I might get this lab assistant job (pays very well, so over 50 people applied for 1 spot but only 15 got interviews, and I was one of three who made it to the “final round,” which is calling references and eventually making a decision). Anyway, if I get it, he said it might be a couple YEARS before I can potentially be a co-author on a research paper, but only if I do very well as just the lab assistant. Obviously it’s not research, but is it bad to not have long, significant research experience but still work in a lab for a couple years? I’m afraid I might never find an actual research position until junior year since the majority of the offers specify having junior standing or a class that I really can’t take until sophomore year second semester. By then, I might start working on a project anyway.
If I get it, would it be good to take it? Would it be a positive point on a med school app? By “positive on an app” I don’t mean adcoms will see it as equal to research in anyway, but is it seen as a positive thing to have a job while in undergrad?
I’m sorry if this isn’t making perfect sense; it’s almost 3AM.
Contrary to what most people think, science does not march ever ahead lockstep in straight lines. Research is filled with dead ends, blind alleys and irreproducible results. (In fact there is a tongue-in-cheek science journal called “The Journal of Irreproducible Results”) Not all research results in a publication. In fact a heck of lot of research never gets published because the results are not significant.
Also how long it takes research to result in a publication is extremely field dependent. You can get meaningful results in some bio wet labs in a few months; in other fields, significant results take years, even decades, to achieve.
Be a lab assistant if you’re interested in doing hands on work in the research lab and are passionate about getting an up-close look at the process of scientific research. Be a lab assistant if you think you may want to pursue a PhD in science instead of MD.
Publication, if it happens, is a nice result, but not at all necessary for either med school or grad school.
You don’t need to have lab research-to be considered a strong candidate for medical school. In fact, having lab research experience is vastly over-rated by pre-meds. Adcomms rank it as being only of moderate-to-low importance. Approx 15-20% of incoming med students report having little or no research experience.
@WayOutWestMom Thanks! My only question is the part where you say “be a lab assistant if you think you may want to pursue a PhD instead MD;” will adcomms potentially view it negatively then? Like they would view a nursing major “negatively”? “Negatively” here is defined as a red flag or maybe make them question whether I want a PhD or an MD and thus result in a rejection on the grounds of not being committed?
Part of the reason I like medicine is because it’s a (usually) direct and (usually) life-saving or enhancing application of science: I like the inner workings of the body and the interaction of molecules (drugs) with other molecules (those inside and outside cells). I like how the body has a sense of normal and deviates every one and again, only to be fixed with science administered by a medical team.
So yes, I do think I like medicine because I like science, and I think contributing to the scientific field, even if just to make sure the buffers are there and the equipment is clean, would feel fulfilling. However, medicine, and specifically being a doctor, is my dream. And I don’t think it’s a my-parents-want-me-to-do-this-so-I-guess-it’s-my-dream type of situation. My parents are very supportive and let me choose. I have volunteered in a clinic and have shadowed a doctor long enough to know that the field has its boring and flat out scary sides, but the pay off and the patient interaction is incredible. Then again, I’m a freshman in college, so who knows where life will take me within the next two/three years.
Bottom line, I want medicine BECAUSE of my love for science, and thus I want research, too. However, I’m cautious in wasting my time, so, though it seems bad, I do most things only if adcomms would view it positively or neutrally. Preferably, of course, positively.
There is no recipe for getting into med school. Every successful applicant has traveled his/her own unique journey to get there.
There is a derisive term used to describe a certain type of pre-med/med school hopeful–and that is “box checker”. A box checker is an applicant who engages in a checklist of activities recommended for pre-med without any particular interest, engagement or passion for the activity. They only do what “looks good to the adcomm.”
Box checkers are at best lackluster applicants and end up rejected more often than not. Why? because adcomms see lots and lots of box checkers every year and have developed BS detectors for identifying inauthentic individuals (aka phonies).
I appreciate that you think you want to be doctor, but trying to follow some imaginary recipe to get that med school acceptance or spending your time ticking off items on your checklist isn’t going to advance you to your goal.
You need to find something that engages you intellectually and emotionally. It needn’t be science or medicine related. Building your ECs around your personal interests is the best way to find your path to med school.
So if basic wet lab research engages your passions–take the job and give it 150%. If the idea of lab research doesn’t thrill you–find something that does. Whether that is getting involved in student government, participating in a sport or taking photos for the university newspaper.
@iwannabe_Brown I didn’t know that. Some freshman are already involved in research here (Michigan), which made me feel bad. Then again their description of their job sounds like a glorified lab assistant. “I use various techniques to run gels and make buffers in order to (insert complex research here).” Basically what I’d be doing.
You are 100% right. Unless a freshman had experience in high school doing the stuff you’re currently being asked to do - that’s where everyone starts. My guess is you’ll be making buffers and running gels. That’s why the other positions specify specific classes or higher standing because by then you’ll have had some lab exposure through your coursework.
What exactly has this professor said your duties would be? You haven’t actually told us yet.
@iwannabe_Brown Essentially helping set up the lab (he’s very new – just got here from graduate school basically), making buffers, cleaning equipment, running gels, making sure the lab is stocked. Very basic work, but I get to at least watch researchers do their projects and he said I can sit in on some of the meetings if they interest me.
Getting in the ground floor can either be a great experience or a complete disaster.
D2 went to work for a brand new faculty member at her undergrad and got a ton a responsibility pretty quickly.–in part because initially there were no grad students in the lab to do the critical jobs. By time she was a senior she was the assistant lab manager for the research group and, among other things, trained all the new grad students on protocols & procedures, how to use the equipment & data analysis software, etc. She was offered a full time position as lab manager when she graduated --which she declined–and 2 years later when she interviewed at her UG med school, her PI volunteered to fund her for a PhD. (At the time, D2 was mulling taking the MD/PhD route.)
Overall, it was tremendous opportunity for her.
(BTW, D2 ended up as research program manager at your university between college graduation and starting med school. Her PI headed a named research institute at UM SOM and she worked directly under him. A year after she left, the PI also left, taking all his funding and a few of his grad students, and headed to greener–and apparently better paying–pastures. The PI had been at UM for over 17 years and his wife was also faculty at the med school.)
OTOH, her ex-BF who is a grad student at your university, chose a new research lab under a new hire to do his thesis research in. After 2 years, his lab had its funding drastically cut and the ex- and all the other grad students & lab assistants were laid off. (The ex-BF had to start over from scratch at new lab, including completely changing the topic of his dissertation. He’s still at UM working on finishing his PhD. )
tl;dr-- be aware that new labs are always risky since there are no guarantees the PI will survive
^well said. I will say that in the case of an undergrad vs. a PhD student, I think the risks for an undergrad are much less. The expected tenure is shorter, the expectation for productivity is lower, and the chance to be more involved than you otherwise would be is good.
If you’re at UM-Ann Arbor, this new PI probably has a startup package so even if he fails to get any grants and is coming out his post-doc (highly doubt he’s coming straight from grad school) without any grants intended to help post-docs transition to PI, he’s probably got at least 2-3 years worth of funding from the university secured.
OP: Sit in on every meeting that doesn’t conflict with classes. Ask the grad students/post docs (and techs too, but less them and more the others) questions about what they’re doing (ask first if it’s ok to ask a question - depending on the experiment it might be really distracting and annoying). You are where everyone starts and what gets you your own slice of a project is showing that you’re interested, that you’re learning, and that you respect the lab space (e.g. don’t contaminate/break things).