<p>Everyone here in the Ivy League subgroup forums acts as if they're the best thing ever, and nothing can go wrong if you go to one of them! But there's a big issue, the cost. It's discussed in multitude on these forums, I know. But many of the people that accepted to these institutions don't seem to worry about it. I was heavily considering applying to Brown ED, and I was sure set on going. I definitely would have been happy there. After guessing what the financial aid would be if I get in, I am now going to go to a state school (UF), and then go to a tier one university (I hope) for grad school. </p>
<p>For the longest time all I wanted was to go to Brown. Maybe three years. I was so excited that my application and essays were coming along nicely. So one day I figure out that with the amount of money my family makes, being in upper-middle class, I would have $100,000 in debt after four years. And that would take awhile to pay off. It would put a damper on graduate level degrees. As well as the anxiety of everyday living. Not that paying a sum such as that is not possible, but it wouldn't be fun.</p>
<p>So, how many people are there who get into Harvard but don't go due to financial reasons? Or any tippity-top school. So many people go each year. And the graduates scour the globe. Many hit it big. But there must be some people who graduate from such an institution only to get a decent starting salary as well as many dollars to pay off. Everyone makes it sound like it's nothing to worry about. But it seems like it is. I know that opportunities come up at these places, such as being recruited for Wall Street etc., but even people at lesser schools get some big opportunities.</p>
<p>Is it just me? Or does anyone agree? I mean, I could probably get in to at least one of the tier one universities I want to apply to, but there'd be no point in going. I'd be miserable when I got out, even with a higher pay.</p>
<p>I am in the same boat you are! I am from an upper-middle class family and most likely will receive little or no financial aid. BUT at the same time there is no way my family can afford to pay $50,000+ for college. I’m still going to apply to the more expensive schools because you never really know what can happen unless you actually go through with it. At the same time I have to keep the reality of the situation in sight. Also, applying to as many local private scholarships as possible never hurt. haha</p>
<p>What’s confusing is that statistics often say that the average debt at graduation is 20k or under. But I guess it’s easy to create misleading numbers.</p>
<p>No, those numbers aren’t that misleading. A large majority of students receive aid - on average, $40,000 per year - and aid decisions take assets, income and extenuating circumstances under consideration. Even students with parental incomes above $200,000 receive some aid.</p>
<p>College absolutely is a huge financial decision and every family must weigh their circumstances, priorities, and opportunities to make the best decision. It is not something that one should seek opinions on these boards upon. Our oldest did not apply to any ivy league schools because they have no merit based scholarships and we were in a similar position as the op. However, by the time #2 was applying to schools Harvard has started their FA initiative for the upper middle class and she is now about to begin her sophomore year there. We qualified for no FA at any other school that she applied to. While it still would be less expensive to send her to our state flagship, the difference is something we can afford and she has been very happy at H.</p>
<p>I see. Thank you for the insight. I understand much better now. I guess the best thing to do would be to not apply early anywhere. Then, if I do manage to get in to a place, I can weigh the options.</p>
<p>kwu - the op never said that his/her situation was as tough as your proposed inner city kid whose parents make 15k/yr. However, his/her better financial position does not diminish the importance to his/her family of the wealth depletion that can happen by sending their kids (especially if there is more than one) to private colleges. IMO it is insane to take significant debt like the 100k the op posits for an undergraduate degree.</p>
<p>^ Of course I don’t. It doesn’t make sense to me that families making 250,000+ a year don’t consider their progeny worth the investment, that some of these families have no savings as a result of consuming the entirety of their annual incomes, and that the same fear of not having enough to eat and losing the shirt off one’s back exists for families making more than ten times what mine does.</p>
<p>Firstly, upper middle class families are not necessarily families that make 250,000+ a year. You can reduce that amount by 150,000 and you may still have an upper middle class family.</p>
<p>Secondly, no one claimed that the overall problems an upper middle class family are such as the ones of a much poorer family. That does not however eliminate the problem of paying for college. Its not that paying the 50,000 per year will ruin the family, it is that it eliminates one large amount of savings, and especially in a time with increasing unemployment and when a source of income is always in danger of ceasing to exist it leaves the family exploited to possible economic woes.</p>
<p>Of course the poorer families are affected even more, but one having a worse problem does not cancel the existent problem of the other.</p>
<p>True, but since parents with total incomes between $60,000 and $180,000 are asked to pay an average of up to 10% of their income for Harvard, that would make the private university more affordable than even state public school for those families. (Although admittedly that is certainly not true at most private colleges in the country.)</p>
<p>Is the necessity to contribute a quarter or less of the family income for a child’s college education an overwhelming and unreasonable burden for most families:/? Shouldn’t the family have saved some funds over the years in antipation for the inevitability of their child’s college education? I’m not saying that being able to afford the huge amount of college tuition these days is easy, but like cltdad said, weighing the cost with the benefits, attending a top private university is not completely lacking in advantage… (such as this might have implied: “I mean, I could probably get in to at least one of the tier one universities I want to apply to, but there’d be no point in going. I’d be miserable when I got out, even with a higher pay”).</p>
<p>That may be true, but it is also an attitude that many people do not want to adopt, and I can perfectly understand why. Quite honestly, I consider it quite foolish to base one’s life on such a notion when one can do otherwise.</p>
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<p>I can’t disagree with you there, but bear in mind that there are exceptions. For example, I’m am international student who only very recently decided I’m interested in studying in the U.S.A. In my country, university education is public and completely free of cost as long as you get accepted. There is no reason why my family should have been saving up money for enough time to pay 50,000 per year.</p>
<p>Also, note that a decent number of families start out in a lower financial state only to find themselves in this “upper middle-class” state by the time their children are to attend college. They may not have not really had the chance to save up enough money.</p>
<p>Harvard Admissions likes to say that no one has ever turned Harvard down because they couldn’t afford it, and after receiving seven aid packages for two kids there, I’d have to agree that that’s probably true. There are certainly those who decide that they don’t want to spend the money after getting less expensive options elsewhere, but those students should (on paper) be able to swing the finances if they’d decided to. My family’s an example.</p>
<p>At present, our EFC is $74,000, impacted in part by the fact that when our kids were born we foolishly created funds for them in their own names (most colleges claim 20-25% of student assets each year toward the cost of attendance but only 5.6% of parents’ assets). Clearly, our D who’s a rising junior at Harvard wouldn’t get financial aid at just about anywhere else. At Harvard, her cost for the coming year will be just over $20,000, with the rest made up by need-based aid. Harvard chooses to assess student assets at the 5.6% rate as well as parents’, so D isn’t penalized for having her own funds. But that only accounts for about $12-15,000 of her aid; Harvard is contributing another $20,000 or so that she simply wouldn’t get at other schools (except perhaps Princeton, Yale, possibly Brown and Williams - others?).</p>
<p>I’m sure that our Ds could have lined up full rides or close to it elsewhere, but Harvard was a choice that they decided to make. It’s costing some money, but that cost won’t cripple our family’s finances.</p>
<p>“At present, our EFC is $74,000… At Harvard, her cost for the coming year will be just over $20,000, with the rest made up by need-based aid.”</p>
<p>This is what my financial aid has been looking like for my LAC:
EFC 7700, Total Cost $21,000
EFC 11000, Total Cost $20,000
EFC 6200, Total Cost $12,000</p>
<p>Harvard is affordable, and students admitted to Harvard don’t have to worry about financial aid. Any student who doesn’t receive need-based aid comes from a family that clearly can survive and even thrive without it.</p>
<p>kwu, I don’t understand what you were trying to do with that reply. I think it’s pretty obvious what you meant without you needing to restate it, and I already told you that you were wrong. whatever maybe you were trying to help an onlooker understand?</p>
<p>income does not scale up as you think it does <insert pet=“” theory=“” about=“” anomalous=“” section=“” of=“” socioeconomic=“” spectrum=“”> (it is also disappointing that you think this way and still believe that you right to speak so definitively with that kind of belief). a 300,000 -> 150,000 (post tax) paying 50,000 yearly is by no measure a small commitment and you trying to marginalize this problem betrays a violently deluded thought process.</insert></p>
<p>if I manage an acceptance to Harvard, the only reason I take that offer up immediately is because it’s Harvard and I can take names and kick ass (and the knowledge I’ve completely maximized my abilities); a Northwestern acceptance on the other hand I will be forced to turn down in favor of UofI, because a quarter of a million dollars in debt out of undergrad in a non-physician career path from a “second-tier” university is completely out of reach and irresponsible. And you think that it’s reasonable to conclude that because post-FA someone is expected to pay full tuition, tuition shouldn’t be a make-or-break issue? </p>
<p>I repeat, your marginalizing of the problem reflects poorly on you and whatever twisted worldview you live in.</p>
<p>btw, this isn’t an issue with financial aid; on the contrary, I think financial aid does its job extremely well. I’m just calling you out on vociferous ignorance.</p>
The factual part of this post is true. It also has nothing to do with the topic. Just because one can thrive with $50k less does not mean that spending that much money is a good decision. The notion that applicants should not worry about the money is IMO unacceptable. After aid offers are in, the decision should be made rationally and calmly. Just because I can afford a Mercedes does not mean that I should buy one.</p>
<p>That’s probably not the best reason for choosing Harvard over another school— you can “maximize your abilities” at other academic institutions as well if you take advantage of all the resources the college can offer. (Not saying that you shouldn’t choose Harvard over other schools, obviously. ;))</p>
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<p>Even if your parents may not be able to comfortably afford a $50,000 cost of attendance per year while their income is six times that much, they should still be able to contribute somewhat to your college tuition. So realistically, and hopefully, you would not be left with a quarter of a million dollars of debt as you have mentioned (which I do indeed think is unreasonable). </p>
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<p>I’m sure no one thinks that tuition should not be a make-or-break issue. Harvard’s generous financial aid was part of the reason why I chose it over other schools— though my family only makes about 30k a year, not 300k.</p>