Does your son think that you won’t be proud of him if he ends up at Rutgers or Maryland (I don’t know where you live) instead of his “dream college”? Does your son think that you won’t be screaming your lungs out at graduation if he walks the stage with all the other HS graduates instead of as Val?
If he thinks that- why?
Actors like Meryl Streep and John Gielgud and Judi Dench and Maggie Smith don’t work hard because they want the validation of a red carpet and an award. They do it for the joy that the work brings them. Do you think Seiji Ozawa worries about the audience or the critics? Is Yo-Yo Ma counting noses to see how many tickets he’s selling?
The last and final gift you can give your kid before he leaves home and spreads his wings is to love the work, not the reward or the validation. Otherwise, the first C he gets in college is going to devastate him… and you won’t be there with ice cream and a walk around the block to help put it in perspective.
But he’s not guaranteed his prize no matter what. This is the bigger piece here. And then he will be uber-disappointed because he’s deluded himself into believing that the top 10 or top 20 are some magical realms of existence and that the experience at the next 20 or so cannot possibly compare. But that’s nonsense.
“Forbidding” him to take such a hard schedule doesn’t solve the problem. All it means is that if/when he doesn’t get into a top 20, he blames you for “restricting” and your relationship is over.
You’re defining the problem the wrong way IMO. The problem is not whether his schedule is too tough or not. The problem is the focus on others and external validation.
It can be a factor but as I mentioned, he knows that though a top college acceptance would make us happy, we are against focusing on Val/Sal, it’s not important in long term but it is to him.
I would just talk to him about WHY his goal. Wanting to get an excellent education is a great goal. Wanting to work hard is a great thing. Just make sure he doesn’t have misperceptions about top 20 schools. A lot of naive high schoolers really do think that only those schools open doors, or that “prestige” is the key to life success.
Suppose he says “you’re right, Dad. It won’t be the end of the world if I do t get in one. For this year, I’m just going to try my best and do what I can and keep it all in perspective.” Would you feel better about his difficult schedule then? Of course. So that’s why the q isn’t really about how difficult his schedule is.
I feel that envy of another top student is an issue too. That kid’s parents are really good at GPA gaming being high school cousselors so his GPA was a tiny .002 higher because he picked courses for advantage not for interest. My son scored better in every course but it wasn’t as GPA friendly load so he wants to make sure that he is not repeating same mistake.
Ask him if he’s giving up an EC he loves in order to make room for AP Spanish. If he is- he can drop down to regular
Spanish and continue to love swimming or golf or debate or whatever else he loves to do.
Ask him if he has done research on Reed or Lawrence or Bates or Rhodes or Earlham or U Alabama (you can fill in the blanks with colleges which might not be on his radar but where he won’t need to be Val to attend) and then together, you guys can go through the course catalogue and the view book and make a list of all the great things happening on that campus.
Ask him if he wants to consider applying to schools where being Asian is a hook and not a problem- and then together make a list of those schools. Once he’s out of the top 20, or out of California/Massachusetts/NY/PA, that list starts to come into focus.
Ask him if he really loves having supper with the family- and if he’s ready to give that up quite yet.
Ask him to call his grandparents (if they are alive) if he hasn’t in a while. Suggest that he help a neighbors kid learn to ride a two wheeler. Get him engaged in life which has nothing to do with academics.
Then you can remind him that he is a person in addition to being a HS kid trying to get into college.
“feel that envy of another top student is an issue too. That kid’s parents are really good at GPA gaming being high school cousselors so his GPA was a tiny .002 higher because he picked courses for advantage not for interest.”
Your job here is to model lack of interest. Not lack of interest in your son, but lack of interest in what other top students and/or their parents do. This kind of nonsense shouldn’t even pierce your consciousness. When these kinds of topics come up, your job is to shrug and communicate “whatever, their problem.” Not “omg, son, I hate them too, what jerks.” It is possible both to be supportive of your son and unsupportive of the idea that other people’s grades/scores/etc are your concern.
"Ask him if he has done research on Reed or Lawrence or Bates or Rhodes or Earlham or U Alabama "
Right. Because it’s not really “the heart wants what the heart wants.” It’s “like many high school students, certain colleges are over-idealized and so therefore they think they love them.”
“It can be a factor but as I mentioned, he knows that though a top college acceptance would make us happy, we are against focusing on Val/Sal, it’s not important in long term but it is to him.”
Wait. Would you be actively unhappy if he didn’t get into a top 20? Is this for him, or for you?
There are top colleges that are not top 20, you know. The 20-line is pretty arbitrary.
Has he had physics yet? It is likely best to complete the set of biology, chemistry, and physics before trying to get to a more advanced level in any of them.
If it is not what he really likes, why art history over other electives (if he already has sufficient art and history courses for graduation and college admission purposes)?
In terms of the ranking game that he is apparently competing in, do you live in Texas?
@ucbalumnus He did honors Bio & honors Chem but haven’t done Physcis yet. Physics department at their school doesn’t have good teachers and grading is bad as well so most students avoid it. He may take honors Physics senior year.
He is not concerned about ranking for automated admission. He scores way higher to worry about top 10% or top 7%. He can make top 1% without making any effort.
I said same thing about Art History but he thinks that it wouldn’t be too difficult for him since he has background in Arts, European History and World History and Art History sort of makes sense.
One of the most compleling comments we heard at college orientation…and we heard it at both kids’ colleges.
"Don’t be surprised if your ALL A HS student doesn’t get all A’s in college. Your student will be amongst many others from all over the world who got all A’s in HS.
We urged out kids to do their best. We did not urge our kids to compete with other in their HS class…for anything. That was a pointless thing to do for OUR kids. They needed to do their personal best…not beat someone else’s.
One of our kids went to the university ranked 50 by USNews. The other went to the number 2 masters university in the region of the college.
He is interested in Middleburry and Claremont McKenna colleges and NYU. He understand that Ivy isn’t the ultimate answer to success or happiness but he thinks that road to success is slightly better paved through Ivy lane. I can’t deny it, he made me look at their alumni lists, odds are better there.
He is not interested in Bio though he scored well in honors course. As much as I would like him to go to Med school or do health sciences, he is just not interested in that path.
If it was upto me, I would want him to do BS/MD track from our state school. That seems like a more guaranteed path to reasonably comfortable future and with his grades and knack for standardized testing, probably wouldn’t cost me 1/6th of any Ivy undergrad degree.
You don’t have to make any college’s “notable alumni” list to have a happy, comfortable lifestyle. The odds may be better in doing so * in ways that are notable / public to others*, but that’s a different thing altogether.
BS/MD programs are contingent in earning a high college GPA and MCAT score, usually high enough to gain medical school admission the usual way. But, if the student meets those numbers, s/he can avoid the time consuming, expensive, and stressful process of applying to medical schools and going to interviews