Job Outlook in Estate Planning and Trusts

Graduate School Law School
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<p>Hi Everyone - new member here. I stumbled across this forum while researching Law Schools.</p>

<p>My situation is a bit atypical. I'm 43 years old, and have been working as a Software Developer my whole career. I just recently finished the courses for the Certified Financial Planner Certificate, and I'm planning to take the certification exam next March.</p>

<p>I started out thinking I'd be a CFP with an emphasis on Retirement Planning and Investing, but I really enjoyed the Estate Planning course, which is one of the 5 areas that make up the CFP certification.</p>

<p>I like Estate Planning much better than all the other material, but the problem is that I can't do most of the actual Estate Planning work without a law degree.</p>

<p>I have a couple of questions:</p>

<p>1)I've read a lot about how many people with law degrees have been unable to find jobs in recent years, even before the mess of the last couple of years. Does anyone know if job prospects in Estate Planning are as bad as law in general? Worse? I'm sure the economy isn't helping right now, but in general, are Estate Planning positions hard to come by? Is the competition as high as in other areas of law?</p>

<p>2)I'm wondering if the prestige of schools matters much for me. I hope to have my own practice eventually, and be a CFP, with an emphasis on Estate Planning. But I'll probably want to work for someone else for a few years to get some experience, before going off on my own. I know the competition is fierce for corporate law positions with big firms, and that the law school you attend matters a lot. Does anyone know if the situation is different in Estate Planning? I guess I have the same question about grades. Do you need top grades in Law School to get a job doing Estate Planning, assuming I'm willing to work for just about any firm that knows what they're doing, and is willing to teach me the ropes? I don't have the undergrad grades to even worry about the top schools. I'm probably looking at tiers 3 and 4.</p>

<p>3)This one might be for a forum with people actually working as Estate Planners, but I'm wondering if it's possible to be get a decent paying job(let's say 80K or up) as an Estate Planning attorney, if I'm mostly interested in designing Estate Plans, and don't want to get involved in litigation.</p>

<p>4)This again, might be a question for people already working at a law firm. How does compensation work for newly hired attorneys? One of the problems I'm having trying to figure out how to make the transition from my current job to a financial planning position is that most entry level positions pay only 40 - 50K in salary, and the rest is all commission based. I can't afford to support my family on a salary like that. I'm sure law firms want their junior associates to bring in business, but I haven't heard of any kind of commission type structure. Do they just do bonuses at the end of the year if you bring in business, or is it just expected, and you get a pat on the back? Is it unrealistic to think I could get a job paying 80K or up out of law school, and have it guaranteed, with no pressure to sell?</p>

<p>OK, thanks. Any help on any of these would be greatly appreciated.
ptoomey</p>

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<p>Most of your questions I can’t answer. What I can tell you is that most attorney’s who draft wills use them as loss leaders. They try to get themselves listed as executors and make up the money on the estate settlement side of practicing law. There are some attorneys who make decent money on the estate planning side by representing wealthy clients. If you do really well in law school, you should be able to join one of these law firms. You should be able to get a well paying job as an estate attorney if you graduate at the top of your class from a decent law school. (That is easier said than done, by the way).</p>

<p>If you wish to go into estate planning, you should expect to become an expert in estate and gift taxation. Some folks don’t like that stuff. </p>

<p>Wills and estate law is one of the most frequent areas for malpractice. I don’t know why but that’s what the malpractice insurance companies will tell you.</p>

<p>If you eventually open your own law practice, you are the same as a small business person. If you are good at marketing yourself, you will do well. If you are not good at marketing yourself, you will starve. When you run your own law firm, it is the same as being on 100 percent commission (but I suspect you already knew that).</p>

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<p>razorsharp,</p>

<p>Thanks very much for the information. Fortunately, I do like the estate and gift tax side of things. That’s what got me interested in the field. I’m sure it’s dry as can be to most people. I guess that’s a good thing, because there probably aren’t too many people dying to get into the field, like I am(no pun intended). My interest in it is very narrow though, which worries me a little bit. I like doing the design of the estate plans. I’m not sure how much I’ll like drafting all the docs and litigating cases. I’m hoping I can partner with someone who is interested in doing the litigation end.</p>

<p>You make a good point about having to market yourself as an owner of a practice. I’m prepared for that, but I’m just hoping to get a start working for someone else. I don’t think I’ll mind marketing myself once I have some experience and feel like I know what I’m doing.</p>

<p>Do you have any advice on how I might learn more about the job outlook for estate planning jobs. I looked on monster.com yesterday, and there were only around 3 pages of jobs in the whole country, and most of those were paralegal jobs.</p>

<p>I’m planning to ask everyone I know who is in the field for contacts, so I can learn about all the different types of jobs/companies in the field. Do you know of any other forums or groups that I might look at for more information?</p>

<p>Thanks for the info.</p>

<p>ptoomey</p>

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<p>Most major banks have trust departments that manage money. They often have to interpret wills granting them authority over trusts. They often work with a number of estate planning lawyers who are setting up trust for their clients. I would suggest you call one of these big banks and ask to meet with someone who can give you advice on the industry. If you find the right people to speak with, I bet you will find it invaluable.</p>

<p>Another source might be major accounting firms. A lot of them have personal financial planning for their wealthy clients. Part of personal financial planning is estate planning. They are used to having people call with career questions. I would encourage you to give them a call. </p>

<p>Also, don’t forget that your State’s bar association probably has an estate and trust section. Most lawyers don’t have a lot of free time, but you might be able to get some referrals from the State bar estate and trust section.</p>

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<p>Hi All,
This is Taylor
I am new to this forum.
I am here to share and gain the Knowledge.</p>

<p>Thanks.</p>

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<p>A few thoughts:</p>

<p>You can make a very comfortable, relatively stress-free living by doing estate planning (and probate) for wealthy clients. You will have to take tax law, and quite a bit of it: modern estate planning involves sheltering income in a variety of ways. However, there’s no untapped amazing areas of law that pay oodles of money and come with a stress-free life. There just aren’t that many wealthy people out there looking for estate planning and totally unable to find a lawyer who does it. </p>

<p>It’s always amazing to me when non-lawyers say things like, “Can’t you just get some of those rich people to hire you do to X?”, as if the world has an unlimited quantity of rich people just waiting for a lawyer to come to them so that they can fling money in the air and dance through the streets. You’ll make money in estate planning by getting relatively wealthy clients to come to you for estate planning, financial planning, tax preparation, and other related matters, but there is certainly competition for them.</p>

<p>

What do you mean by “sell”? Lawyers spend a lot of time selling their services to people, in a way.</p>

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<p>@ariesathena: Thread is from 2009 :p</p>

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<p>Oh, sorry - It was bumped up and I didn’t check the date.</p>