Is this a good list??

College Majors Visual Arts and Film Majors
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<p>We are almost done with the list of schools for D to apply to this fall. I would like to get some comments as to whether this list is realistic, especially regarding safeties, and if anyone has more recommendations.</p>

<p>Main interest is studio art with current focus on animation, but it's not for sure, illustration is also a strong interest. Pure art schools are not allowed by parents, but art schools within universities are encouraged. Dual degree/double major is required - again, by parents (yes, I know, we may seem like terrible parents, but considering we will be paying in full, we want D to have a backup career or at least a wider education than pure art, for the kind of money we will pay). Her other interest is linguistics, but she is willing to explore other areas. She has good GPA (school doesn't really use GPA, but it should be around 3.8-3.9), full IB Diploma candidate, SAT score 2150, will take ACT as well. </p>

<p>So, her current list:
Brown/RISD dual degree - top choice, visited, loved both, but knows she has almost no chance
Tufts/SMFA dual degree - visited, had very positive portfolio review at SMFA
Wash U/Sam Fox School of Art
CMU/CFA
Brandeis - visited, loved the vibe, art dept is small, but seems strong
Syracuse U/College of VPA
Wesleyan U -visited, had great interview, but didn't get a good feel how strong studio art program is
Oberlin College - visited, loved the vibe, art dept. is small, but seems decent
Bard College - visited, loved the vibe
Connecticut College - visited, was impressed with the art department, but did not like the vibe or the campus
Skidmore College - visited, liked everything, had great interview, was openly encouraged to apply (don't know if it means anything). </p>

<p>Have we missed anything, especially universities with strong academics and art schools (trying to stay on East Coast)? Does she need more safeties?? It's so hard to predict anything with art schools, since portfolio plays such a big role. She can't go to portfolio days because we're in London, so it's hard to know which schools will like her work.</p>

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<p>You’ve definitely got a lot of great schools up there. But maybe you should kill the colleges that weren’t as strong or your daughter didn’t like as much and substitute them for some safety schools with decent programs that your daughter would be happy in.</p>

<p>Best of luck!</p>

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<p>If you like Philadelphia:</p>

<p>PAFA offers certificates but also has degrees available through Penn. Probably hard to get in but probably worth looking.</p>

<p>Temple has Tyler for art and several other undergrad schools.</p>

<p>University of the Arts has lots of art options, not sure about dual degree or about strength of humanities courses but worth checking. Some of the computer-oriented programs could be good second majors.</p>

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<p>Perhaps money isn’t an issue but in any case your D should consider the US state schools. I know this may sound hypocritical from the mother of a kid who will attend CMU in the fall, but the US state schools are a tremendous deal for the price, even out of state/country. Temple/Tyler, Virginia Commonwealth, Wisconsin, and Ohio State all looked good to my S during application time and are actually much, much easier to manage a double degree than CMU-CFA. Our son was certain by the end of the application process that he wanted to attend a university, not an art school, because he wanted to take classes outside of art and liked CMUs emphasis on multidisciplinary learning. That being said, if he were to choose to do a major in robotics as well as art we will be paying for 5 years of school (optimistically) so a double major in 4 years can be very demanding. Note that the RISD/Brown course is 5 years! That is an expensive double major! </p>

<p>My sister is an art school grad from UK and thinks the US college/university BFA is preferable for most art students because you either can minor, double major, or at least take some courses outside of art that may help you have a financially viable alternative but may also make you a better artist. She is wonderfully gifted in textile design but not taking academic courses beyond high school really hurt her ability to start her own business. She feels that being put into the “artist” academic (not) track in early high school in the UK really hamstrung her in terms of both practical knowledge and also undermined her confidence in her intellectual abilities and interaction with well educated clients, etc.</p>

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<p>Ah- you’ve got parent of art major syndrome with kid with good stats. I totally understand it.</p>

<p>First of all, to throw a wrench in the works: If your D is getting a BFA then regardless of whether she goes to a university or an art school she will be doing about 70% studio and only 30% liberal arts. </p>

<p>But I love your list. These are safeties from your list: Syracuse, SMFA (you know she isnt applying to Tufts, she gets into SMFA and gets to take art kid classes from Tufts professors that they assign to SMFA, unless you mean that she will apply to both, then Tufts is definitely not a safety) CMU/CFA can be turned into a safety if you apply directly to the art school, and then transfer in to their 5 year BFA/BHA program. </p>

<p>We or just my S saw first 4 on your list and also Syracuse. </p>

<p>PAFA may be too fine-arty for an animation major.</p>

<p>What about NYU? My S’s bff is going there next year for animation. He has similar stats to your D. </p>

<p>I heard Emerson has a cool “New Media” program.</p>

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<p>switters, I’m happy with my daughter taking 70% studio and 30% liberal arts, but I want that 30% to be in a university setting where the variety of liberal arts courses is greater than those that an art school can offer. Unless of course you’re talking about RISD/Brown type programs.</p>

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<p>Hi US UK, My daughter had many of the schools on your list when she applied in 2005. Ended up at Wesleyan where she majored in studio arts – the program is small but very strong. I would suggest adding Vassar to your list; the art department is highly regarded and the school shares the culture/ethos of some of the schools on your list, namely Brown, Wesleyan and Bard.</p>

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<p>Not all colleges make it easy to do a double major, particularly if one of those majors is a specialized BFA program. If you haven’t done so already, please check the requirements for the two majors at every college your daughter is contemplating to make sure that completing the two majors in four years is realistic – not just in terms of the number of units needed, but in terms of whether the time commitment is realistic.</p>

<p>I have a kid in an applied arts major, and although the university prides itself on facilitating double majors and has a very good track record, particularly students doing arts/business or arts/science, looking at the requirements of the two majors that would interest my S, and then at the time commitment he gives in his primary major, it didn’t seem like something that would work out well. That said, the arts majors around here do seem to do pretty well employment-wise, so we’re quite calm about it.</p>

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<p>Thanks for your comments everyone!</p>

<p>Woodworker, we’ll check Temple/Tyler in Philadelphia, thanks.</p>

<p>Fineartsmajormom, thanks for the state schoold suggestions. I am aware they are much cheaper, but the problem with them is their large size. D would much prefer small classes and LAC atmosphere. But she is considering Syracuse, which is also big. I know that in some cases double major/dual degree will be 5 years, it’s not ideal, but we’ll pay for it if needed. Regarding difference between UK and US education system - you are absolutely right, that’s why D doesn’t want to go to UK universities, it would be mean only art and nothing else (although it would be much cheaper!).</p>

<p>Switters - yes, BFA is 70% art and 30% liberal arts, but the second major will be 100% liberal arts. SMFA - I meant dual degree, where she would apply to both Tufts and SMFA and get two degrees, rather than only SMFA where liberal arts classes are taught by Tufts professors. We need to find out how applications work for CMU-CFA, should she apply to combined degree or, like you are saying, just to CFA and then transfer to combined degree later. Is it easy to transfer or can CMU refuse it? Is it possible to just do two majors rather than combined degree?? NYU - we looked into it, but studio art is in Steinhardt and cannot be combined with other majors from other NYU schools. I did not see animation major, do they have one? I encouraged her to look into Gallatin, but she said it’s too unstructured for her and too loose. </p>

<p>Studiomom, thanks for confirming Wesleyan has strong art program! D will definitely apply there. We did visit Vassar in April, and D was not impressed with studio art there. It’s a tiny department, only 10 people major in studio art per year, and art courses are very limited, D said they are too basic. Perhaps Vassar is known for Art History program rather than studio? Not sure, but she was not impressed and crossed Vassar off the list.</p>

<p>Another question - should she add SUNY New Paltz as another safety?? SUNY schools are very good value, and I love New Paltz!</p>

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<p>us<em>uk</em>mom, Question: Is your daughter a U.S. citizen? </p>

<p>For LACs with strong art departments in addition to the ones you’ve already considered, take a look at Williams, Hamilton, Kenyon. I would say that LACs in general are more focused on traditional studio courses – painting, sculpture, photography, print making, drawing – and less on new media, illustration, animation.</p>

<p>My son graduated from Williams with a dual degree in studio art and art history. The department is very strong with great facilities, a talented faculty and a lot of arts community support. There are three worldclass museums on or near campus. Excellent overall academics and double, even triple majoring, is commonly done.</p>

<p>I would also suggest Yale, although it’s highly selective.</p>

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<p>Momrath - yes, she is US citizen. Why did you ask? I think she will be evaluated together with international students. </p>

<p>She looked at Williams, but said it’s too isolated. She is a city person, doesn’t care much for outdoors. Kenyon was briefly considered as well, but it seemed similar enough to Oberlin, which she absolutely loved.</p>

<p>I suggested Yale to her, but she is dead set against Ivy League (except Bown).</p>

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<p>We are also US citizens living abroad. My understanding is that US expat kids are considered with the US pool, not the international pool which is a good thing as spaces for internationals are limited. In this sense they get the best of both worlds – international experience without visa/language issues.</p>

<p>My son started off with an urban focus but when it seemed that some of the best art LACs were in insular locations he widened his options. Visiting is critical, though. It was the museums – especially MassMoCA – sealed the deal for my son, but the location is definitely not for everyone.</p>

<p>When my son was working in Boston he took some classes at the SMFA and was disappointed in the caliber of students and instructors. It’s no where near RISD. Also the synergy with Tufts (which is very good school) is less effective than that between Brown and RISD.</p>

<p>Aside from the Brown/RISD program, Brown has a good art department of its own and students are allowed to take classes at RISD.</p>

<p>I would also look at Boston College.</p>

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<p>Thanks for the input about Vassar. I thought the department was larger. Wesleyan graduates about 25 students per year in studio arts. The professors provide a lot of personal attention and a thesis exhibition is required which is such a great experience. The department provides grant funding for summer internships and the caliber of visiting artists and exhibitions are extraordinary. My daughter had a top notch education there and we were so impressed with the quality of the student work. Did your daughter visit Sarah Lawrence? This could also be a safety school for her. The visual art department is of very high quality and the proximity to NYC, a real plus. My younger daughter is at Oberlin. Although she is not studying visual art, we have met many of her friends studying art and I have been quite impressed. The Allen Art Museum is a great resource.</p>

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<p>Hi! Regarding NYU: Why do you say that the Steinhardt BFA art program can’t be combined with other majors/ schools from NYU? Is it because of the number of credits?</p>

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<p>On that 70% thing for a BFA, it’s not uniform. A better rule of thumb is the following.</p>

<p>‘Art Major’ (not BFA) at a college-university is 30-35% studio art courses.</p>

<p>‘BFA’ at a college-university is 50-55% studio art courses.</p>

<p>‘BFA’ at stand-alone art school is 70% studio art courses. You get by far the largest concentration of studio courses in stand alone art colleges – roughly twice as much you get from an art major (BA) at a university, and roughly 50% more than you get from a BFA at a university.</p>

<p>Keep in mind that in non-art universities, there are credit and distribution requirements for major, for college within the the university, and for the university as a whole.</p>

<p>Again these are only rules of thumb, and every college has somewhat different requirements, but these percentages were pretty reliable when my daughter was applying to art schools about 10 years ago.</p>

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<p>Yes, SUNY New paltz is awesome! My son is an art major there and he loves it…so many creative and interesting people. He has had some great professors that he still keeps in touch with and gets their opinion on his work over the summer. Very cool college town and beautiful outdoorsy surroundings…90 minutes to NYC though and the art dept. has free bus trips to the museums there for the art students. He also loves that he has been able to take electives outside of the art dept that interest him like music and anthropology - there is a good deal of schedule flexibility and great advising. Happy to answer any questions for you.</p>

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<p>Do a search for SMFA/Tufts on this site. There has been some discussion of the program and it sounds difficult and not very manageable from accounts posted here.</p>

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<p>I think you have put together a good list. We have a lot of the same schools on D’s list. But one thing to consider, do you or your d care if she gets a BA instead of a BFA? A BA would make it easier to double major, but doesn’t have as many requirements.</p>

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<p>studiomom, thanks for suggesting Sarah Lawrence, we’ll take a look. </p>

<p>uskoolfish, about NYU Steinhardt double majors - I think I saw that info in one of their FAQs. However, I can’t find it now. On their double major declaration form, it states that students are able to select second major from Steinhardt or CAS. But nothing specifically about BFA in studio art. I emailed art department for clarification, we’ll see what they say.</p>

<p>mdmomfromli, ideally D would prefer BFA and another BA (i.e. dual degree), but there are very few programs that offer that, on our list only Brown/RISD and Tufts/SMFA. She is conflicted about getting only BFA (even with a second major), because she thinks it will hurt her chances to get a job in a non-art major, if she needs to. I am not sure it is a valid concern. So, it would seem that BA would be better in this regard, but here she is concerned that BA would not give her strong enough art education. So, she wants to have the best of both worlds, but it may not be realistic!</p>

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<p>Cornell offers a dual BFA/BA or BS degree (5 year program)</p>

<p>[Cornell</a> / Art / Undergraduate Program / Dual Degree](<a href=“http://www.aap.cornell.edu/aap/art/programs/undergrad/dualdegree.cfm]Cornell”>http://www.aap.cornell.edu/aap/art/programs/undergrad/dualdegree.cfm)</p>

<p>Also, WUSTL, but I can’t pull up the page from their web site right now. I remember them mentioning you needed to be in good academic standing, get permissions from whoever, etc., etc.</p>

<p>My D also wanted a dual degree program. She eventually settled on MICA’s combined BFA/BA program. (BA in Humanistic Studies with JHU). It’s just starting this year.</p>