Just back from Broadway: MT folks, make sure you can dance!!!!!

College Majors Musical Theater Major
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<p>Just returned from a trip to NYC where my Ds and I saw 6 Broadway musicals in 4 days. What amazed me is the fantastic voices of the performers and the strong dance ability of those same performers.</p>

<p>I was a "theatre kid" in HS; in college, most of my friends were theatre majors. My kids are in the musicals at their HSs, so I know our current crop of theatre kids. What struck me after seeing so many shows this weekend was that the HS kids we consider to be fantastic have nowhere near enough dance skills to "make it." They have fairly strong voices, but "fake" the dance steps.</p>

<p>Of course, anyone can list a hundred of Broadway stars who aren't strong dancers...but the general level of song and dance skill is amazing...there will be some performer from the ensemble with a 4 measure solo, and that person will have an incredible voice.</p>

<p>I'm not saying anyone on this board is not talented enough to "make it." But I do think that the majority of the kids I've known who've gone on to become MT majors do not have the voice or dance skills to merit serious professional consideration. </p>

<p>For all of you very strong singers who haven't taken dance, pick up some dance classes when you can.</p>

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<p>In my experience as a vocal coach, I find that dance is the area most students don’t take seriously enough. It is extremely competitive out there, and dance skills are a must. Most MT programs have a dance audition, and they can tell when someone is faking it. What is “good enough” for a high school performer will not be adequate in the much more competitive college auditions.</p>

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<p>Probably due to vocal maturity issues, the kids with strong “Broadway” type voices are a lot more rare in HS than are the dancers. There might be 15 girls at the school with 10 years of dance company experience who could hold their own at a big time dance audition, but maybe only one or two girls who could do justice to Maria or Reno Sweeney. But those kids with the voices really do need to get themselves to dance class.</p>

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<p>I am also surprised at the many applicants for MT programs who have NO dance training. I find there are many who think getting into a MT program is just being a good singer. But honestly, one needs to be good at singing, acting, and dancing to be admitted, let alone be a success in this field. Often a college is willing to take someone who is strong in two skill areas and shows potential but is weaker in a third area. But having NO skill in the third area is a disadvantage when there are plenty of kids who have skill in all three skill areas. And besides getting into a MT college program, if one is truly serious about going into the field of MT, one should be training in dance too, and not just voice/acting.</p>

<p>Some of the kids who have had the most successful BFA audition outcomes are the ones who are triple threats. You can get in without being a triple threat but your odds are enhanced if you are one.</p>

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<p>As an aside, at professional auditions, singers are often required to dance as the call progresses, and vice versa for dancers. Those that can do both are often cast before singer/movers when the show or season is dance heavy, which it often is. I would recommend that all MT candidates get as much training as possible in all three areas: acting, singing, dancing. Certainly training will take one way further than a resume of shows.</p>

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<p>Speaking of dance, I hope everyone gets to see the documentary, Every Little Step. For those of us of a certain age (!) for whom A Chorus Line was and still is a seminal and beloved Broadway musical, it is a wonderful trip down memory lane to learn about the genesis of the original show and to get a glimpse of the audition process for the revival. The dance skills displayed are truly awesome and even though this show is more dance-oriented than most musicals, it could still be instructive for those interested in MT–talk about triple threat!! What I also loved was how supportive the casting directors were to all those auditioning–it showed there is a lot of care and appreciation for the actors. It’s a wonderful movie.</p>

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<p>At some schools, it was absolutely beneficial that my son is a dancer as well as a singer and actor. We know, categorically, it made him a shoe-in for acceptance in several programs because he is skilled in this area. Yes, others were accepted who were not as strong in one area or another, but it absolutely doesn’t hurt to hone ALL of your talents and be as well-rounded as possible.</p>

<p>Boys, in particular, can distinguish themselves by concentrating a bit more heavily on dance. Not to the neglect of the other disciplines, of course, but enough to stand out in a positive way at an audition. </p>

<p>You’d also have to figure it couldn’t hurt with ensemble roles during summers and after school…</p>

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<p>Missypie, What shows did you see? How did you like them? Recommendations for our next trip?</p>

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<p>Since you asked…</p>

<p>My daughters are 16 and 13, so there were a few shows that intrigued me (like Next to Normal) that I didn’t consider because I thought the girls would like other shows better. If you get to Broadway every now and then, you’ve probably seen many of these.</p>

<p>Wicked - terrific; great voices, special effects, score, etc.</p>

<p>Billy Elliot - loved it!!! Great ballet AND tap. Not only was Billy great, but the rest of the cast was, too. With that said, I can see why it won Best Musical but not Best Score - the score was good but afterwards we couldn’t remember any of the tunes.</p>

<p>South Pacific - really good. I liked that my girls appreciated it - D 16 said, “It’s classic.” A nice contrast to the other more modern shows. The actress currently playing Nellie is the one who won the reality show to play Sandy in Grease. She was fine but not great.</p>

<p>Lion King - so Disney; quite the event.</p>

<p>In the Heights - I loved it and the girls adored it. Even though it won the Tony for Best Musical last year, lots of folks around here haven’t heard of it. Lots of rap music and hip hop dancing, but also traditional songs and awesome Latin dancing. I’m not a big rap or hip hop fan, but I really enjoyed it. (Although I took issue with some of the details of the girl losing her scholarship to Stanford story line…but since when are musicals totally realistic?)</p>

<p>Phantom of the Opera - chose the show because it’s the only show not dark on a Monday night. We loved it. The 13 year old said it was possibly her favorite.</p>

<p>Each show was so totally different that it’s almost impossible to compare and choose the best. It was also nice to ponder all the working actors - kids in many (Billy Elliot, Lion King, South Pacific); older ladies had great parts in Wicked, Billy Elliot and In the Heights; operatic sincers in Phantom; ballet dancers in Phantom and Billy Elliot; Asians in South Pacific and African Americans in Lion King and Hispanics in In the Heights. Hollywood seems so focussed on very attractive, young, caucasian actors and actresses. It’s great to see the rest of the world represented on Broadway.</p>

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<p>Thanks so much. Sounds like a wonderful trip with great shows. I saw In the Heights last summer and it is one of my all time favorites! I’m taking my mother to NYC at then end of the month and we’re seeing Billy Elliot and 9-5.</p>

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<p>One of these days (perhaps when the nest is empty?!) I’m going to actually see a PLAY on Broadway. There are so many I would like to have seen, but the kids always want to see muscials, and until I’ve seen all of them, it’s hard to say no.</p>

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<p>Missypie - Thank you for your posting. I have long held that the triple threat performer is the ticket to success. I agree with several other posters who indicate that voice is sometime very emphasized while dance is somewhat diminished in importance. Of course there are the ten-years-of dance kids who need to work on singing and/or acting. My point is get training in all areas prior to college. Equally as important - look for college programs that serve acting, singing, and dancing equally well. The market has changed - ever since “A Chorus Line” producers have become increasingly aware that they do not need (and cannot afford) to hire separate singing choruses from dancing choruses. They want the triple threat performer who can, at least to some degree, do-it-all. Some very respected colleges that have great vocal programs have not yet accommodated to that market reality. Something to keep in mind as you select college programs to audition for.</p>

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<p>And that’s an aspect in which professional theatre is the polar opposite of high school theatre. Most HS directors want to involve as many students as possible…you cast your solid actors, and your choir kids and your drill team girls and if you can find a part, cast a football player, too, so the football team will all come to see the show.</p>

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<p>Missypie, I am an absolute Billy Elliot Freak! From the moment I saw the movie I was hooked. I have seen the play twice. I was just wondering who the cast members were when you saw it? …if you can recall!</p>

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<p>I’m going through these archives. :-)</p>

<p>I feel very smug reading this thread. Because, my daughter’s theater teacher and fellow aspiring thespians at her school have, amazingly, been shall we say less than supportive of the fact that she has a time commitment outside of her high school theater stuff, to her dance classes. (actually, I could go off on a big rant about that and I am downplaying the drama that has ensued…but I will refrain for now) To sum up, it astonishes her and me that she was actually told, “why are you wasting time on dance when that’s not what you are going into?”</p>

<p>Hello??? <em>blink blink</em> Anyone ever hear the term “triple threat”? She’s the only girl in her class in the theater department with a dance background and the drama teacher has zero dance experience and we think they are missing a huge piece of the picture just because they haven’t done it themselves. My daughter just rolled her eyes and continued with her dancing because she has seen “A Chorus Line” (lol) and KNOWS that being able to really actually DANCE is going to be a big factor out in the real world as opposed to a dinky little theater program in some remote little Texas high school where the director doesn’t value dance because she hasn’t had day one of dance training.</p>

<p>She did, sadly, have to give up her very nice part time job as an assistant dance teacher at her studio because the drama teacher just could NOT deal with those extra 3 hours a week in d’s schedule when it came to scheduling rehearsals. (that’s another can of snakes…for another time) ~though it didn’t seem to make much difference after all as far as that went, she might as well have continued teaching. Except this year was rough academically so it did free up study time which she needed. Still the point is, they actually told her it was a waste of time to study dance.</p>

<p>This is what I mean by we are on our own as far as good advice out here.</p>

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<p>The days of separate singing and dancing choruses are over. It’s just too expensive to hire that many performers. My D just attended an audition for the new national tour of Oklahoma. The total cast is only 19; 8 of those are lead roles. The ensemble will consist of only 11 performers who must sing, dance, and understudy the leads. This is not at all unusual these days – tell your local director to get with the program!</p>

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<p>SDF- When my daughter was in high school we ran into the same thing. The drama teacher the 1st two years was great- she was a dancer and really emphasized being a triple threat. Her replacement was the total opposite. Did not encourage dance and said it wasn’t that important. Yikes- how can a teacher tell kids who are interested in MT that???</p>

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<p>The high school theatre teachers can say what they want - they already have jobs and those jobs aren’t on Broadway. When you really want to be on the stage professionally, you need someone to HIRE you. </p>

<p>A girl I know who is a current college MT major recently lost 30 lbs on her own. It wasn’t that she was obese…but she was always typecast into the “mom” roles. She very wisely realized that it was important to “look” as many parts as possible.</p>

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<p>Glad to hear good dancers are appreciated. I hope the colleges value that as well in the admissions process. That will be a plus for my daughter but we’re still working on the singing.</p>

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<p>Well, Motherofthemall, that’s us. If I were to indulge in conjecture I would say that what they want is obviously a strong triple threat who has that sparkely quality onstage, that connection with the audience. </p>

<p>Then if they have to choose between someone who is weaker in singing or weaker in dance I bet most of the time they would go with the singer, and the reason I think that because it seems easier to me to hide a weak dancer than a weak singer. Though you can never tell because if they have hit the jackpot with wonderful voices who are a bit shaky on the dance so far, they might decide they need to fill out the dancing slots.</p>

<p>I would guess (this is a totally uneducated guess and I would love to hear from anyone having real knowledge) that being a strong dancer is surely an advantage but won’t make up for being a clearly weak singer.</p>

<p>Happily I do believe that, assuming the student has a good “ear”, voices and singing ability can be greatly strengthened with the right coach and a lot of practice, and a surprising amount of improvement can be made in a relatively short amount of time - my daughter vastly improved in one year’s time.</p>

<p>Dance on the other hand take a long time to really learn. Our studio’s director says that it’s hard with dance because it doesn’t look like <em>anything</em> for a long long time. You get that group of 5 year olds out there and though they have actually learned a lot it doesn’t look like they are doing anything except standing there in their fluffy outfits and watching each other, after a year of work, whereas if you have a five year old who has had a year of piano it at least sounds like <em>something</em> recognizable as a song.</p>

<p>It really takes until about fifth year before reactions to their number in the recital is based on being impressed rather than tickled with how “cute” they are.</p>

<p>I think someone starting dance as an older student would obviously pick up a lot faster than pre schoolers who have wee little attention spans, but, it takes years of practice to build up that muscle memory to where they can do those sequences as fast as they are called out.</p>

<p>I know that someone who has sung for years is going to have an instrument that is in better shape than someone who has just started, but tell me if my information is correct. Is it not true that it is actually damaging for them to start voice training TOO young? It seems I have been told that.</p>

<p>Whereas they can start dancing as soon as they can walk and follow directions. Though of course pointe should never be attempted before having had a certain number of years of building up to it (our school has a minimum of 7) or permanent foot damage can happen.</p>

<p>Was I correctly informed about starting voice too early or not?</p>