Is it better to go to an Ivy for undergraduate for law/med later?

<p>so i've read that going to an ivy like yale can mean a lower gpa than at an easier school like a state uni.</p>

<p>do law schools* and med schools* care more about whether you did good at your school or whether you went to an ivy and did less amazing?</p>

<p>for instance, would it be easier to get into harvard law/med if one went to harvard undergrad or NYU and did way better at NYU than the person could at harvard?</p>

<p>i've also read that LSAT scores are higher at schools like harvard/yale/mit. does it mean then that you should go to an ivy for undergrad and then a great law school?</p>

<p>overall question: undergrad easy school with great GPA or ivy league with lower GPA to get into med schools/law schools?</p>

<p>*my sibling is considering the other. im not going for both</p>

<p>from what ive heard, it basically doesn’t matter where you go for undergrad as long as you have a stellar app (as long as its not a **** school). I know that for architecture, I’ve seen people go from NJIT for undergrad and end up at Yale for grad.</p>

<p>so, id rather go to NYU and do awesome for undergrad (and enjoy the city as well) then go to an ivy for grad</p>

<p>It does matter to some schools. Some law schools such as Boalt at UC Berkeley give different weight to GPAs depending on which undergraduate school you graduated from. Swarthmore College for example will be given more weight for a 3.7 than a 3.7 at say Boston University. </p>

<p>So again it does matter which undergrad you scored your GPA at. Frankly I like this method better because a 3.5 at my own undergrad should count more than a 4.0 at Podunk University. </p>

<p><a href=“http://web.archive.org/web/20000829094953/http://www.pcmagic.net/abe/gradeadj.htm[/url]”>http://web.archive.org/web/20000829094953/http://www.pcmagic.net/abe/gradeadj.htm&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>The MCAT and LSAT scores are very important, as well as exposure to the field through volunteer work or lab experiences. Another thing to consider is that professor recommendations may be easier to come by at a smaller school where the prof isn’t being asked to make 210 students all seem uniquely qualified.</p>

<p>Another thing to consider is cost. Both law school and med school are very expensive, and it is getting more and more difficult to find jobs for new law school graduates. So unless money is no object, it might make more sense to attend a school down a tier or two from the Ivies where you could get great merit scholarships, more personal attention from profs and lab exposure/volunteer or intern opportunities for the budding lawyer, and save some money for law/medical school. And you could have the higher GPA, which would counter the lower GPA from the more respected school.</p>

<p>med schools won’t care as long as the school is “decent” (which is many/most schools). </p>

<p>Someone who gets a 3.4 from a top school would not get chosen over someone with a 3.7 from a good school (if everything else is equal). </p>

<p>Med schools also don’t care about your major. You don’t get brownie points for double majors or sexy-sounding majors. </p>

<p>You don’t get a pass for a 3.4 in engineering, even tho that major is one of the most challenging.</p>

<p>For med school, you want the best cum GPA, best BCMP GPA, best MCAT, good LORs, good medically-related volunteering and ECs, research, etc.</p>

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<p>FYI, the law school at UC Berkeley has dropped the “Boalt Hall” moniker: </p>

<p>“In April 2008, the law school rebranded itself from “Boalt Hall” to “Berkeley Law”, in order to more closely tie the law school’s name with the campus upon which it resides. The administration hopes that this move will further increase the law school’s prestige, since people will now associate it with the Berkeley campus.” (Wikipedia)</p>

<p>Most law schools dont really care where you went — they just care about high LSAT scores and GPA so they can look good in the rankings.</p>

<p>Ivies are actually known for their grade inflation, so you won’t necessarily get a lower GPA at a top school than you would at a public university.</p>

<p>Generally speaking, law and medical school care more about how you did than where you went. A 3.9 from Penn State is more likely to get in than a 3.4 from Harvard. But like I said, don’t assume that you’ll get a higher GPA at a public university.</p>

<p>Also that website is from 2000.</p>

<p>Ivies except Princeton (for the first one) will give you higher grades, better advising, and a better-respected education.</p>

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Princeton obviously hasn’t read this memo. </p>

<p>Joking aside, those of us here at Princeton do hold out hope that med/law schools will give weight to the rigor of the institution. For instance, Princeton is a top-tier school and grade deflates. A Princeton GPA is NOT equivalent to a state school GPA, or even GPA from another Ivy (this latter aspect is debatable, as med/law schools may not care that much about grade deflation). Even though Princeton grade deflates, there are still a disproportionately large number of Princeton grads at top law/med schools. I happen to know that Princeton has a very good relationship with Stanford Law. People frequently bring up the argument that Princeton grads, by virtue of the original selective college admissions process, already represent an intelligent, motivated pool, so higher numbers do get into med/law school. However, from the GPA/MCAT vs. admittance rate data I’ve seen, the undergraduate institution seems to give a slight edge. </p>

<p>I mean, this is all speculative. IMO, the haves will always hope that med/law schools give weight to their undergraduate institutions while the have-nots will always hope that grads from top-tier colleges don’t have an advantage in law/med school admissions.</p>

<p>^ So not true. If you adjust for quality of students you will not get higher grades if you go to an Ivy.</p>

<p>I have seen so many 4.0 community college, state school students who were struggling to get above a 3.0 after transferring into top universities. This is even when they already have some experience with college.</p>

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<p>Maybe. Not necessarily true again. Check studentdoctor.com and you are gonna see harvard students with average GPAs getting into top med schools at higher frequencies than you can imagine. And most of these Harvard undergrads with 3.4s do get higher MCAT scores too…</p>

<p>All this grade inflation nonsense of Ivy versus Public that you hear people talk about needs some reality check though.</p>

<p>^I agree, though the other Ivies really do have a grade inflation problem. At one point, Harvard was giving out 50% A’s in its humanities courses.</p>

<p>Check studentdoctor.com and you are gonna see harvard students with average GPAs getting into top med schools at higher frequencies than you can imagine</p>

<p>Do you mean SDN? </p>

<p>I don’t see many unhooked H grads with average GPAs getting into ivy meds. I see HYPS grads getting into top meds because all of their stats are stellar.</p>

<p>I see ivy grads with average GPAs getting rejected from top SOMs. I see ivy grads with NO SOM admissions. </p>

<p>Going to an elite undergrad is not a guarantee of getting a high MCAT score nor is it a ticket to med school. Elite undergrads aren’t doing anything special to help their students get higher MCAT scores.</p>

<p>What often happens is that students who are naturally high test scorers go to elite undergrads, and then they take their high scoring testing talents with them when they take the MCAT and voila…a high MCAT score. And none of that happened because they went to an elite undergrad.</p>

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<p>Damn, that would have been nice. It was 5-10% in most of my classes at UCLA. (assuming you don’t count A-s as As.)</p>

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<p>“easier”? Perhaps not. But the fact is that many students who attend HLS and HMS, also attended H undergrad. However, you also have to recognize that the MCAT is ~55% of earning a med interview, and Harvard undergrad selects for top testers (SAT/ACT). Thus, it’s students have the highest mean LSAT scores (and possibly MCAT, which is not published).</p>

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<p>There is a reason that the article you posted is from the Archives. It is no longer true. (The press quickly realized that such a policy by Boalt disfavored the Cal Staters, many of whom were low income and persons of color – really bad policy, which was dropped.)</p>

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<p>Officially, yes, but as Dean Edley noted at the time: The school will still be called Boalt “within the family,” he said.</p>

<p>*Quote:
At one point, Harvard was giving out 50% A’s in its humanities courses.
*</p>

<p>But what is it doing in the STEM classes? those are typically the weeder classes and those are the ones that are computed in the BCMP GPA (except eng’g classes). There are often a ton of premeds in those classes, so if only 25% or less are getting A’s in those classes, then there will be a lot of disappointed premeds.</p>

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<p>I actually meant mdapplicants. Not all Ivy Med Schools are good but with regards to say top 20-25 med school, I have seen Harvard undergrads get into top 20 med schools with a 3.4. Not going to discuss Public Schools but coming out of places like Emory, Vandy and such you would need like a 3.6-3.7+ to get into. Of course getting into med school has multiple variables so maybe the students had something else that was attractive while applying say better research experience or ECs.</p>

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<p>Yes it is true but the point is that a 3.4 from Harvard will offer more opportunities than people realize. </p>

<p>A 3.4 in my undergrad as premed and you would be looking at a post-bac SMP or a Caribbean medical school as an option. </p>

<p>A 3.4 from Harvard you at least have the option of going to an MD med school in America. Good research experience with a paper and strong MCAT scores and you have a shot at a top-20.</p>

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<p>I think you would have to break down the courses. Humanities is a broad term and this is not the case for STEM or Economics. Grade-Inflation is usually a big problem for humanities due to the subjectivity of the field and the fact that there are no right or wrong answers. In science where there are right or wrong answers grade-inflation is less of a problem.</p>

<p>Of course grade-inflation is also relative- the fact that grades are increasing over the years without significant changes in test scores/ admission statistics of students at a University.</p>

<p>But I still think that for the ivies versus other schools most people make it sound that going to an ivy league school is a walk in the park academically while going to a public school is much more challenging and so you should pick an ivy league school if you want better grades lol.</p>

<p>So say we are talking about UCONN pre-med versus Yale pre-med (or math majors). It would be better to go to Yale because even though my GPA will be higher at UCONN (most likely), Yale’s GPA will be raised because med schools know that it has a tougher curriculum? Can someone explain grade inflation to me a little more? Does it mean that state schools are giving out easy GPA’s so med schools are lowering their GPA’s on applications and raising those from Ivies because those are harder?</p>