Is there a better way to "shop" for summer music programs?

College Majors Music Major
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<p>Several years ago when we were looking at summer programs for our high schooler, I was surprised by how little information there truly was on the Internet about all these programs. Even calling to get more information was not too helpful as usually vague responses were given, as lastbird indicated in another thread. Ideally it would be nice if all these programs put audio clips on their websites, just to give an idea of what to expect. But this type of information is largely unavailable, outdated or very selective, such as providing short clips of only the top performers. Even searching for video clips on that famous website proved fruitless, which led me to suspect that even family videos were being (insert Darla music) “disappeared”. </p>

<p>Good ol’ CC was moderately helpful, but not as much as I had hoped. One family’s disgust at toilet-cleaning is another family’s chuckle over an important life skill being learned. One person’s “high-level program” is another person’s safety, as also previously mentioned. And wow are these programs expensive. You could easily rack up $10,000 if you include things like uniforms and transportation costs. You want your student to get a taste of the intense music life, learn a ton, make connections and meet important faculty but at what cost? How do we know a program is really worth it, or are they just telling me my kid is great because they want my money? </p>

<p>We need a better way. I have been thinking about this and can’t come up with a solution, but thought I would toss some ideas out there. What if we looked at outcomes. What if we could get an idea of where students attended for summer programs, then gathered info on where they ended up for college or conservatory. We would have to keep it very focused, otherwise the data would be all over the map. For example, we could ask “what do you think was the most important summer music program you attended, and where did you end up as a music major?” We could limit it to high school, and further limit it to programs attended before any college acceptances. I would also like to know about students who attended ZERO summer programs, and where they ended up. We would have to find a way for people to feel comfortable reporting, and total anonymity might not be possible. </p>

<p>Thanks for hearing me out. Maybe I am making a mountain out of a molehill. I realize this is not exactly a college topic but it certainly can be a stepping stone to college. The whole process is frustrating and I am wondering if we can make this better for families and students.</p>

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<p>Here is just one take. We had never heard of any of the major music programs before last year. Did not even know they existed until I found this website. Upon that gain of knowledge, our family took the leap and applied to one of the “premier” programs. Acceptance, generous scholarship and six weeks of a summer that proved to be life changing. Without that experience, I have no doubt my child would not be looking at the opportunities that are on the table right now. The connections in the music world have been invaluable. To be on a first name basis with some of the “heavy weights” in your instrument field has proven to be the greatest outcome of last summer. Just learning how to assemble your audition material, being around other students with the same passion, and experiencing the closest thing to what music school would be like is something you cannot put a dollar amount on for what the pay back is. We are looking at another summer like last summer before the fall start of the freshman year of college and I can only imagine what two years of this will do for my student’s mindset and their future path in music. (Tanglewood was the summer program.)</p>

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<p>I think it’s a good idea. We could include objective information so that it could be useful for everyone. I’d like a list of both high school and college summer music institutes. For example:</p>

<p>XX camp is an outdoor rustic camp, has students clean toilets.<br>
ZZ camp had ABC oboe teacher, principal oboe of __ Orchestra.<br>
YY camp had ___ flute teacher, professor at ____.
WW camp uses band directors to teach sectionals and lessons.</p>

<p>etc.</p>

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<p>Ideally one’s private music teacher has knowledge of good summer programs. If the teacher doesn’t, then try to find a better one. However, for many like us (we live on the edge of civilization a very long way from any significant centres of human culture so none of the local teachers had any first-hand or second-hand knowledge of good programs), having internet info is essential. </p>

<p>I’m not sure that a listing of “ZZ camp had ABC oboe teacher, principal oboe of __ Orchestra” will be helpful since almost all good programs will list their faculty members and their bios on their websites. Rather, information about the quality of interaction between the students and teachers would be helpful. As well, many websites do not indicate what a daily schedule is like (you usually get this after you have been accepted and paid the big deposit) and many do not tell you how much weekly private instruction you get. I do like the idea of “clean toilets” vs. “most students have a courier pick up their dirty laundry to be dry-cleaned twice weekly” informaton, since that is rarely available on websites either!</p>

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<p>Going to give some of my thoughts on what may be important (again, my thoughts):</p>

<p>-How hard is it to get in? Do they basically take anyone who auditions, or are they looking for top students only. If the kid is someone driven by the level of others around them, this can be important. Some summer festivals claim to be exclusive, but aren’t.</p>

<p>-What kind of faculty do they have teaching there? Are they well known teachers and performers, or are they relative unknowns? One of the advantages of summer programs is meeting potential future teachers…same with master classes and such, if the person doing the master class is the principal clarinet of the Smithville Symphony, for example, is that going to do much for the students? </p>

<p>-What kind of environment is it? What are you seeking? Do you want more like Interlochen or Greenwood and such, that are more summer camp-y or do you want something strictly focused on music? Are you looking for an emphasis on individual playing, chamber or orchestra? If you are looking for individual playing, then something like BUTI may not be a top choice since its emphasis is on the orchestra (you can take private lessons with BSO players, though)…</p>

<p>-How intensive is it? There are plenty of summer music programs that claim to be intense, that students are expected to practice x hours a day, but when you get there, you find out they don’t enforce it whereas other programs do. </p>

<p>-What kind of performing opportunities do the students have? Will they be able to do individual performing as well as ensemble? How much will they perform? Performing should be an opportunity to me at any serious music program, and it is important to ask that. </p>

<p>Those are the kind of questions. There are a ton of music festivals out there, and unfortunately there are a lot that either are aimed at more casual music students (basically like summer recreation), which is fine, but there are also a lot that to me pretend to be high level and seem more about employing those associated with it…</p>

<p>Teachers usually are the source for information on summer programs as are other music students, depending on what contact you have. </p>

<p>Unfortunately there are no magic bullets with this, it is hit or miss. I think the best bet is to figure out what you want for it, and then narrow the search based on that. Trying to find out about Alumni isn’t that easy, plus they will tell you “Alton Xray went to our program, then went to Curtis”, but don’t say he was the only student who ever went on to that level of music program.</p>

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<p>Lots of good suggestions. Several people mention asking one’s teacher. Unfortunately if one’s teacher went to a camp long ago, or had friends or students who went, that information may be quite dated, as we discovered. I’d rather get current and relevent information from a place like CC.</p>

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<p>Maybe when people report acceptances, they could also report attendance at summer programs? The OP was looking for some data that would help her understand the value/necessity of the summer programs; it might be helpful to know that of the nine kids who got into UMich for voice, three kids went to Interlochen, three worked with private teachers and three went to local music programs. Of course, it would not be a complete data set, but it might provide what she was looking for. I love the idea of having conservatories and summer programs post more videos on Youtube. I found a few colleges that have entire tours online (complete with backwards-walking student) and it was very helpful to have a first look without having to travel. Having a few representative performances online would help kids compare themselves and make decisions about where they might fit.</p>

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<p>Thanks to all who took the time to respond. I’m glad I am not the only one who feels the need for a comprehensive user’s guide to summer programs! Maybe in a few years when I retire I will take on this project!</p>

<p>The way our family decided on a program was to ask clarinet professors that we were communicating with if they could recommend programs. Then we further researched via CC including a few extremely helpful PM’s. The one question that proved difficult, was “How hard is it to get in and what is the level of playing?” </p>

<p>I thought about asking people in the acceptance thread to state where they had been to summer programs, but don’t want to clog up that thread with too much confusing information.</p>

<p>So just to keep it simple, once the bulk of the acceptances are in, maybe in late April or May, I might ask for high school seniors to state (if they feel comfortable) where they had been accepted and what was the one summer program that had the most influence on them. Also, they could state if they did NO summer programs. I am not the most organized person and sadly lack the skills needed to create a table. So if someone wanted to volunteer for that job please let me know!</p>

<p>Agree this would not be completely meaningful information, but short of having an audio/video guide, might give applicants a feel for what the levels are.</p>

<p>Appreciate any further comments or suggestions.</p>

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<p>For summer voice opportunities, you can have some luck by searching the bios of singers who have either won recent competitions or who you’ve heard perform somewhere. They often list the summer programs they’ve attended. We’ve learned of a few good places this way.</p>

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<p>It’s like colleges in general - there is no “one size fits all” solution out there. My suggestion is to check on the reputation of the guest conductors and the current/past students who have done the Summer program - are they going on to decent college music programs? Do they offer scholarships for the summer program? Another good option is to consider summer camps at colleges your child actually wants to attend - never hurts to make those early faculty connections! Cost is always a consideration, so do compare there as well.</p>