencer11111]

<p>

@Big Brother 1984

Hey, we can hear you. Nobody disputes that Caltech is far more difficult of a school than Dartmouth is. But for some reason, the Dartmouth name has a higher market value than Caltech, especially with regards to professional schools (most notoriously, med schools), iBankers, private equity firms, etc. So it can't be just the curriculum rigor now, can it?</p>

<p>I hate to keep bringing up anecdotes, but I think this one is very appropriate. There's a senior graduating this year from Caltech who applied to a wide variety of med schools. He got into none, and was waitlisted from the Duke and Dartmouth med schools - which means that he may not have gotten into any med school at all. IMO, I believe he was a far more qualified candidate than most of the pre-meds at Dartmouth. So why did he get shanked like that? It can't be just about Caltech having better academics now, can it?

That's where my central argument comes in. Dartmouth curriculum is a walk in the park when compare to Caltech's. It is so much easier to get good grades from Dartmouth than Caltech. In some ways, surviving in Caltech alone is quite a commendable achievement (all the all-nighters, insane exams...), while people at Dartmouth have it easy. In the US, some people have a ridiculously high perception of Dartmouth (because of the flawed US News). I remember a time when I attended a public lecture on number theory. When the speaker mentioned that he graduated from Caltech BS Physics, we (the audience) let off a wow!, knowing that Physics is the niche subject of Caltech and he must have been through that unsurvivable academic boot-camp. If he was from Dartmouth, I guess we would ask: Why is he even there? Where is Dartmouth? Never heard of it!</p>

[Big_Brother_1984]

<p>
[quote]
I have no idea why you mentioned Seoul National here. May be it is one of the most "selective" school around, rejecting many people from the top 0.5% of the cohort, but this fact alone does not make it a top school! UTokyo is infinitely better than Seoul National in all aspects, and SNU is at most a second-tier university when compare to all those in Japan. Oh... so you are an Asian, may be you are a Canadian-Korean? Who knows.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>I still find Seoul National's rankings very dubious. A lot of SNU grads go on to get amazing post-graduate opportunities, and the school itself is very highly coveted in South Korea. But hey, are you still trying to justify the rankings to us? Answer my question.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Oh... so you are an Asian, may be you are a Canadian-Korean? Who knows.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Is this another ad hominem? I am a Canadian-Vietnamese actually. But why should that matter? Do you think I'm actually racially biased towards my own race/country of origin?</p>

<p>
[quote]
You have a huge cognitive bias against Berkeley and Imperial, and you are placing Dartmouth above them solely because you are going there.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Find me proof that I am cognitively biased against Berkeley and Imperial. Oh can't do it can you? I've simply presented the facts to show you why certain schools do better than others. I've also lauded Berkeley on many occasions, so how does that make me cognitively biased? All you've stated was that Dartmouth was a "good" school, but then proceeded to bash it throughout all of your posts. Let's be honest here, this thread is about you bashing Dartmouth. Just admit it. </p>

<p>
[quote]
Its rightful position should be about 12-14, sharing place with LSE, and above Cornell, Duke and UPenn, Brown and definitely Dartmouth.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Quite frankly, most people here don't care how the THES rankings look. I'm sure you do, but most of us here just don't care. Just incase you didn't notice.</p>

<p>
[quote]
In my country, both UTAustin and Dartmouth are unknown, unlike all the other schools placed in the top 20 . I don't know how many even bother to apply to them.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Checkmate. My response to this would be, why wouldn't UT Austin and Dartmouth have the same ranking then? If they're equally as bad, then why not omit them from the THES rankings altogether?</p>

<p>It's a simple yes or no question. Is UT Austin unequivocally, the better school? Stop equivocating. Answer the question.</p>

[Big_Brother_1984]

<p>
[quote]
That's where my central argument comes in. Dartmouth curriculum is a walk in the park when compare to Caltech's. It is so much easier to get good grades from Dartmouth than Caltech. In some ways, surviving in Caltech alone is quite a commendable achievement (all the all-nighters, insane exams...), while people at Dartmouth have it easy.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>You called out Dartmouth in comparison with Caltech. But why not Caltech vs. Princeton? Caltech vs. Harvard? Caltech vs. Yale?</p>

<p>What's fair is fair. If you're going to highlight the difficulty of the school, you have to do it for all relevant scenarios. Let's face it, Caltech is probably the most difficult school in the country (that or MIT). So what do you have to say to the students of Harvard, Princeton, and Yale?</p>

<p>
[quote]
I remember a time when I attended a public lecture on number theory. When the speaker mentioned that he graduated from Caltech BS Physics, we (the audience) let off a wow!, knowing that Physics is the niche subject of Caltech and he must have been through that unsurvivable academic boot-camp. If he was from Dartmouth, I guess we would ask: Why is he even there? Where is Dartmouth? Never heard of it!

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Interesting you make this call, because this actually strengthens my point. Caltech is perceived as a very science-like institution. Let's be honest here. Were you impressed by the mere fact that the lecturer was from Caltech, or that his presentation was actually interesting? You truly are, extremely cognitively biased.</p>

<p>And believe me. I know more Number Theory than you will ever know in your entire life.</p>

<p>But really, what's with these unfair comparisons? Comparing Dartmouth to Caltech? I want you to admit it - right now. This thread is about you bashing Dartmouth. You haven't proven a point to anyone here. You weren't able to get anyone on your side. Why do you insist on fighting a battle that you just can't win? Listen, you should just give up bro.</p>

<p>If you're going to make comparisons, you have to consider every single scenario. What's fair is fair.</p>

[spencer11111]

<p>

@Big Brother 1984

Well of course Dartmouth loses out in research - it is a de facto LAC after all. I also think UC Berkeley is a great school, but I don't think it's the 9th greatest school in the country either. Consider the undergraduate aspects. Berkeley loses out in post-graduate opportunities to Dartmouth. Berkeley has a long tail-end of unexceptional students (face it, a LOT of Berkeley students are unexceptional). I would actually argue that MORE undergraduate research happens at Dartmouth than at Berkeley. UCB, while a great school, isn't exactly the most personal place to get your education.

US News places Dartmouth as a university, not LAC. Dartmouth should not use the LAC excuse to cover its poor showing in world university rankings.

@Big Brother 1984]<br> Uh...I never did say that Cornell has a stronger reputation than Caltech or Princeton. It might have a stronger market value than Caltech does though.</p> <p>[/quote]</p> <p>Caltech may not land you into good finance positions because it is a tech school! I bet Caltech land you better at Google than Cornell does. And a Caltech grad deserves more respect than a Cornell one.</p> <p>[quote=Big Brother 1984

Oh I don't know about that. Reputation wise, most employers here won't have heard of Imperial.

That's full of crap. I tell you why:
<a href="http://www.google.com/trends?q=Dartmouth+College%2C+Imperial+College&ctab=0&geo=all&date=all&sort=0%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.google.com/trends?q=Dartmouth+College%2C+Imperial+College&ctab=0&geo=all&date=all&sort=0&lt;/a>
Imperial College is a clear win, even though the US dominates the internet search engine hits.
Now don't try to draw a crappy analogy by comparing the popularity of key words "Cornell" to "Imperial College". Cornell means many things, like "Chris Cornell leaving Audioslave". If you want to play fair and square, compare "Cornell" to "Imperial" instead.</p>

[brand_182]

<p>
[quote]
You called out Dartmouth in comparison with Caltech.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>It's obvious that this guy only has respect for science/math oriented schools. What he fails to realize is that Dartmouth/Brown/etc. graduates go on to MIT/Caltech/Imperial/whatever graduate math/science programs in great numbers, so the theory that the education at Dartmouth/Brown/etc. is a "cakewalk" is either crap or all of the undergraduates are just magically ready to take on graduate level math/science at the best schools in the world.</p>

<p>I'm willing to bet that the more logical answer - that they receive a strong education from Dartmouth which prepares them for Caltech/etc. grad programs - is true.</p>