Ivy Obsession: Has It Gotten Out Of Control?

College Search & Selection
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<ul>
<li><p>Putting a child in the "right" pre-school...one that will give him the best path to an Ivy Education</p></li>
<li><p>Sending kids to elite boarding schools at a young age to have them become an expert in a certain area (art, music, writing, etc.). In the process, he/she leaves his/her siblings and parents.</p></li>
<li><p>Moving one's family 3000 miles to get a child into the "right" elementary, middle and secondary schools</p></li>
<li><p>Taking sixth graders on tours of Ivies, MIT, Stanford, Cal Tech</p></li>
<li><p>SAT Prep Courses</p></li>
<li><p>ACT Prep Courses</p></li>
<li><p>Hiring Essay "Consultants"</p></li>
<li><p>Hiring $20,000 College Counselors who have "Insider Secrets" that will help get you into an Ivy</p></li>
<li><p>Taking the SAT multiple times before junior year</p></li>
<li><p>Skipping a grade</p></li>
<li><p>Doing Extracurriculars of no interest for the sole purpose of padding one's resume of activities for college</p></li>
</ul>

<p>What's the deal with all this stuff? Do children whose families emphasize these things have the chance to live a normal childhood?</p>

<p>Are these things done in the children's best interest, or that of their parents?</p>

<p>Does a sixth grader approach his parents and say, "I want to go on a campus tour of Cal Tech?"</p>

<p>Help me out here......I just don't get it.</p>

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<p>Not really, you want a good education for your child...so you do what you THINK is best....c'mon now.</p>

3

<p>
[quote]
* Putting a child in the "right" pre-school...one that will give him the best path to an Ivy Education

[/quote]

This only happens in cities like San Francisco and New York... and anyway some of these parents are doing it for the actual benefit of the child. </p>

<p>
[quote]
* Sending kids to elite boarding schools at a young age to have them become an expert in a certain area (art, music, writing, etc.). In the process, he/she leaves his/her siblings and parents.

[/quote]

I feel like you're referencing schools like Exeter and Andover... since when was 9th grade a young age?? Anyway, most of these people are already 'experts' by the time they arrive. That and I have never heard of anybody leaving for school (besides studying abroad) before high school.</p>

<p>
[quote]
* SAT Prep Courses
* ACT Prep Courses

[/quote]

Some people need more help than a book can give. Not everybody in these courses have Harvard as their first choice.</p>

<p>
[quote]
* Taking the SAT multiple times before junior year

[/quote]

While I do know that some people take the SAT 'for fun' (I knew someone who wanted to break 2200 by 9th grade), a lot of middle school/high school underclassmen who take these courses do it because they're required for programs like JHU's CTY.</p>

<p>
[quote]
* Skipping a grade

[/quote]

What's wrong with skipping a grade? Some children are extremely precocious and completely bored in their current setting. </p>

<p>Some of your points are underdeveloped, and you're using resources that kids use for a lot of reasons and manipulating them towards one goal: college. While there are some people who do these things, they are few and far in between (CC is a self-select group).y</p>

4

<p>
[quote]
* SAT Prep Courses * ACT Prep Courses

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Has nothing to do with ivies. It's more of a general college admissions issue. And there is no better alternative currently.</p>

<p>
[quote]
* Sending kids to elite boarding schools at a young age to have them become an expert in a certain area (art, music, writing, etc.). In the process, he/she leaves his/her siblings and parents.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>We have already been over this. Most students who go to boarding school WANT to go to boarding school and BENEFIT from it. 9th grade isn't too young for some people. And most boarding schools aren't for becoming an expert in an area. Most are just very high quality schools. </p>

<p>
[quote]
* Moving one's family 3000 miles to get a child into the "right" elementary, middle and secondary schools

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Parent's do this so their children can have a quality education. To imply that they do this for the main purpose of getting their kid in to an ivy 10 years down the line is ridiculous.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Hiring $20,000 College Counselors who have "Insider Secrets" that will help get you into an Ivy

[/quote]
</p>

<p>We have already been over this as well. There are no insider secrets. Go read that thread again.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Taking the SAT multiple times before junior year

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Refer to my response regarding the SAT prep courses.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Hiring Essay "Consultants"

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Refer to my response regarding the SAT prep courses.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Skipping a grade

[/quote]
</p>

<p>That does NOT help a student get in to an ivy AT ALL. If anything, the student may have a lesser chance by skipping a grade.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Doing Extracurriculars of no interest for the sole purpose of padding one's resume of activities for college

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Most students have some interest in what they are doing. For those who don't, think of it like trying to get an A in a class for which you have no interest. </p>

<p>
[quote]
Taking sixth graders on tours of Ivies, MIT, Stanford, Cal Tech

[/quote]
</p>

<p>This can be a little weird, but in some situations it might get the kid a little bit excited about education and possibly instill a little bit of motivation to work hard in high school.</p>

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<p>For the most part, I think this is sensationalist garbage. I'm not denying that there are parents who do these things, but neither I nor any of my friends who are going to Ivy League schools have had experiences remotely like what you've described here. I'm from a competitive area -- nowhere near New York, but certainly competitive -- and I can't relate to this at all.</p>

<p>This is only my perspective, but: </p>

<p>I started first grade a year early because I'd learned to read at two and a half and preschool had me bored to tears. I didn't decide to apply to college in the United States until sophomore year and didn't begin to consider Ivies until junior year; my parents pressured me to go to school in Europe because it would have been cheaper. My college counselor at school either discouraged me or fed me blatant misinformation (that I would've taken for truth had it not been for CC). I scored a modest -- by CC standards -- 2270 on the SAT, which I took twice; I didn't study for my Subject Tests, and aside from an 800 on French, I scored in the low 700s. I spent the last week of December filling out applications, and nobody edited my essays. The only Ivies I applied to were Princeton and Dartmouth, for their emphasis on undergraduate education, and the only part of the process that could be called "out of control" was when I sprinted through the post office doors at 15:59:50 on December 31 to mail my applications. </p>

<p>I suppose it's possible that I somehow happen to be the only person in the world who wasn't caught up in prestige-whoring and trophy-hunting and didn't have half-crazed, overbearing parents cracking their whips at me every step of the way, but how likely is that? How much more likely is it, then, that this so-called Ivy Obsession is an extremely limited phenomenon blown very much out of proportion?</p>

<p>Color me skeptical.</p>

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<p>
[QUOTE]
Hiring $20,000 College Counselors who have "Insider Secrets" that will help get you into an Ivy

[/QUOTE]
</p>

<p>And yet it's ironic that most of the "insider secrets" can be learned here for free.</p>

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<p>Some of you have responded that parents are doing this because it's best for their child. I give credit to parent's who are committed to their child's well-being. But, my question is this:</p>

<p>Do parents have an exaggerated view of what it takes to "make it" in today's world? I have heard many parents say that in order to make it in this world, it is essential for their child to go to an elite college.</p>

<p>I simply don't buy that mode of thinking. First of all, I'm not so sure that "making it" in today's world is so difficult that a degree from Harvard, MIT, Stanford or Yale is necessary.</p>

<p>I believe that it's more important to teach our children that "making it" in today's world is very achievable as long as one sets high (yet reasonable and achievable) goals and does their best to achieve them. Not everyone has to be a Nobel Prize winner, a CEO, or an investment banker to be successful and happy.</p>

<p>By overemphasizing the need to graduate from an elite college, are parents teaching their kids that being stressed out and overshcheduled (as many Ivy-aspiring students are) is the way in which life is meant to be? If one is so stressed out and overscheduled at the age of 16, what are they going to be like at the age of 45?</p>

<p>As for the gifted child: Yes, perhaps he should do everthing he can to develop his intellectual talents. But, because of their giftedness, some of the most gifted are never exposed to the "normal" things a child should do: going to rock concerts, playing sports, going fishing, etc. Some are molded from a young age to become an MIT scientist who may potentially find the cure for cancer.</p>

<p>Perhaps I'm an ignorant old fool, like many on CC have repeatedly called me, but getting students on the "superintellectual" track during early childhood is very distasteful to me. </p>

<p>On College Confidential, this type of thing is very acceptable because of the type of viewers it attracts. In the mainstream of society, however, the types of things I mentined in my opening post would be considered way "over the top."</p>

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<p>jnpn: Just curious.....out of my list of things in the opening post, how many have you done?</p>

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<p>superfly: Excellent and very sensible post. Thanks.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
Moving one's family 3000 miles to get a child into the "right" elementary, middle and secondary schools

[/quote]
</p>

<p>There is nothing wrong with moving to an area with a better school district. I went to a bad elementary school and my parents worked hard to move to an area with a good school district and I am grateful for their sacrifice. We only moved about 30 miles, not 3000 miles.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Taking sixth graders on tours of Ivies, MIT, Stanford, Cal Tech

[/quote]
</p>

<p>My younger brother is in 7th grade and sometimes has travel tournaments in New Jersey. When we were in the area we took a tour of Princeton. My brother loved the school and his school work has vastly improved from the visit. Having goals has increased his motivation.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Hiring Essay "Consultants"/SAT Courses

[/quote]
</p>

<p>None of these things are necessary to get into an elite college. You can have the best consultants/tutors in the world, but if the kid isn't motivated he will not get into a top school. At the same time, I don't blame parents for trying to help their children succeed. </p>

<h2>People on other websites are "obsessing" about celebrity gossip (ie. Paris Hilton) and other things I find useless but I don't make tons of threads bashing them.</h2>

<p>I had lots of friends in HS and the college admissions process didn't effect my social life at all. Researching schools my sophomore year motivated me to do well academically. When acceptance letters came around, I got into several Ivies along with my #1 choice. I would rather live in a world where people set goals and work hard towards them than be satisfied with mediocrity. If you have the talent and motivation to go to a top school --- why not?</p>

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<p>
[quote]
jnpn: Just curious.....out of my list of things in the opening post, how many have you done?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>only two: SAT prep, private college counselor</p>

<p>Don't try to fall back on your belief that everyone who disagrees with you does so because it hits too close to home.</p>

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<p>

Well said. I'd appreciate a reply as well, if it isn't too much trouble.</p>

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<p>jnpn: Based on many of your responses to my posts, I'm not surprised to hear that you used a private college counselor. You're very fortunate to have the financial resources to do so.</p>

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<p>My parents didn't hire one because they had money to spend or wanted me to go to an ivy. They hired one because the one provided for me at my high school was beyond incompetent -- with an attitude and beliefs similar to yours...</p>

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<p>Regarding the "parents taking kid on tour of elite university" point--</p>

<p>I wish my parents would have done that for me, or at least showed me some viewbooks of those places. If I would have known universities like Caltech, MIT and Princeton existed I would have had a reason to actually work hard in high school. I didn't know non-Canadian universities even existed when I was in high school. And since no university in Canada is very difficult to get into (and none of them is particularly inspiring either), I had zero motivation through high school. I skipped a grade not because I was motivated, but because I was bored, loathed my peers and teachers, and wanted to end the experience as quickly as I could.</p>

<p>I was put in a special preschool, and went to an exclusive middle school, but it couldn't have been for elite colleges because my parents never even told me about them.</p>

<p>Essay coaches and private counsellors? Tens of thousands of dollars?? That just seems like desperation. And it's a bit sad if you think about it.</p>

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<p>What parents are you referring to? Where are they?</p>

<p>Not here, from what I can tell. Referring to the thread on the Parents' Forum that reports where poster's children are enrolling for the class of 2007, only 20 out of 156 will be attending Ivy League schools.</p>

<p>While my daughter had the stats to get into an Ivy, it wasn't her thing and she didn't apply to any. She's very happy at her quirky LAC.</p>

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<p>jnpn: You're starting to make me think that you don't agree with much of what I have to say.</p>

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<p>fireflyscout: There are 3500 colleges in the US. Only 8 are Ivies. You said that one out of every eight on CC is attending an Ivy. Considering there are only eight Ivies, one out of every eight attending an Ivy is quite a high percentage attend these eight schools.</p>

<p>Of the remaining seven out of eight, there are probably some who wanted to attend an Ivy, but were not admitted. Also, some of those seven out of eight are probably attending Ivy-comparable schools such as MIT, Stanford, Amherst, etc.</p>

19

<p>
[quote]
jnpn: You're starting to make me think that you don't agree with much of what I have to say.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Wow, really? What a nugget of wisdom that is. OBW, you really need to find some other forum to bother. You are preaching Judaism in a church.</p>

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<p>Old but wise, "shoot for the stars" and if you don't make it "you'll land on the moon."</p>

<p>There is nothing wrong with wanting to go to a top notch college, getting a good education, and gaining financial stability. You make it seem like some horrible moral issue.</p>