<p>I keep hearing that Wellesley is the number one women’s college in the US, but how did that reputation come to be? Is it deserved? Is the quality of the education at Wellesley better? If so, is it logical to choose Wellesley over the other all-women 7 sisters colleges for this reason?</p>
<p>[I’m posting this is the Wellesley, Smith, Mt. Holyoke, Bryn Mawr, and Barnard forums]</p>
<p>i dont know that much about wellseley, but im guessing it got such a good reputation cause it's affiliated with harvard and a lot of powerful women have graduated from there. though ive never taken a class there, i find it hard to believe that it could be that much better than bryn mawr or some of the other sister schools. i think the major difference between it and bryn mawr is the type of person that goes to each. maybe its a stereotype, but it seems like wellsley would be more competitive and the students would be interested in more "power" jobs. at bryn mawr it seemed to me like students were more into the humanities and volunteer work.</p>
<p>All the schools mentioned are excellent. You really must visit and check out each one for yourself, as they are different in terms of atmosphere, proximity to cities, relationships with other colleges. Here's some interesting statistics that highlight Bryn Mawr's excellent record in terms of Phd production, found on the Reed College website: </p>
<p><a href="http://web.reed.edu/ir/phd.html%5B/url%5D">http://web.reed.edu/ir/phd.html</a></p>
<p>I think its important not to get too hung up on statistics, and "prestige", whether its citations from above or US News or whatever. Visit and see for yourself!</p>
<p>If the subject is women's colleges, then also look at the female-specific version: <a href="http://web.reed.edu/ir/phdfemale.html%5B/url%5D">http://web.reed.edu/ir/phdfemale.html</a></p>
<p>Note that Reed is putting up only the disciplines (15) in which it is in the top ten in terms of percentage of female PhD productivity. Of these, Reed is number one once, Bryn Mawr thrice. You might notice that Wellesley, Smith, Mt. Holyoke, and Barnard are totally absent.</p>
<p>Like plum1, I caution that this is just one measure of quality, but for those who might want to maximize their chances of earning a PhD, the list may be illuminating.</p>
<p>You might notice that Wellesley, Smith, Mt. Holyoke, and Barnard are totally absent.]]</p>
<p>Look at the entire study. <a href="http://server1.fandm.edu/departments/CollegeRelations/BacOrigins/BacOrg98.pdf%5B/url%5D">http://server1.fandm.edu/departments/CollegeRelations/BacOrigins/BacOrg98.pdf</a></p>
<p>While the of statistics go to 1995 only, the stats though 2005 are about the same. On page #44 you'll see Barnard alumnae received 15 PhDs, Wellesley 12 Bryn Mawr 10, and Smith 8 in the social sciences. While I understand the stats Reed produced were a % of grads, there are many extraneous facts to consider </p>
<p>One, Smith has more Pell grant and students on aid than any other womens college~that translates to many women having to enter to work force sooner than many and not having the financial means to accept a small siphon to complete a PhD. </p>
<p>The study also mentions nothing about Med, Law or Business (MBA) school graduation percentages. </p>
<p>Smith also has an engineering program, which leads to automatic acceptance (with a 3.5 average) to Dartmouth JH, Michigan, Tufts, Notre Dame and soon Princeton graduate progams.
If science only is being considered :For more than 75 years, Smith has ranked in the top 3 percent of 519 private colleges in the number of graduates who have gone on to earn Ph.D.s in science. </p>
<p>In the last decade, Smith has earned the distinction of having the most women graduates who go on to earn doctorates in the sciences. <a href="http://www.science.smith.edu/departments/Engin/admission_faq.php%5B/url%5D">http://www.science.smith.edu/departments/Engin/admission_faq.php</a></p>
<p>Im obviously biased toward Smith but will state unequivocally, you cant go wrong with <em>any</em> of the womens colleges. I would be just as thrilled to be writing a check to Bryn Mawr as I am to Smith if daughter has chosen to matriculate there. Fwiw- She didnt choose Smith over Bryn Mawr. She wouldnt look at the school, not b/c it isnt a great college (it is) but b/c she wanted to stay in Mass, NH, Maine, NY or VT. Go figger!! I know, no rhyme or reason. </p>
<p>I begged her to visit Bryn Mwar, Haverford, et al, but arguing was going nowhere. :)</p>
<p>In the last decade, Smith has earned the distinction of having the most women graduates who go on to earn doctorates in the sciences. </p>
<p>um... isn't that because it's 2-3x the size of bryn mawr?</p>
<p>wellesley is better known than bryn mawr. reason? it's twice the size... by going to it, you may get more name rec in the general public but, i don't know, you may be giving up other aspects like a smaller community can offer. among top grad schools and recruiters, people in the know, theyre the same... i imagine people like these are smart and savvy enough to look beyond prestige when hiring/accepting applicants.</p>
<p>regarding phd rankings, there's a nice discussion on the haverford forum started by passionflower1 (instigator :)) that really puts the value of these things in context... especially if comparing among the top 20 schools.</p>
<p>isn't that because it's 2-3x the size of bryn mawr?]]</p>
<p>Absolutely, I didnt intend to mislead anyone. My point was, be careful of stats and Smith (even with the 2x size) has a substantial, percentage wise, of students going on to receive their PhD in the sciences. ..We could spend a lifetime purging the numbers and why certain schools produce more PhDs. Is it b/c of the college? Or do certainly colleges attract the type of students that are prone to enter PhD programs? (academia) Dartmouth alums are much more likely to go on to Law, Med, B school or careers where a PhD is a non issue. I dont believe anyone would argue Dartmouth isnt a fine institution. :)</p>
<p>Thanks for the Haverford suggestion. It was interesting</p>
<p>Theres more to a college than PhDs produced.
Another interesting stat:</p>
<p>Smith has an all-time record among the LACs, and likely (for the second year in a row) the largest number among undergraduates of any college or university in the country, and by far the largest number of women.</p>
<p>"According to this <a href="http://www.cies.org/us_scholars/%5B/url%5D">http://www.cies.org/us_scholars/</a> there are only about 800 'traditional' fulbrights awarded each year. From my limited experience (staying over jterm with a smith alum friend who's currently on a fulbright, and hanging out with other fulbrighters while there), most of them are grad students. So to have nearly 2% of the fulbrights this year coming from one place, which doesn't really have grad students applying (although Smith will help you apply if you're an alum, and I've been thinking about doing it after grad school), is pretty amazing. It's also cool that about 2.5% of the class of '06 will be doing a Fulbright next year!"
<a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=188929%5B/url%5D">http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=188929</a></p>
<p>Here's another list I have seen :</p>
<p>Here's another list I have seen ]]</p>
<p>That study has been totally discredited. Stanford, et al, colleges weren't even surveyed or counted as top grad school destinations. Sanford B School, Law and Med aren't top grad school destination? Duke and Dartmouth Med, et cetera, arent a top destination?
NU (Northwestern, Kellogg) isnt a top B School destination? Comon</p>
<p>And yes, even if Smith was listed as # 1, I'd still have enough integrity to say the same thing. ;)</p>
<p>"Smith also has an engineering program, which leads to automatic acceptance (with a 3.5 average) to Dartmouth JH, Michigan, Tufts, Notre Dame and soon Princeton graduate progams."</p>
<p>Roadlesstravelled, where did you read about the automatic acceptance? I am beginning to feel miserable for choosing another school over Smith.</p>
<p>Ina, I am sure you will excel at the school you chose. Each school has individual strengths and weaknesses. Don't second guess yourself. As for Bryn Mawr, the grad school acceptance rates are excellent:</p>
<p>"Graduate School
85 percent of BMC graduates pursue graduate school within 5 years of graduation. They pursue PhD's as well as degrees in medicine, law and business. Bryn Mawr proudly boasts a nearly 100 percent acceptance rate to law school and an 85 percent acceptance rate to medical school (the national average is in the 40s). Bryn Mawr ranks 1st in the country of its graduates who pursue PhD's in the Humanities and 3rd in all fields."</p>
<p>In terms of other womens colleges, check out this website:<a href="http://www.womenscolleges.org/%5B/url%5D">http://www.womenscolleges.org/</a></p>
<p>Again, I am sure that you will excel wherever you are!</p>
<p>How about this: Smith and Bryn Mawr are both great schools, both with their strengths and weaknesses, and nobody should be ashamed about chosing one over the other :)</p>
<p>I am beginning to feel miserable for choosing another school over Smith]]]</p>
<p>Ina, The guarantee acceptance is for /engineering grad school/ <em>ONLY</em> .If youre not majoring in engineering, Smith has zip advantage. And the truth of the matter is, any women from a good college will be admitted to the top engineering programs with a 3.5. Theres a dearth of women in engineering, so the top grad schools will be there with open arms for you as well, if that is your major.</p>
<p>You chose Bryn Mawr for what were very good reasons for your situation. Dont second guess yourself, especially over a small issue.</p>
<p>Bryn Mawr is absolutely beautiful and a wonderful college. Im extremely fond it and the women who are alumnae. A Bryn Mawr alumna was a manger of a company I was CEO. Gezz, the women was far brighter than I. Some would argue thats not hard but you get the idea.</p>
<p>Bryn Mawr has a claim to fame thats great. In the movie, Some Like It Hot, Tony Curtis played a woman in drag, Josephine. who claimed to be Bryn Mawr alumna. His pronunciation of Bryn Mawr with the old eastern up-crust inflection is hysterical. The movie won an Oscar. Bryn Mawr couldnt be in better company. :)</p>
<p>Graduate School
85 percent of BMC graduates pursue graduate school within 5 years of graduation. They pursue PhD's as well as degrees in medicine, law and business. Bryn Mawr proudly boasts a nearly 100 percent acceptance rate to law school and an 85 percent acceptance rate to medical school (the national average is in the 40s). Bryn Mawr ranks 1st in the country of its graduates who pursue PhD's in the Humanities and 3rd in all fields."}}</p>
<p>Do you have a link to that info? Thanks.</p>
<p>Acceptance rates to med, etc school are meaningless. The 80%-90% acceptance rate touted by many colleges, Smith included, is for students who progress to the point theyre <em>qualified</em> i.e. great MCATs and gpa to apply. </p>
<p>Most are weeded out in their first organic chem class :)</p>
<p>Note:replace LSATs for Law School</p>
<p>I imagine 75 women enter Smith (less for Bryn Mawr, its smaller) with the desire to attend med school 30 might get a 3.4++ in organic chem., bio, etc and a decent enough MACT to garnish a strong chance of med school acceptance. If only the qualified students apply, of course the accpetance rate is 80++</p>
<p>Wow. I dont really want to get into a "my school is better than yours" debate or ultra analysis of grad school info. For the Bryn Mawr info, check their website and contact their alumni association. I am friendly with an alum and they do detailed post BA analysis. </p>
<p>My main point is that all these schools are excellent and everyone should decide themselves, by visiting, talking to students and alums. I am supportive of all women's colleges, and think each is unique.</p>
<p>I dont really want to get into a "my school is better than yours" debate or ultra analysis of grad school info.]]</p>
<p>This is not my school vs. yours, and you know it. I included Smith in my critique.</p>
<p>Youre trying to deflect from the question. You quoted a paragraph regarding the 85 % grad school figure, which means you must have the article in front of you if you were able quote the paragraph verbatim. Where did the paragraph come from?</p>
<p>Bryn Mawr has no knowledge where the 85% originated. Enlighten us.</p>
<p>If youre going to give info to impressionable young women, you should have the facts correct. Its disingenuous to spew numbers to students attempting to make one of the most important decisions of their lives without links or facts. If the 85% figure you quoted is correct, Bryn Mawr is far ahead of every college in the world.</p>
<p>or the Bryn Mawr info, check their website]]</p>
<p>I did. I cant find the info. If you know where it is, please post a link. I was kind enough to do just that for Ina when answering her question.</p>
<p>My d. chose Smith over Bryn Mawr, but not because one school is "better" than another. Smith just seemed better for her. She loved Bryn Mawr, just not as much as Smith, but that was an entirely personal decision and one geared toward her own projected needs. IMO, Bryn Mawr's campus is second only to Mount Holyoke in terms of beauty. I think we will always look fondly on Bryn Mawr even though she decided against it in the end.</p>
<p>My d. didn't even consider Wellesley, although now she wishes she did. Like one poster's d, she wouldn't even entertain the idea of visiting there. </p>
<p>You can't go wrong with any of the Seven Sister schools - and that includes Vassar, which is no longer single gender.</p>