Is it wrong to not want to overpay?

Parents Forum
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“Based on my experience, I want to steer her away from the Duke’s of the spectrum and onto the honors colleges at State schools (including OOS) that would provide merit aid and bring the cost down from our EFC. I just can’t figure out if this is unfair to her.”

To me, “being fair” just means communicating how or what you are willing to contribute in an accurate and timely manner. It doesn’t mean sending her to the “best” school or maxing out what you could possibly pay for college.

It’s fair to tell her that if she is cost-conscious about undergrad, you will be in a position to help her with grad school, but that if she is full pay at a pricey college, she’ll be on her own after four years. It’s fair for parents to say, "We can contribute X dollars towards your four year education (or $X per year). If parents are unwilling to cosign any loans, say so before the kid starts applying anywhere, and likewise if you are willing to cosign, set a dollar limit up front. It is fair to say, "You can only go to Prestige U if you can get enough merit aid to make it work (and define “enough”). It is fair to tell your student that you will only fund four years (or whatever you can afford) and then they’re on their own - as long as you say that in a timely manner (i.e. before college starts).

It is not fair - and it happened the last two years on CC - for a parent (no matter how well-meaning) to say “Don’t worry about the cost,” and the kid gets in somewhere and the parents then say they can’t afford it. It’s not fair to refuse to give your kid any idea of college finances. If you can’t afford anything, say so when the kid is still a high school freshman and can choose to work to save up money and work hard on their academics in hopes of getting scholarships.

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There can be a tendency on College Confidential to forget that money discussions can be some of the most emotionally fraught kind of discussions out there. Add in parenting decisions before, during and after college selection and I am almost surprised at how amazingly good most of the discussion on CC manages to be! :wink:

We are a full-pay family (reasonably determined and I try to hold on to the gratitude I feel in our luck/good fortune to be in that position). We also understood how much college tuition had increased literally years before our first child would be ready to apply to college (another huge benefit that can’t be underestimated) which gave us a lot of time to think about what we were able and willing to do, as well as plenty of time to look into school affordability.

We decided early on that our firm budget was nowhere near the top range of COAs for colleges. Setting a budget of what you can reasonably pay and are willing to pay is (imo) the biggest step in a college search. It can also one of the hardest. The only thing I think can compare to budget setting is the maxim of finding two true safety schools (easily affordable, guaranteed admittance, child would be excited to attend)

With a budget set early in the process, we found a good amount of schools that fit our financial parameters and our daughter’s wish list. Some of these schools are really exciting, some less so. But all of them are schools she is willing to attend. Each one has at least 3 things she really liked.

We also had some hard conversations when schools that don’t fit our budget hit our daughter’s radar. Explaining there would be no financial need found on any college’s NPC and we weren’t willing to pay $80k a year wasn’t fun for any of us. There were tears aplenty (and we had given a budget years in advance for what we were willing to pay, so even if you give this info early realize it doesn’t always really sink in). But (again, imo) this is what being a parent entails. We took full responsibility for the decision we had made, told our daughter it was reasonable for her to be disappointed (and mad at us) and, nope we weren’t changing our minds.

She got over it. I think it was easier because we took on the responsibility and the blame. And then also told her that she needed to practice some gratitude for having the budget she was given which should ensure she can attend a good school and can graduate without debt.

Good luck in this process, as so many other have said, these decisions are so personal. One last thing, very few decisions are permanent. We make the best decisions we can with the information we have at the time. And most decisions can be made again (and again and again). Student loan debt, however, is almost as permanent as it comes. Which is something to take very seriously when setting your budget.

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Most retail car purchases are of used cars, because most people find new cars to be too expensive. For many people, car choice is repairing the old beater that broke down or will not pass inspection, versus buying a slightly better beater that may last a year or two before needing a significant repair. Just like the college choice being between commuting to a barely affordable local school that does not have the desired major or taking unwisely large loans to study the desired major where living at the college at extra cost is needed.

Yes, if you are choosing between a new Hyundai Accent versus a new BMW 7-series, both will get you to your destination. But if you have only enough money to repair your 20 year old Kia Sephia or buy a 15 year old Mitsubishi Mirage to replace it, then reliability may be less assured.

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I’m always fascinated by this discussion and appreciate that not everyone can afford to give their children carte blanche when it comes to paying for their child’s education. I also don’t see the need for some people to say that certain highly ranked schools aren’t worth their tuition.
The reality is the schools are worth what people are willing to pay for them. I don’t see Georgetown, BU , whatever expensive private school you want seeing a decrease in applicants or having to discount their tuition across the board to bring in students.
My family has always valued education so much so that when my father died my Senior year in high school my mother worked two jobs so I came out of school (undergrad and dental school) debt free. As a result when my children were young I started saving in a 529 so whatever they were capable of attaining wouldn’t be restricted by finances.
I have friends with the means to do what I’m doing for my children but have opted to restrict what they are paying for because they finished school with student loans. They feel that their children can attain whatever they want from a state school and will pay for that alone. As a result, their children worked to a level to gain acceptance to these schools and never really drove themselves to excel to attain anything more. I’m not talking UNC…
They think I’m crazy for my daughter going to UVa even though we live in North Carolina and she was accepted to UNC. She aspires to work on Wall Street and feels there is an advantage to McIntire over Kenan-Flagler, who am I to argue she’s worked hard to get there.
My best take on this is similar to what I tell my patients almost daily when replacing missing teeth. The least expensive option will be a partial but esthetically it’s not ideal, functionally you have to adjust and it comes in and out at night. If we do a bridge I have to cut down the adjacent teeth and potentially compromise them but functionally and esthetically it’s hard to differentiate between that and your own teeth. Finally we can place implant(s). In essence I am putting a tooth back where you lost it without affecting any surround teeth but it’s 3x the cost of a partial and 1.5-2x the cost of a bridge.
I can tell you technically what each option is but ultimately what determines how you proceed is “what value does it have to you.” That’s up to the individual…

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OP here - thanks so much for all of your thoughts. You are all right - this is a very personal situation. Like most things, my perspective has been shaped by my life experience. Other people have had different experiences. I suppose there is no right answer. Thanks for the feedback.

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@beebee3 I agree with your post. I was very clear with my husband about the cost of some of the schools on s19’s list. I told him a year in advance that, if he wasn’t open to paying full price at a private school, we needed to tell S19. We had schools on the list where we thought S19 would get merit but none of it was guaranteed. Even with very careful consideration of each school, it was still a struggle to decide if we should go ahead and let him apply to full price schools. We gave him the go ahead.

But…when the time came to make the decision, it was still hard to pull the trigger. We had a serious discussion with him about his options in April. We told him that we didn’t limit his list and we wouldn’t limit his choices but he clearly had a school we all thought was a winner that would save us $100k over four years. In the end, he revisited this school and Bowdoin. They had a lot of similarities but my husband did see some reasons to choose Bowdoin over Grinnell while he attended the parent meetings at admitted student days. Still, we waited almost two weeks to put the deposit down. S19 made a list of pros and cons for the two schools since my husband told him to do that research and make his case. S19 had also been talking to his friends - many of whom were having to take loans for the elite schools they were hoping to attend. In the end, out S19 gave us a very humble speech about how he knows there’s a big price difference. He made his case as to why he preferred Bowdoin. He also said, though, that he would understand if we changed our minds and we were leaning towards Grinnell because of price. In the end, we agreed with his assessment of both schools and were proud that he didn’t show any kind of entitlement when making this final choice. He had even figured out what his payments would be if he took the federal unsubsidized loan and was willing to take them if we let him choose Bowdoin. It was at that point that we felt comfortable with the more expensive school.

I tell this story because our decision was not cut and dry from the beginning. And, even at the end, it was a struggle to make it final. Money issues are complicated for sure.

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We valued both the quality of the education and the price to us. Not sure why some seem to say it’s one or the other. Back then, not all colleges had a Net Price Calculator, so we sat on pins and needles until FA info came.

The choice isn’t “good” education vs crappy/affordable. It’s finding a good education at the price you can afford. That leaves tons of choices.

And we explored the costs as best we could, before the first applied. We looked rationally at what a great match would be, for her interests and strengths.

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Not true. Sometimes there is a very clear, obvious answer. You don’t talk your parents into co-signing loans when they are in dire straits financially. I’ve seen it happen. Adoring, trusting parents who want the best for their children and don’t know the way things work for college. They think it’s what everyone does.

Also parents who have much more than they can possibly need other than for a personal power play or ego trip, and refuse to pay for college for those same two reasons, power and ego. Seen that too. Usually in a divorce situation

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The OP’s mind was made up before asking the question. Of course no one should “overpay.” Use of the word overpay makes your view point clear.

An underlying question is whether or not more expensive schools are worth it, a debate that influences many of the threads in this forum.

The other underlying question is whether or not parents should decide not to pay for a more expensive school when they have the ability to do so.

A lot of this comes down to what is best for an individual student as well as what is a reasonable financial compromise.

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I’d put it, “What’s best for a family,” not just this one child.

Having the “ability” to pay, but making a rational decision what they will pay, is not as simple as whether they believe in/support the child or not. It’s not as simple as indulging them because you have it.

It’s not inherently unfair to say, “We’re loaded, but 320k is not the budget when there are so many fine choices where you will be empowered, grow, gain a fine education, and go on to make your mark, in life.”

@ultimom There is no finite list of great colleges. It’s something driven home on CC, all the time. Depending on the major and the overall match, one can receive a great education in scores of schools, no matter that they’re less pricey.

Kids often think their wealthy parents should pay more. They’re kids.

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One last comment:

We have three college graduates now, and all of them have said that the best gift we ever gave them was to graduate debt free from undergrad. Two attended instate public colleges, one went to an inexpensive out of state public. None of them attended the most expensive college that accepted them.

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Agreed, decision should be based on family considerations.

Also agreed that there is no finite list of great colleges. However, some are better than others and it is a disservice to pretend it isn’t so.

My kid assumed he would go to the least expensive option until we reassured him we could afford his top choice. Raising more affluent kids is not always easy. You also don’t know how merit aid will play out.

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Yes! I agree.

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@ultimom exactly right, the title says it all and attempts to claim that 40k EFC is overpaying. I disagree, especially if one has been planning and saving for college educational costs for their kids all along the way. It’s much easier to say that paying the average cost of attendance is “overpaying” or “outrageous” and to rationalize that decision by stating “it doesn’t matter where one goes to college…” instead of admitting that maybe a big mistake was made in the process. And the question posed was is it unfair to the kid. Hard to say…every family needs to answer that question for themselves.

We see many variations of these types of threads and many times it boils down to a lack of preparation and real planning for expected college costs.

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@socaldad2002 Actually, the OP stated that they can afford to cover their EFC, they just don’t see the value in paying for a more expensive school, especially for a student that plans on grad/professional school. I don’t know why you keep insisting the OP is just trying to rationalize having “made a big mistake” by not saving and that they can’t afford a more expensive school anyway. The whole issue is that they CAN, but don’t think its really worth it. Plenty of people share that sentiment, and not just because they didn’t “plan ahead” or don’t value education.

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A good contrast is law and medicine. If you want a job in big law or a judicial clerkship, there’s a clear advantage to a T14 or at least top 50 law school. Medicine is a much more flat field, where employers and patients principally care about whether you are board eligible in your specialty. Where you went to med school matters very little in terms of future compensation.

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@ultimom: “However, some are better than others and it is a disservice to pretend it isn’t so.”

Actually, it’s more the case that many schools are different from each other and some are better in some respects (might be worse or not applicable or indifferent as a feature in others) depending on the kid, goals, how undecided they are, and a plethora of variables. Also that there is a bigger gap in opportunities between the average state flagship level and a the lowest tier than between average state school and elite (which is what most people on her focus on).

I’m making the distinction because unlike a car or a house, what someone gets out of a school isn’t just dependent on the school but also the person.

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“what someone gets out of a school isn’t just dependent on the school but also the person.”

If I could write this 1000x I would. It’s so true.

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No one can deny that elite schools get attention, bring prestige and get you through many social, academic and employment doors. Is it possible to be successful without name tag? Absolutely. Is it worth to make a financial sacrifice? That differs case by case. There are no guarantees of kid going to medical or graduate school, if you can afford to give her an edge, do it. If you can’t, it’s okay.