Isolated or Over-Reacting? Liberal schools.

Ted Cruz went to Harvard, which proves that Harvard admissions isn’t always perfect at identifying and eliminating conservatives! (Joking). And of course Richard Haas and Roger Porter are two very well known Republicans who have taught at the “famously liberal” Harvard Kennedy School…

I was also intrigued that the anti-Trump sentiment was more pronounced and evident at CWRU and Miami (Ohio) than at the “liberal” University of Michigan.

My daughter, who is a sophomore in HS leans right, and is a little bit close-minded. She’s a kid, though, so I think that’s understandable. I lean left, but somewhere in the middle of the left(and middle right on a couple of issues). I like the idea of a slightly liberal LAC for her, because I think it would be good for her to be exposed to people with more liberal views.

But I have to admit, I do worry that she’ll be infected by some of the ultra-lefties and will need rehabilitation :slight_smile: She might feel more comfortable at a slightly conservative, but non-religious school, but I worry that she wouldn’t grow as much at a place like that.

I like SJW. That’s funny. Never heard that before.

@patriot420

There’s a difference between cynical and bitter

I have come to find that my 1970’s college experience was not what I believed it to be at the time. I doubt I ever had a deep soul baring conversation with more than a small handful of besties. I could not have told you what the political leanings were of even my best friends. So the deepest parts of my friends and aquaintances were hidden, and didn’t come to light until years later, mostly through reconnecting with people through social media.

In the years since college, a suprisingly large number of my college friends have come out as openly gay, and a smaller number have become openly comfortable expousing some of the most hateful speech imaginable. We have split in wide directions, literally and figuratively.

How in the world we all got along back then I don’t know. I believe our political leanings have become a wider gulf as we aged, but I don’t really know what “John” was thinking but not expressing back in 1978. I do know that my uneasy feelings about “John” being a bit of an ash hat back then have been confirmed. I am sad that my many gay friends felt unable to publicly express their true selves at the time, but I understand it.

There were undercurrents running through my medium sized regional midwestern public that were never going to bubble to the surface at the time. Once we left, people headed to the places where they could be more openly themselves,

I believe that colleges, like all things, which skew completely left OR completely right are unwelcoming to anyone who doesn’t hold to the orthodoxy. I wouldn’t ever want my kids in a place that was totally left-wing or totally right-wing because the worst impulses of the extremes are indulged, and the worst impulses of both extremes are monstrous.

What percentage of small LACs does this represent? Aren’t there others where designer purses and designer polos are the norm. Where politics are non-existent and frats are the social activity? Hana said this was true “at the most liberal”, not at all LACs. I think the ones at which this would be an issue are pretty well known. At some, however, I could see that even a kid that was more mainstream or had a more nuanced political view would find it difficult to be constantly called out to acknowledge their privileged status, especially if they don’t feel particularly privileged.

I also know a kid at Skidmore, who is very much on the right side of the aisle. He seems to have found like-minded kids (many of them in sports). I think it is harder to find your people, if you are not in line with the campus environment, but probably possible at most colleges. I work with a lot of men and I am on the other side of the aisle of virtually all of them. When I was younger, I tried to discuss politics but soon learned that for those of us who are on one side or the other, nothing will change our minds as it is has much more to do with our overall world view. Now I just avoid the discussion (especially when they try to bait me). There are some issues we can agree on, but not most. I think it is the same at college - the basic world view between the right and left are so different it is impossible to change someone’s mind.

I argued with one of my kids when he was happy that a well respected conservative woman was dis-invited to speak at his campus due to her positions on war. I pointed out that they might have learned something from her about her life, her reasons for beliefs etc. He didn’t see it that way at all.

On the other hand, I can understand the concern at George Mason, not over the naming as much as over the donors who paid for it.

It is really unfortunate that a handful of students could derail a talk. I wonder if there is more to the story about why Mock cancelled than a petition signed by 160 students, when they said they were not going to protest. If not, that is really unfortunate.

My S went to a LAC (with approx 1500 students) that most likely would consider quite liberal, but S reported to me there were many R’s on campus and the R club was quite active. In fact, His closest friend and roommate one year was the grandson of an R Senator (now deceased.)

The school and students accepted all points of view. During the last Presidential election they had 3 adjacent rooms In the student commons each with a TV tuned to to a specific channel to watch the returns (CNN/Fox/MSNBC) so one could chose the channel of your choice. My son was a Politics major and on student gov’t for 4 years so was quite attuned to the politics of the most active students and the ones interested in that field.

But there is the fact that many LAC’s in the northeast/mid Atlantic draw disproportionately from those areas of the country - which is more liberal then other parts of the country - so the majority of students will be liberal and conservative viewpoints will be in the minority.

I went to CU Boulder in the mid 70’s and from the after effects of Watergate and Vietnam the student body was extremely liberal. We spent more time protesting then in class - when we weren’t partying. :wink:

Kind of different, but my grad school program had a stated “social justice focus” and dissenting opinions were treated with hostility from the cohort. There were about 25 of us and a handful of those would regularly chime in with a less-PC view. One girl ran from the room crying because she was so upset by the anti-SJ sentiments expressed one day. After the program ended, I realized from talking to people that more of us than I thought disagreed with the hivemind, but felt too uncomfortable to say anything.

@mom2and -

If you are concerned about this issue, I suggest you purchase a copy of “Choosing the Right College” by John Zmirak. He covers these issues for a great many LACs, although Skidmore is not one of those reviewed.

Sorry, a bit off subject, but…
quote

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@-) What?!

Well, kudos to anyone that can combine a personal mission to aid in genocide prevention with a love of interpretive dance…

“Ted Cruz went to Harvard, which proves that Harvard admissions isn’t always perfect at identifying and eliminating conservatives! (Joking).”

He went to Princeton for undergrad. No one alleges that Harvard Law screens out the conservatives.

One thing that I think is different today than even 5 years ago is that “intersectionality” is a very hot issue on campus these days. So issues like gay rights, feminism, etc. are inextricably tied up with issues of race, class and privilege. Sounds good in theory, right?

But in practice it means that if you are a cis-gendered white person you are supposed to follow very strict rules about how to be a good ally. And being a good ally means you stay out of the spotlight and absolutely do not question the arguments, tactics or interpretation of events made by a student of color or a transgendered person on any issue, because you are then trying to dominate them, exert your privilege and traumatize them with facts, endangering their mental health. (I’m not making this up.) The safe response is often to opt for a sort of hashtag activism where you make appropriate expressions of solidarity especially on social media and mostly try to keep a low profile.

Another result of intersectionality is that activists are unwilling to accept the idea that someone can agree with them on most but not ALL issues. For example, many of the so-called campus “conservatives” are libertarians or fiscal conservatives who fully support things like civil rights, gay marriage, abortion rights, etc. But because they are not 100% in agreement, they are labelled classist, ableist, racists. I suspect this is less of a problem at a big university than at a small LAC where everyone pretty much knows everyone else (at least superficially) and mentally categorizes them.

Judging from some of the SJW videos going around, many of them already have mental health issues.

@Zinhead I assume you mean that in a sort of sarcastic way, but I’ve actually been thinking a lot about this. We have a family member who has been undergoing DBT (dialectical behavioral therapy). Part of the therapy includes “family therapy” to help us provide support. They teach us that while feelings aren’t facts and feelings can be totally irrational, they nevertheless have to be fully acknowledged before the mentally ill person can move forward. So we are encouraged to “validate” the person’s feelings by acknowledging them, and not to “invalidate” those feelings by arguing with them about why they’re wrong. This is very difficult when the feeling that is being expressed is very hurtful and untrue, like: you don’t love me, you wish I had never been born, you hate me, you’d like to get rid of me etc."

The therapists have pointed out that “validation” is a skill that helps in all kinds of relationships, including marriages and employment relationships. My college D was a high school debater and the child of two lawyers, so her natural reaction is to want to argue and present facts and evidence. But in her current LAC environment, I think she’s much better off using validation skills instead. It’s not what she imagined she’d be doing in college. She thought she’d be having lofty, intellectual late night debates about issues with her friends. Instead it’s more like she’s participating in mass therapy, lol.

This isn’t a LAC, it’s UMASS, but I saw this story the other day:

http://dailycollegian.com/2016/04/26/panelists-criticize-political-correctness-at-umass-gop-event/

"British journalist and entrepreneur Milo Yiannopoulos joined author and former philosophy professor Christina Hoff Sommers and YouTube comedian Steven Crowder to discuss feminism, social justice and microaggressions at the University of Massachusetts Monday night.

The event, titled “The Triggering: Has Political Correctness Gone Too Far?” took place at the Bowker Auditorium and was hosted by UMass College Republicans. The three speakers, known for their conservative viewpoints, drew long lines of supporters as well as pockets of protesters."

There is also a viral video going around related to the same event, of a protestor screaming and cursing and the speakers. She is allegedly a Hampshire College student who attended the event. Conservative media is having a field day with this tour—this Milo guy in particular says outrageous things and college kids flip out.

Here is a nymag article on the same event:

http://nymag.com/selectall/2016/04/how-breitbart-is-milking-the-milo-yiannopoulos-campus-outrage-outrage-cycle.html

^ Eww. So he proved that if you go out and intentionally try to provoke a reaction, you often get it. What’s the point of hosting this guy from the student standpoint?

UMass also had Krauthammer in 2015, without incident. http://www.masslive.com/politics/index.ssf/2015/04/obama_has_led_america_into_retreat_charles_krauthammer.html

Oh, and nothing newsworthy happened when Robert Gates spoke at Amherst College (omg a liberal LAC) the day before.

Where do all these people come from? Do SJWs live underground for 17 years before emerging, like cicadas? I know exactly one person who comes close to fitting this description, and that person is regarded as something of a flake at my school.

I know I live in a great big bubble, but everything I’ve seen suggests that these students are a small (make that tiny) vocal minority. Behavior like that prompts a backlash sooner or later; it’s Malcolm X didn’t accomplish many of his goals while MLK (in Malcolm X’s words, a “chump” whose civil rights allies were “stooges” for the white establishment) did. I think in 40 years’ time, we’ll remember Al Sharpton or even DeRay Mckesson while the “screaming girl” at Yale will be reduced to an anecdote on the rhetorical excesses of a small minority.

Actually Zinhead, not at all concerned as my kids are done choosing colleges. My point was simply that while there are very lefty LACs there are also very preppy LACs in which left-leaning kids may be the ones feeling left out. I think at a LAC, especially a small one, fit can be more of a factor. If there are only 1500 students on campus and 1000 of them are of the same mind-set, it is harder to connect with those that are not in the mainstream of that school.

With the exception of a very few, very small, very liberal schools, I think the very strident SJWs are in the minority.

“Where do all these people come from? Do SJWs live underground for 17 years before emerging, like cicadas? I know exactly one person who comes close to fitting this description, and that person is regarded as something of a flake at my school.”

The kids who end up as activists at Oberlin, Sarah Lawrence, Hampshire, Bryn Mawr, et al. are a tiny handful of U.S. high schoolers, and more importantly, they aren’t the same in high school as they are after getting to college. They may be radical vegans before college, but the patterns we’re talking about are college phenomena for the most part. This is a culture that only exists at colleges. First-semester freshmen don’t lead these movements. It’s something you learn to become part of.

“Where do they all come from and how do they all think alike /follow the same manifesto?” my son was always wondering … He has learned one big answer and believe it or not MANY actually do start in HS esp in clubs like GSA’s or civic mindedness… He has found many at his HS already… The answer is TUMBLR!!! and online blogs sites like auto straddle …salon or sites like those …

They all have one thing in common… its the social media info …they get from sites like Tumblr