Ivy Leagues ... not worth it.

Pre-College Issues High School Life
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<p>Is there anybody on here who thinks that Ivy Leagues and other top schools are a bit pretentious and that you could get a well-rounded education somewhere else? I feel as if I have developed this opinion over time. When I was in middle school, I had this dream of going to Yale, and for most of my high school career, I was convinced that the only place that I could go to for college was at one of the nation's top schools, and that other schools with less prestige did not stack up. Until I went to college information sessions....</p>

<p>I remember going to a University of Chicago information session, and one of the remarks by the guidance counselors really irked me. They said that, some years, they look for specific things in people's applications. For example, they may want some more trumpet players at their school in a particular year, so if you play the trumpet, you have a good chance of getting in that year. I was fed the same crap when I went to a Vanderbilt information session. </p>

<p>It made me think, what kind of attitude is that? That people should join activities not because they are interested in things, such as music, but because "oh some admissions officer said that I should do these things because it will make me look good and like an overachiever, and I can get into any school I want to!" I feel like the system is rigged, and that many of the facets of the admissions processes of these schools is based on pretentious crap such as that.</p>

<p>Also, many of the universities do not offer such diversity as other schools. I know of a state school that has a top rated business school, medical school, music school, school of journalism, school of physical therapy, etc. etc. Some of the more well-known schools do not offer such opportunities. Not to mention the cost of top schools - I am a premedical student and now I couldn't IMAGINE going to a school that costs 50K+ a year and carrying all of that debt to medical school.</p>

<p>I know that top schools offer world-renowned professors and great career opportunities, but if you really think about it, the information is the same. The Biology department of a lesser known school and a top school are going to teach the same information, it's not like the Ivy teaches a totally different branch of science. </p>

<p>Top schools are a great place to go, don't get me wrong, and they provide students with a ton of opportunities to succeed, but I feel like other schools are not as appreciated as much, and that the whole fake-achiever, drowned in debt, makes top schools very unattractive. Ever since I have researched into schools, I have been slowly forming this opinion and it's something that I feel pretty strongly about. </p>

<p>I would be interested to hear your thoughts...</p>

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<p>My parents think that.
They’re persuading me to go to an in-state.</p>

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<p>It’s where you go after college that counts.</p>

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<p>^^ ditto [10 char]</p>

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<p>Top schools are not all top notch, but a lot of them are.
The ivy league offers the best financial aid out of almost all private colleges. You could potentially go to Harvard and pay less there then at an in-state school or community college. Not all universities are that generous though.
I think that other schools are greatly overshadowed by top schools but rightfully so in some cases. Top schools usually do offer a ton of diversity, but state schools can too.</p>

<p>I think that it ultimately comes down to what the student can afford and prefers.</p>

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<p>These threads and statements pop up time after time, but they always have a spot on this forum in my opinion.</p>

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<p>Haters gonna hate.</p>

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<p>What really attracts me to the Ivy Leagues (and schools of similar caliber) is the student body. The predominant sense I get from my classmates at my public high school is apathy: the stupid kids don’t really give a **** in a “I wanna go get hammered” sense while the smart kids do the same (except in a more “I’m too cool for school” sense). </p>

<p>I want to learn in an environment where the students genuinely care about getting an education. Ivy Leagues (and similar schools) are a great place to find that kind of student body.</p>

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<p>While I mostly agree, I feel that the OPs example was a bit misguided. It seems to me that Chicago was trying to give an inside look at how decisions are made. All schools need to examine their needs. If you don’t have a enough trumpets for the school band, you’re going to want to find one. It’s variable things like that which will factor into admissions at many if not most schools. It didn’t come across as pretentious to me. It wasn’t suggesting that all students who play a specific instrument have higher chances everywhere. It varies year to year, school to school, etc…unless you play bassoon ;)</p>

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<p>^Same for me. (I mean 314159265’s post lol)</p>

<p>I wanna go to a school where pretty much EVERYONE is excited to study there, to live there, to engage in activities there, to be part of a community!
You can’t find this in a big state school (no offense), only at SOME Ivy Leagues (I think) and other top-tier schools (or at least more academic-driven ones).</p>

<p>I don’t think it’s going to an Ivy League or other top-tier school that should matter when somebody is choosing where to go to college; rather where is the best environment for this person to live and learn for the next four years.</p>

<p>Just my 2 cents</p>

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<p>

There’s more than one?</p>

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<p>

No, it was not that kind of attitude. They were telling you about how schools have institutional needs that add randomness to the admissions game. What works one year is not what works another year. They aren’t encouraging anyone to start playing trumpet just to get into Chicago, or all those lousy non-trumpet-players to look elsewhere.</p>

<p>

Different schools have different advantages. The Ivies aren’t best for everything.</p>

<p>I couldn’t imagine a student who takes the full brunt of a top-end tuition himself, either. But as I’m sure you’re aware, the Ivies have excellent financial aid for the most part, and generally parents contribute something. But if you have rich parents who refuse to fund your Ivy League education… then going elsewhere is a good idea over taking $250K in debt.</p>

<p>

This is a large part of my attraction to top LACs. It somewhat applies to Ivy Leagues, as well, but my feeling is that less people at Ivy Leagues are applying there for a sense of community, in part because the Ivy League is so widely fetishized and in part because it is so selective that there’s a tendency just to send apps to the schools you don’t like as much in case you get rejected from your top choice.</p>

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<p>I think you misinterpreted the admissions officer’s point. Their point was that decisions can be very subjective and random based on what they are looking for during a particular year. Since they don’t know what that will be each year, they were telling you that you shouldn’t do things just because you will get into college but because you love them. </p>

<p>Ivy league schools do offer very diverse fields of study. They offer an incredible number of majors and most have several graduate schools that undergraduates can take classes in. The professors are at the top of their respective fields and encourage undergraduate research. There is a lot more funding available to do research at top schools so students can start to get paid early on.</p>

<p>There is usually a big difference in the environments of top schools and the environments of state schools, like University of Florida for example. I was recently talking to someone who transferred to my school from there and he said that he felt in and out of the classroom he felt like he was getting a much better education. </p>

<p>There are honors colleges and other opportunities for highly motivated students at state schools, but for many that’s not enough and they would fit in at a top school more comfortably. That’s not to say there aren’t plenty of brilliant students at state schools who excel, but they especially would certainly benefit from going to a top school.</p>

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<p>Going to an Undergrad Ivy= Prestige, Awesome Networking and Connections, Extremely boost for grad school applications…</p>

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<p>^For graduate schools, it matters what you did rather than where you went for college.</p>

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<p>The only difference is networking, if that’s your thing. You can get the same learning experience at any among the “Public Ivies” and other decent private schools if that’s all you care about. (For sciences, premed, and engineering, this is sometimes all you need.) </p>

<p>In my experience, Ivy classes are about 2/3s geniuses and 1/3 legacies and recruits. For me, all that schmoozing would be get tiresome. On the other hand, StateU is filled with a lot of kids who may not take their work seriously. </p>

<p>I feel that schools like UChicago or Stanford etc. are more genuinely intellectual and don’t seem to let in as many legacies.</p>

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<p>I’m with 314159265 on this also.</p>

<p>I feel as if people who attend an Ivy League (which I’ll include Stanford in) school are more serious in what they do. As I progressed through my freshman and sophomore years of high school, I was extremely irked to find people in Honors classes that still didn’t give a crap about learning and would therefore talk all hour. This is something I want to avoid. I want to go to a college that everyone takes seriously, both academically and leisurely (ECs, clubs, etc…).</p>

<p>I, too, want to go to Yale some day (though at the rate I’m going, my chances are practically nil), and in no way am I going to Yale for it’s prestige. I am honestly interested in the programs that they offer there and the community seems like a perfect fit for me.</p>

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<p>^I’m not sure that they really are like that, though. I’ve heard of a lot of people at the Ivies in particular who are legacies, snobby etc. </p>

<p>That’s why I mentioned UChicago and Stanford. They seem to me like they are just as intellectual but also grounded in reality.</p>

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<p>^I’ve heard that stuff about Harvard in particular, but not Yale…, or many of the other Ivies. Maybe I should go check it out a bit more.</p>

<p>Hmm… Stanford, you say…?</p>

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<p>I think there was a thread on HSL a few days ago where the OP’s friend (at Princeton) took a summer course at Rutgers (for financial issues and more flexibility) and commented on how apathetic Rutgers students were compared to Princeton’s.</p>

<p>And Rutgers isn’t even that bad a school.</p>