<p>One thing that concerns me in this discussion is the assumption some people seem to be making that a child who develops academic skills early is necessarily gifted.</p>
<p>Sometimes, this doesn’t turn out to be the case. A child who reads early or can do fairly sophisticated things with numbers early may end up being a rather ordinary student later on, and a child who doesn’t excel academically in kindergarten may turn out to be a top student in the higher grades.</p>
<p>I have known kids of both types. The second type seems to turn out fine, but the advanced kindergartner who ends up being an unremarkable student later may suffer as a result of parental disappointment. </p>
<p>@Marian, I think that’s true, and there are many later bloomers who catch up to the earlier ones. But is it a reason to bore the kids who were ahead, who have the interest and ability right then and there? It’s a big long “teachable moment” that’s being thrown in the trash by our professional educators. And perhaps that early bloomer might not have turned out so ordinary if they hadn’t been put on the ordinary track…</p>
<p>Well, actually I should qualify that. The kids in my kids’ kindergarten classes have had a chance to grow up now. And the ones who most impressed me, academically, back in K-1st grade, are all NMSF. The others, not. I feel I could predict the results for my younger daughter’s K-1 cohort as well. Will be interesting to see in a few years.</p>
<p>I read before kindergarten, but as academics were not stressed in kindergarten, I was not bored.
Instead we spent our time in hands on activities that were art or science based.</p>
<p>I think classrooms should be much smaller in K-2. Voters passed funding to reduce class size, but principals were allowed to use the funds for augmenting salaries with teacher training, so class sizes are still huge.</p>
<p>Just because my kids had a different experience than many doesn’t mean that I necessarily thought they were superior to other children, merely that I had the power to procure a more child appropriate environment for them.
It also was a relief to be in a setting where parents were not threatened when my daughter showed skills their children had not yet mastered, or condescending when she had a delay in other areas.
In particular, both the Waldorf school and the Montessori school were wigged out by early reading, but I found schools that were more child directed and experiential.</p>
<p>Id also agree that students may demonstrate precociousness at a very young age, but that does not necessarily mean that they truly demonstrate " giftedness" in their thinking. The reverse is also true. Someone may indeed be gifted in the big picture, but not in ways that a 6yr old demonstrates through testing.</p>
<p>Well, it depends on the early bloomer, @mathyone. </p>
<p>I still remember my son, who could read fluently before he started kindergarten, coming home crying every time they pulled him and the other two early readers out of class for special advanced reading lessons. Apparently, the special reading lessons conflicted with his favorite activity of the week – show and tell. He felt that he was being punished because he had to miss this highlight of the week. </p>
<p>A five-year-old is still a five-year-old, even if he can read. </p>
<p>And then the next year, he and several other kids were put in a special reading group that did second-grade work in first grade. But he couldn’t cope with the second-grade worksheets, which had really small spaces for the kids to write in. His first-grade fingers weren’t ready to write in second-grade spaces, and he was always in trouble for poor written work in reading (though not in other subjects, where he wasn’t accelerated and could use normal first-grade worksheets).</p>
<p>If they can figure out a way to accelerate a kid academically without requiring that kid to be accelerated physically and emotionally, then sure, go for it. But that wasn’t my son’s experience. </p>
<p>Edited to add: Another issue that comes up with early readers is finding material that is developmentally appropriate for them that’s also at their reading level. My son and other early readers were very frustrated that the school librarian would not allow them to take out books intended for students above their grade level. But the librarian explained to the parents that books intended for third- or fourth-graders might be too scary or otherwise developmentally inappropriate for a kindergartner or first-grader, even if the young child could read them. She had a point.</p>
<p>Another thing I’ve noticed is that the kids who are academically ahead of the curve are not usually bored…their parents may assume so, but a visit to the classroom might just put their worries to rest. Good teachers know their kids’ strengths, and differentiate instruction during lesson time. The Kdg classroom is a life lab…learning to follow rules, be a good listener, be a leader, develop friendships, learn to negotiate and take turns, along with hold a pencil properly, use scissors and other academic pursuits. Many high achievers may become leaders in the class room, teaching a whole new set of life skills. I have seen the gamut of levels in K, from barely potty trained (ugh!) to reading at a very high level. The fantastic manipulatives and engaging curriculum my district used kept everyone interested and learning. </p>
<p>@Marian, that’s the problem with mixed-ability classrooms. Kids don’t like to be singled out, and they don’t like to miss out on fun. They should have pulled him out during the regular reading lesson. I didn’t want my kid to be the one who sat alone in the back working on something different than the rest of the class. (If the school would even do that much for her). I thought that would be terrible for her socially, and she wouldn’t learn nearly as much if she was getting neglected by the teacher. Wouldn’t any parent have concerns like that?</p>
<p>I find myself agreeing with some rather disparate points of view in this discussion. As a parent of a kid who was tested as reading at least at 5th grade level in the first week of Kindergarten (he was equally advanced in math skills), I can say I’m glad they did that kind of testing. My hunch is that K teachers always do some kind of assessment for abilities because in most schools there’s some ability to group kids, and especially to find those who need more help. The problem for this kid, however, could have been that forever he was a geek or nerd. But honestly he was pretty oblivious to it! He (and we) just didn’t want him to be bored in school, and his teachers did a pretty good job of giving him opportunities to work to his level (often by himself or with one or two other kids). </p>
<p>The reigning philosophy in our small town middle-class public school district was that the exceptionally advanced children didn’t need extra help from the schools. The district focused on those who were lagging, and who might need special attention for a variety of reasons. I now think that was a reasonable approach in elementary school years especially, but at the time it was frustrating to us as parents. It wasn’t practical to take him out to private schools where we live. Sometimes, however, when he was bored and given self-directed time, he got into a bit of mischief, such as when he was in middle school and reprogrammed the school district’s motto on the computer in the school library from “School, Home, Community – Together in Excellence” to “School, Home, Community – Together in Incompetence.” That wasn’t a cool thing to do, but at least he had a sense of humor!</p>
<p>@Marian, yes, I used to spend a lot of time trying to find books for my kids that were at their reading level but not too “mature” or scary. Fortunately their school allowed the elementary kids access to all books up to “young adult” and in 3rd or 4th grade we were allowed to sign a form granting that also.</p>
<p>Also, most parents I’ve spoken to say that their kids weren’t simply excused from doing work. They still had to fill out all those worksheets even if they already knew the skills.</p>
<p>I’m not sure whether I would have signed that form @mathyone . I wouldn’t have wanted my third or fourth grader reading The Hunger Games or its equivalent.</p>
<p>: Another issue that comes up with early readers is finding material that is developmentally appropriate for them that’s also at their reading level.</p>
<p>Never forget my daughter sounding out words written on the bathroom wall at a city park. She was 4.
Of course there were helpful visual aids as well.</p>
<p>When my daughter was in kindergarten 15 years ago she could read perfectly. However, she got an unsatisfactory on her report card for tying her shoelaces. She had velcro sneakers and had not yet mastered that task. I asked the teacher how they were teaching shoelace tying and she said they were not, they were just testing the kids to see if they could do it. I did complain to the principal that they should not evaluate the kids on a skill they were not teaching and in a subsequent year they removed it from the report card!</p>
<p>Science fiction and fantasy genres were a godsend- reading the Star Wars Trilogy instead of ability level young teens life for an elementary school kid. Change the universe instead of dealing with social issues beyond the kids. Star Wars is fairly concrete.</p>
<p>Did you know the first kindergarten was in Wisconsin- those Germans and their child’s garden. It is also the birthplace of the Republican Party and other liberal/socialist/conservative ideas. No one thinks about getting into the Ivies- that’s an east coast thing.</p>
<p>Social skills- put the more average kids in a class filled with very slow kids and see their frustration level when no one understands where they are coming from. Add in introversion and extroversion styles to the mix. So much more is known now. </p>
<p>How about the taller kids people think are older than they are, my tall son was lucky he was mentally advanced as well. </p>
<p>How about an advanced sense of humor- telling jokes none of the classmates understand? We were lucky when son was young that there were 3 other boys within 12 months of each other and all well above average IQ. He had peers to play with.</p>
<p>Son’s first grade teacher (a 1-3 grade class, different than K school, he wasn’t ready for a straight second grade experience) was concerned about ADD so we let the school test him, it confirmed his giftedness (his lack of attention was likely a combination of age and boredom- this good teacher wasn’t used to the concept of a kid being bored). Introverted son also hung on the sidelines in the neighborhood observing others before jumping in, and composed his thoughts before giving what teacher said were responses worth waiting for. We were later lucky when the district hired a then full time GT coordinator who got parents involved to improve things in the district.</p>
<p>Son, the Honors math major in college (he preferred theory to applied), had trouble memorizing those arithmetic facts (addition…) at age 5-6. I look back at his social life at a young age- he thoroughly enjoyed playing soccer at recess with those first graders and didn’t miss the kid he wanted as a K friend. His best friend in 5th grade was an older gifted kid- I asked his mother why that boy would play with my son. She said playing Uno and other games was more fun because they both thought at the same speed. I can see that- instead of waiting for the other kid to figure out which moves to make. Going back to kindergarten the same thing happens, waiting for most to catch on. </p>
<p>I haven’t ever met a kid who taught himself to read as a toddler or who figured out multiplication on his own that became an unremarkable student. I have know quite a few kids (often with LDs) who started a little slow, and then revealed themselves to be gifted later once they figured out how to get around the disability. But I’ve never known a precocious kid who lost it. </p>
<p>@Marian, I’m sorry your kids had a bad experience being accelerated, but that wasn’t our experience at all. When my first grader had trouble with the fine motor skills required by the 3rd grade math sheets, the third grade teacher figured out a way to make it work for him. And when my kid was pulled out for reading in kindergarten it was specifically when the other kids were working on letter sounds. Good teachers can make acceleration work.</p>
<p>And for what it’s worth my older son could easily have been at least one more year advanced in math if the school system had made any effort to meet his needs. He did a lot of treading water despite my efforts to get him placed properly.</p>
<p>I actually didn’t have much trouble finding developmentally appropriate books for my kdis - you just had to look for ones written 40 years ago. One of the first things I did on the web was post my list of suggestions.</p>
<p>Gotta chime in on the math acceleration and what a nightmare it became for our oldest S. All incoming 6th graders were given a placement test during the first week of school to determine level. Those performing “at grade level” we’re put in 6th grade math. Those with above average scores were put in pre-algebra. Those few with near perfect scores were placed in Algebra1. S was a good math student in elementary, with no obvious problems, and happened to test very well. Once he was super accelerated, he lost his edge. He was able to do the “plug and chug”/memorization of early Algebra, but once he reached pre-calc and beyond, big gaps in his early learning were blatantly obvious. He simply was not developmentally ready for the higher level learning and abstract concepts at his young age. We were told D could do the same track, but held her back in the 1 year accelerated group instead of the 2 year accelerated group. She did much better than S, and her testing showed far fewer gaps in early algebra concepts/skills. </p>
<p>So, bottom line, sometimes more (and earlier) isn’t always better. YMMV.</p>
<p>@mathmom, yes, we went through some classics, but at some point I ran out of ideas and my kids were deciding they preferred more modern books. Many of them just weren’t the sort of thing an elementary school kid would be interested in. My high school daughter loves stuff like 1984, but it’s not something I would have given her in elementary school. Consider also, that the classics are extremely male-centric. Almost no strong female heroines, if girls appear at all, the plot generally centers on how they’ll be married off to someone with a good income. The people off having all the adventures are almost exclusively boys. Not very inspiring to today’s young girls. </p>
<p>Agree about Hunger Games (older one snuck it in before I had any idea what it was, younger had it embargoed until 7th grade.) I have similar feelings about Ender’s Game (which older one read in elementary school before I got to it and decided she was too young for it) and The Golden Compass. </p>
<p>I agree with finding fantasy or science fiction for situations that didn’t necessarily present conflicts that were above their emotional maturity or which could be read on different levels.</p>
<p>I wouldnt say that kids who read chapter books at four and Island of the Blue Dolphins ( written 54 years ago) at six were " unremarkable", but they don’t necessarily have the same “OMG” accomplishments as adults as those that were evident at five years old.</p>
<p>The Hunger Games wasnt written when mine were in school, but reading about dystopian societies wasnt necssarily beyond their interest level.
Youngest was mesmerized by The Giver.
I was probably in 5th gd when I read Diary of Anne Frank, which was IMO even darker because it occured just a few decades earlier.
Real life trumps fiction.</p>
<p>@shellz, my kids did algebra in 5th and 6th grade respectively and subsequently have had no problems. However, they both had pre-algebra the year prior–I think they were working in a 7th grade book–and I was watching their progress pretty carefully for several years prior for exactly the reasons you describe. I don’t feel they jumped over a lot of content. So how were they able to get to 7th grade math that soon? It’s mostly because their school didn’t waste the kindergarten and first grade years making them do endless worksheets on simple math they already knew. They were able to get through the multiplication facts in 1st grade, and then spend several years on upper elementary and pre-algebra.</p>
<p>Once you start on that path of high school math it’s rather hard to decelerate if it’s too hard. You also need to consider how bored the kid will be if you don’t accelerate, and whether they are willing to work hard to avoid being bored. Our public middle school has too low a bar for algebra in 7th grade–too many of the kids are floundering in high school. Yours sounds even more aggressive with placement. At our public school kids are not routinely placed in algebra in 6th grade–it would be by parent request and the kid needs to score well on an algebra readiness test to get permission. I have no idea how hard that test is. Very few kids are doing this, maybe 1 in 200.</p>
<p>Our district has since backed off on its aggressive acceleration, due in large part to my son’s cohort and the cohorts that immediately followed…,of the 5 kids who, due to this acceleration, ended up needing to travel to the high school for math in 8th grade, only 1-2 ended up passing Alg 2/Trig. The rest repeated it as 9th graders. I can only speak for my son, but math was never the same. I wish he had had the time to really digest pre-algebra and algebra 1. Sure he could memorize formulas and plug and chug, but when it became more analytical and abstract, he really faltered. We learned our lesson…it’s about readiness. While he appeared ready, clearly he was not. My H spent countless hours with that boy, trying to figure out where the gaps were. Fortunately, by the time he got to college all was well. He is now an engineer, even…woulda never seen that coming ;-)</p>
<p>As an early childhood educator, with two GT kids and one highly reluctant/stubborn high achiever, I will be forever grateful to the teachers who took the time to meet my kids where they were at, and who welcomed me as a partner in the educational process. Learning doesn’t end at 3 pm, and my job as a parent was to stand in the gap between what they were taught in class and what I knew they were capable of. I think that’s why parenting is so tiring…the job just never ends! </p>
<p>Our public middle school’s gifted program is entirely extracurricular. My daughter spends 5-10+ hours per week on gifted activities that really should be part of her school day. It’s a lot of time, but she gets way more out of those hours than the regular school day. </p>
<p>I’m glad she has those opportunities. My older two were in the GATE program, yet I really think the only actual benefit was the teachers they got…some really fantastic ones! I wish our district had the money to meet the needs of all the kids, but alas, that is just not happening with the high cost of special Ed aids, and remediation for kids falling below the state targets for math and reading. With #3 a junior this year, I am ready to be done with the school system. Every year things just seem to slip a bit more. I’m afraid for the younger kiddos.</p>