Does anyone have any experience with outside scholarships and also getting financial aid from ivy league schools? Even with the financial aid, we still have a good amount of tuition to pay. We have been told by a couple of ivy leagues that any outside scholarships will only reduce the college grant and possibly federal grant and no matter how much we get from outside, the parent contribution cannot ever go away which seems ridiculous. One, it seems that there is no point to take in any outside aid if it will not benefit my student. Am I wrong on this aside from to help the school’s endowment but then the same can be said of the outside scholarship foundations? Two, is it possible to tell the school that we dont need any grant/federal grant if our outside scholarship is greater than this amount? Lastly, does anyone also know if the top 3 ivies will match the lowered-ranked ivies? Thanks you
You can’t stack outside merit aid on top of need-based aid. If you get outside aid, it reduces your total need for the institution’s need-based aid. The institution’s money is the last stop, after whatever other funds are available to you.
But look at the rules carefully. Many times outside scholarships will replace loans and work-study awards before they cut into grants.
Outside scholarships are most helpful to students in the donut hole, who do not qualify for need-based aid.
Of course. If the student gets an outside scholarship that exceeds the total amount of the need-based aid, congratulations!
I don’t know what you consider the “top 3 Ivys,” but it doesn’t really matter if a school is in the Ivy athletic league or not. All colleges will take a look at need-based offers from other academic-peer colleges.
Some schools have allowed smaller outside scholarships to be used for travel, computers, books, study abroad if they are smaller amounts. If you use them for tuition or R&B, most will apply them first and then reduce your need based aid because your need has been reduced.
If you qualify for federal aid like a pell grant, that is not reduced. It is based on the prior prior year income.
Or unmet need (as they define “need”) also. But many of the Ivy League schools give FA packages with small student contributions and no unmet need, so even with this kind of policy, the amount that an outside scholarship can help is limited, unless is it larger than what the need-based grants would be plus the student contribution. Example:
https://college.harvard.edu/financial-aid/how-aid-works/types-aid describes Harvard’s policy:
Harvard’s net price calculator at https://college.harvard.edu/financial-aid/net-price-calculator shows that the expected “Student Term-Time Work” is $3,500. So outside scholarships up to $3,500 would reduce a Harvard student’s net price. Beyond that, the outside scholarship would have to exceed $3,500 + the Harvard scholarship (need-based financial aid grant) to further reduce the net price.
We are in the same situation and are just as confused. Son is going to a full need met school, but school calculated our family contribution to an amount higher than we expected and we are even more nervous about costs for years. 2-4 My son applied for a lot of scholarships because he didn’t know where he would end up going. He has already won 3 scholarships and 2 are nice sized scholarships for 4 yrs.
I am not sure if you can just tell the school you don’t want any aid. It might depend. One scholarship requires my son to apply for aid each yr and they are a “last dollar” scholarship - they require access to the online school account and they will only pay after all other grants and scholarships are applied. Another one said that they will call FA office and ask how much they can give before grant is reduced and then they cut off how much they give at that dollar amount bc they want to help the student not the school, which I totally understand.
I have been researching and read about one interesting possibility. Potentially you can ask the scholarship foundation if they would defer the scholarship to a future year or possibly until after graduation. I have read some scholarships are willing to defer, then you take loans and after graduation use the scholarship to pay the loans.
DS09 started applying for scholarships prior to receiving all of his decisions. One of his scholarships was sent directly to the school while others were given directly to him. He decided to attend Princeton and they did reduce their financial aid by the amount of the scholarship. While I have to admit that their FA package was decent it was disappointing to have put in so much work trying to earn scholarships just to find out that he would not benefit from them.
DD20 was accepted to Princeton, Yale & Brown. She did have a preference and appealed on her own (informed me the following day). Though she has not committed as of yet, one of the schools did match (actually $10 lower) the other and offer free required text books.
You need to contact the financial aid office at the college and ask them what their policy is about outside scholarships. In most cases, you can’t stack outside awards with what the college has given you in need based grant money.
Outside scholarships reduce your financial need that the college needs to fulfill…because by getting those outside scholarships you have more on your side of the paying.
Usually if you get outside scholarships, need based aid is reduced first by the self help portion which is loans and work study. If the outside scholarship is more than that amount, it reduces grants/need based scholarships.
These colleges expect you to pay your calculated family contribution. Outside scholarships at most schools will not reduce your calculated family contribution. It will reduce your need based aid.
But to know for sure…contact the college. And ask their policy.
Princeton did not even replace expected student work earnings with the scholarship amount up to that?
Since I have had so much time on my hands lately I have been reorganizing. I just so happen to be able to put my hand on DS09’s acceptance packet to check and it appear that there is no line item or mention of a student contribution. Would have loved to have taken a picture of the letter to post but the letter is worded as follows: “any outside scholarship you may be eligible to receive would reduce your University grant”. Perhaps things have changed since then but I have no other children between DS09 and DD20 to compare.
This might require dishonesty. Most colleges ask if the student has won any outside scholarships.
From Princeton FA:
“ Outside scholarships replace your Princeton job and then your summer savings expectation. Once these work expectations are eliminated, any additional outside scholarships will replace your Princeton grant.
If your Princeton grant is reduced as the result of an outside scholarship, you may recover reduced funds toward the one-time purchase of a personal computer. This policy applies to basic hardware and software products up to $3,000.”
I believe this year they’ve replaced the ‘summer plus Princeton job’ with a flat $3500 student contribution, which reduced the expected student contribution by a few thousand. Students receiving aid also get help with health insurance costs. I can’t find the story but thought I read Harvard and Yale are moving in the same direction.
I’m not aware of any school with need based aid anywhere near as generous as these schools that doesn’t reduce a grant for outside scholarships (though some less generous schools that normally use loans as part of the aid package will allow outside scholarships to replace loans).
In the end it’s the bottom line that matters for most.
IIRC, Princeton does not package federally funded student loans in their need based awards. That being the case, the only thing to reduce would be the grants.
Interesting… Looks like Princeton expected $0 student contribution back in 2009 (so that outside scholarships only reduced grants), but (according to https://swebapps.princeton.edu/FinAid/finaid_form.pl ) now expects a $3,500 student contribution (that could be replaced by outside scholarships up to that amount before reducing grants, according to https://finaid.princeton.edu/policies-procedures/outside-scholarships ).
DD20 was accepted at Princeton and her FA looks very different from DS09. I do see the $3500 student contribution.
I understand the university grant will be reduced after first deducting contribution. However, it is frustrating to acknowledge the fact that the child worked so hard to get these scholarships and yet, it cannot benefit them, especially since you have to start them well before you understand your FA package. So you can opt to not accept the outside scholarships and benefit outside scholarship foundations or accept it and benefit the college endowment.
However, I do not understand how one ivy college says that parent contribution can never go away, even if the outside scholarships exceed the total of student contrib, pell grants and college grants. Is this an Ivy league approach? They even said they will return the excess money to the scholarship foundation. So this is why I ask whether I can just say no to the whole college financial aid package and have them receive the outside scholarship which will cover parent contribution. Just not sure if this is possible since I have applied for the financial aid already.
Talking to UCB, they say the pell grant will not disappear and that they cannot return the money to the outside scholarship foundations since it’s usually received as a check in the first place. It would be too difficult to find an address and allocate the excess scholarships to the diff foundations, etc. So any excess scholarship (net of total cost) will be given to the student. Very diff stories. Not sure who to believe. The same federal pell grant rule should be the same regardless of whether one school is a state school or not, right?
I have emailed each scholarship foundation to see which one can be postponed or even paid out to the student directly - most cannot postpone and most need to be paid out directly to schools. So we are heavily stacked in the freshman year.
@Brantly, I have been told that the schools will only match with those schools in the same relative ranking, roughly speaking.
@Sarrip, you meant the ivies matched the better FA package by $10k? if so, congratulations. In my D’s case, we are trying to get HYP to match a lower-ranked IVY. Not sure if they think they don’t have to.
Yes, I know at Princeton, student have $3500 contribution and up to $3000 for computer. so $6500 is your max for outside scholarship. I was wondering if they will insists on parent contribution even the outside scholarship exceeds student’s $6500 plus Princeton grant?
Most of the Ivies will match. Get in touch with the Princeton FA office (if that’s the one you’re asking about) and let them know you received a different offer and you’re wondering if they can review.
I’m a little confused though…you’re saying you’re receiving a pell grant and yet the outside scholarships exceed the $6500 plus the entire grant at Princeton? I’d expect the Princeton parent contribution to be pretty low, close to zero, for those receiving a pell grant. I’d also expect FA to be much better than other non-HYP Ivies. Is it possible there was a mistake on your FA app?
No, it’s an approach used by most (if not all) of the schools that meet full need using need-based aid only. You need to understand that parents are considered to be the first payer for their child’s education, based on the ability to pay. If a meets-full-need school determines that the parents have at least some ability to pay, why should the school spend their own money to cover the parent share if outside scholarships are in the mix? If the school determines that you have some ability to contribute to the cost of attendance, there is no free ride. Consider yourself (and your child) fortunate, say thank you, and carry on.
@BelknapPoint OP appears to be saying that if outside scholarships plus parent contribution exceeds COA, the parent contribution will not be reduced and the excess will be returned to outside funders. I don’t think that’s typical is it? Sounds like possible miscommunication or misunderstanding
Contributions to COA are prioritized in the following order:
- PELL grant and outside scholarships
- Family contribution
- College grants/scholarships
- Student contribution (work study, summer earnings)
- Loans (federal, college, etc.) (not applicable for most, if not all, Ivies)
If grants/scholarships in 1) exceed COA, neither 2) family contribution nor 3) college grants/scholarships are necessary. If not, there will still be family contribution.
@politeperson, (I love your name). To your point, even though the income is low, we had saved a lot so our assets (incl 529k) are high. The school basically said that it is bc of our assets. FAFSA is not asset-based, whereas most school’s finaid or CSS forms are. So I believe pell grant is FAFSA based, that is prob why we are getting pell grant. While we have only heard back from a handful of outside scholarships, she is getting pretty close to matching the school’s grant, and there are still a lot of them that have yet to announce. I was just really taken back by one of the Ivies saying that the parent contributing can never go away, regardless of the amount of outside scholarship, and that excess scholarship money would be returned.
@BelknapPoint, I am not sure you understand. In this case, no school money would be used at all, assuming 100% outside money covers everything, and yet the school insist on the parents paying. What the logic of not letting the student benefit from their hardwork esp when they are not asking school for any money.