<p>^^In defense of Hawkette, she has repeatedly spoken highly of Cal. But Hawkette believes that small classes and smart kids (as defined solely the by the SAT) are two crucial ingredients for a top undergraduate experience, and thus Cal ranks lower in her view.</p>
<p>Oh sure bluebayou. hawkette thinks Berkeley is a top “public” school. Faint praise indeed.</p>
<p>From the Metro staff at The Boston Globe
Harvard’s endowment plunges $8 billion
December 3, 2008 11:11 AM</p>
<p>Harvard University’s endowment lost more than $8 billion in four months, a 22 percent plunge that is the steepest decline at the school in modern history. </p>
<p>The loss brings the endowment from $36.9 billion on June 30 to roughly $28.7 billion by the end of October. As first reported by Harvard Magazine and the Harvard Crimson, President Drew Faust and Executive Vice President Edward C. Forst outlined the impact of the loss in a letter late Tuesday to the university’s deans.</p>
<p>“To put a loss of that size in historical context, over the last at least forty years, Harvard�s worst single-year endowment return was a negative 12.2 percent in 1974,” the letters reads, “and at that time our endowment stood at less than $1 billion and funded a much less significant proportion of University operations.”</p>
<p>Harvard, MIT, Dartmouth, Boston University, and scores of other colleges have announced hiring freezes and budget cuts to counteract their shrinking endowments. Many institutions rely on revenue generated by their endowments to cover operating costs, which in Harvard’s case is 35 percent. </p>
<p>The world’s wealthiest university, Harvard typically issues a report on its endowment once a year, which makes the letter sent on Tuesday unusual. </p>
<p>“The president just wanted to communicate pretty directly with the deans,” said John Longbrake, a university spokesman. “These are unique and turbulent economic times and the president felt it was important to give an update with some further information on the university’s endowment and on the broader financial strategy to help them in the planning processes.”</p>
<p>The letter does not detail further specific cuts. The university is preparing for a 30 percent reduction in its endowment by the end of the year, as Faust warned in another letter last month.</p>
<hr>
<p>The meltdown of wall street and the current recession is a warning to all of us that wall street warriors and lawyers are no longer prestigious? Going to any state university and learn a practical job is better than a dream job from ivy schools.
Just my 2 cents</p>
<p>“she thinks your school is over-rated and your work under-par 'cos, you know, anywhere east of Denver Cal is not considered exceptional” :)</p>
<p>I wonder why medical and law schools take so many UC Berkeley students including Vanderbilt’s medical school, a school that I dont think is that high on the radar screen for California students. I kind of remember a lot of Berkeley students at Yale and Harvard Law too. </p>
<p>And Berkeley produces more PHDs than any other school. </p>
<p>Interesting… I don’t see any Notre Dame or Vanderbilt students.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.law.yale.edu/admissions/profile.htm[/url]”>http://www.law.yale.edu/admissions/profile.htm</a></p>
<p>Hmmmm.</p>
<p>Maybe those schools mentioned above are west of Denver. ;)</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>What is wrong with being --by far-- the best publicly-funded research university in the United States? </p>
<p>For some obscure reason, that does not seem to be enough “faint praise” for a particular group of fans! For this group, the Frog and the Ox, one of Aesop’s Fable, should be part of the mandatory reading stack.</p>
<p>You know exactly what I’m referring to xiggi. You’ve been on these boards long enough.</p>
<p>facts, Xiggi… I’m still waiting for the facts about 75% of the courses not really being taught.</p>
<p>At least many of the people who praise the school actually went to the school.</p>
<p>Many of us who went there, go there, or may go there are talking about the school. </p>
<p>What doesn’t make sense is those that have no relation to the school. Zero. Making comments.</p>
<p>Hmmm.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Like any of us, Hawkette is entitled to praise whom she likes however she likes. Her personal criteria for an undergrad experience leads her to choose private colleges, which also happen to cater to rich students. Plus we all know she is really right about UMich just being another “state school.” :D</p>
<p>^^…that rejected her. :-)</p>
<p>^^actually, I was accepted to Ann Arbor for grad school back in the dark ages. But that was when I really believed it was the #1A public. But since I’ve been on cc, I’ve come to realize that I must have been mistaken all these years. It’s only the Old Blue Wolverines that make it #1A. :)</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Hmmm back at you, my dear DS! Has that stopped YOU from making comments about schools you ostensibly know nothing or close to nothing about. Most people on this board have attended one college or university, a smaller number a couple of schools, and very few more than two. Fwiw, people who have attended a research university for undergraduate tend to attend a similar school for graduate studies.</p>
<p>In the meantime, what seems lost in your “mild” attack is that recent graduates DO have friends from high school who made DIFFERENT choices and tend to discuss the choices with a reasonable degree of objectivity. You also seem to overlook that some of us do have siblings and extended family … some of them with CURRENT experience. </p>
<p>Feel free to denigrate or challenge my “understanding” of the undergraduate experience schools we discuss at times. And, fwiw, would you make the same point if I were to join your choir and jump onto the “underranked” bandwagon? Doubt it! :)</p>
<p>“Hmmm back at you, my dear DS! Has that stopped YOU from making comments about schools you ostensibly know nothing or close to nothing about. Most people on this board have attended one college or university, a smaller number a couple of schools, and very few more than two. Fwiw, people who have attended a research university for undergraduate tend to attend a similar school for graduate studies.”</p>
<p>You know what Xiggi, I shouldn’t make comments about schools I know little or nothing about. I try not to do that, but once in awhile, I do. It’s wrong.</p>
<p>“In the meantime, what seems lost in your “mild” attack is that recent graduates DO have friends from high school who made DIFFERENT choices and tend to discuss the choices with a reasonable degree of objectivity. You also seem to overlook that some of us do have siblings and extended family … some of them with CURRENT experience.” </p>
<p>Really, you have friends or family that went to UC Berkeley for undergrad? How do they feel when you trash the school, or try and point out the school’s shortcomings?</p>
<p>And it doesn’t have to be Berkeley. You tell your friends who went to Texas they received an inferior eduction to yours? That they just go to a good state school? They should have gone someplace else? </p>
<p>That’s what you tell them?</p>
<p>And Xiggi, when are you going to start teaching?</p>
<p>I think University of California- Berkeley is not underrated that much… maybe sometimes.</p>
<p>(Can anyone give me a sneak peek of Rutgers ranking for undergraduate political science, top 10-15-25 etc… all would be great. I can’t seem to find this anywhere local at the moment.)</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Dstark, do I really **trash **Berkeley? For the record, this is not the first time that people are confused between facts (humm, funny how that word comes back) and what the … perception is. Alexandre made the same comment about how I trashed Michigan, until I asked him to do dig the EXACT posts where I trashed Michigan. Something that was pretty easy since I rarely or ever wrote anything DIRECTLY related to Michigan. </p>
<p>As far as my “trashing” of Berkeley, please go ahead and do the same thing! And, while you are at it, please go and find out ANYTHING pejorative I might have written about Texas! </p>
<p>Please do not confuse someone expressing his positions about things such as large classes and the lecture+section model and trashing a school! Please do not confuse the fact that someone might NOT agree with your position and … trashing a school. Please do not confuse the rejection of voodoo statistics and … trashing a school. Please do not confuse the rejection of the large pot of KookAid and … trashing a school. </p>
<p>Now, you go LOOK for the posts where I **trash **Berkeley or Michigan. Go look and then come back with an … apology! And, last but not least, please do not share publicly information you might have learned privately!</p>
<p>Xiggi, you trash the school by innuendo. Implication. Your cute comments. Opinions not backed up by facts. By asking questions like there is something wrong about the school.</p>
<p>Posts…122, 126, 129, 131</p>
<p>And it doesn’t have to be Berkeley. You tell your friends who went to Texas they received an inferior eduction to yours? That they just go to a good state school? They should have gone someplace else? </p>
<p>This is what you tell your friends.</p>
<p>And for the record, do you have friends or family that have gone to Berkeley. And now you know as much about the school as those that have actually gone there?</p>
<p>Do your Texas friends know as much about Claremont as you do?</p>
<p>“Please do not confuse someone expressing his positions about things such as large classes and the lecture+section model and trashing a school! Please do not confuse the fact that someone might NOT agree with your position and … trashing a school.”</p>
<p>Berkeley is more than the models you suggest. The school actually has small classes too, where 20 year olds sit in small circles and spout their thoughts.</p>
<p>And that’s the model you prefer. For every class, Xiggi?</p>
<p>And if you don’t like a model, and the school uses that model, and you speak your disdain for the model and the school, that isn’t trashing the school?</p>
<p>Xiggi, sorry if I have mentioned anything publicly that was meant to stay private.</p>
<p>Dstalk, rjko, and others,
I’m not the topic here…again. I have a different opinion than you on the undergraduate option of UC Berkeley vs what I consider to be a very strong universe of college alternatives spread across the country. In my view, the USA has lots of excellent undergraduate colleges and, for most students outside of California, I think that many of these would be superior choices for undergraduate study. </p>
<p>My expressions are NOT a knock on UC Berkeley and can in no way be rightly characterized as “trashing” UC Berkeley. My comments and arguments are a signal of respect and admiration toward those colleges that really do a good job of creating an excellent environment for undergraduates. I like to give credit where credit is due, even if it means respecting a school that might not have the same visibility within elite academia. IMO, these other colleges do a superior job to UCB in what I consider the four most important elements in comparing undergraduate colleges:</p>
<ol>
<li> Student body (I prefer stronger student peers to weaker ones)</li>
<li> Class sizes (I prefer smaller classes over large classes)</li>
<li> Stronger commitment to undergraduate teaching (I prefer more profs & fewer/no TAs, an institutional appreciation of teaching talents, and a faculty-supportive, if not applauding, student body)</li>
<li> Financial Resources and a willingness to spend this on undergraduate students (I prefer more money to less and how they spend their money is important, eg, fully meeting the financial needs of lower income students)</li>
</ol>
<p>Perhaps you feel other criteria are more appropriate. That’s fine. Share that with us and leave the personal attacks at home. More relevant and most important, I hope that you will post your criteria along with the fine detail of how UCB compares with many of the most highly ranked privates and publics.</p>
<p>The criteria depends on the student, Hawkette. Same as always.</p>
<p>But I’m glad you’re not the topic.</p>
<p>“I’m not the topic here…again.”
I have a"
“what I consider to be”
“In my view,”
“I think that”
“My expressions”
“My comments and arguments”
“I like to give” .
“IMO”,<br>
“I consider”</p>
<ol>
<li>“I prefer” </li>
<li> “I prefer”</li>
<li>“I prefer” </li>
<li> “I prefer” </li>
</ol>
<p>“I hope”</p>
<p>dstalk,
So now, I guess you don’t want me (or anyone else who disagrees with you) to post opinions. </p>
<p>Is this less objectionable?</p>
<ol>
<li>STRENGTH OF THE STUDENTS
UCB’s Stats
1210-1470 = SAT 25/75
29%, 72% = percentage of students scoring 700+ and 600+ on Critical Reading
51%, 83% = percentage of students scoring 700+ and 600+ on Math
22% Acceptance Rate
99% Top 10% students</li>
</ol>
<h1>37 Ranked by 25th percentile among national universities</h1>
<h1>24 Ranked by 75th percentile among national universities</h1>
<h1>28 Ranked by mid-point of SAT 25/75 range</h1>
<h1>30 Ranked by percentage of students scoring 700+ on SAT Critical Reading</h1>
<h1>38 Ranked by percentage of students scoring 600+ on SAT Critical Reading</h1>
<h1>23 Ranked by percentage of students scoring 700+ on SAT Math</h1>
<h1>35 Ranked by percentage of students scoring 600+ on SAT Math</h1>
<h1>14 Ranked by Acceptance Rate</h1>
<h1>1 Ranked by percentage of Top 10% students</h1>
<p>Note: UC Berkeley enrolls about 2000 transfer students per year. It is highly likely that their statistical comparison is less than the above.</p>
<p>Further note: If you use Top 10% students as an important metric in judging selectivity, then UCB is underrated. However, keep in mind that this metric places 5 other UC schools (UCLA, UCSD, UCI, UCD, UCSB) in the national Top 12. </p>
<ol>
<li>SIZE OF THE CLASSROOM
UCB’s Stats
62% = % of classes with fewer than 20 students
24% = % of classes with 20-50 students
14% = % of classes with 50+ students
15/1 = Student/Faculty Ratio</li>
</ol>
<p>When compared against the other colleges in the USWNR Top 50 national universities, UCB ranks:</p>
<h1>24 ranked by % of classes with fewer than 20 students</h1>
<h1>13 ranked by % of classes with 20-50 students</h1>
<h1>36 ranked by % of classes with 50+ students</h1>
<h1>41 ranked by Student/Faculty ratio</h1>
<h1>33 Overall USNWR Faculty Resources Ranking</h1>
<ol>
<li><p>QUALITY OF CLASSROOM INSTRUCTION
This is a subjective assessment and there are many sources that one can look at to see how schools are viewed by their customers. I have yet to find a source that ranks UC Berkeley anywhere near the Top 20 when it comes to classroom instruction. </p></li>
<li><p>INSTITUTIONAL RESOURCES
UCB’s Stats
$2.9 billion Total Endowment
$82,969 Endowment per capita</p></li>
</ol>
<h1>23 when ranked nationally by Total Endowment</h1>
<h1>69 when ranked nationally by Endowment per capita</h1>
<h1>44 USNWR Financial Resources Ranking</h1>
<p>At least I support an argument rather than just state an opinion with little substantive to support it. Probably you disagree with the metrics for comparing UNDERGRADUATE colleges and certainly you want to discredit the conclusion, but as requested earlier, “I hope that you will post your criteria along with the fine detail of how UCB compares with many of the most highly ranked privates and publics.”</p>