Life at Furman

Colleges and Universities A-Z Furman University
1

<p>My D is interested in Furman, but her dad is not keen on southern schools(except for Duke and theother usual suspects). </p>

<p>He has never heard of Furman and</p>

<ul>
<li><p>fears Furman is not academic rigorous and lacks national rep,</p></li>
<li><p>worries ths SC is too conservative (too religious, racially inhospitable,etc.),</p></li>
<li><p>assumes "Greeks" control social life (frats tend to be overwhelmingly White or black, and in his mind frat = drinking)</p></li>
</ul>

<p>We'll probably visit in the fall, but in the meantime, I'd love some first-hand info re: academics, social life and athletics (track).</p>

<p>Thanks.</p>

2

<p>The majority of students (over 65%) are NOT associated with Greek life. There aren't even any Frat or Sorority buildings. Some of the sororities have "halls" designated within the dorms, but these are not exclusive to Greek members. You can live on these halls even if you are not a member of the sorority, and many sorority sisters have roommates who are not Greek-affiliated.</p>

<p>Lower classmen live in dormitories. Upper classmen live in university-run apartments. Drinking is prohibited in the dorms (and these rules really do hold). So, drinking on campus is NOT a big problem. As for racial diversity, it is similar to many other private colleges that do not have "national" appeal. As an aside, while Furman students are majorly from the south, it attracts students from all over the US. My D's best friends and roommate are from Illinois, Texas, and Ohio.</p>

<p>One thing I will have to dissuade you of is the idea that Furman is not academically rigorous. I hate to quote stats, but that is often the only thing that gives us common ground. My d had 10 Ap classes, 1550 SAT, valedictorian, blah, blah, blah, and she finds the coursework stimulating, interesting, and creative. NONE of her classes have been taught by grad students or TAs, and all but one have been under 20 students in size (including intro classes, with one class at 35). Furman uses partial grades (that is, B, B+, A-, etc...), and there is no grade inflation (generally, less than 20%...sometimes less than 10%...receive As). It is the creativity and opportunity for personal research that makes Furman so creative for many students. Furman ranks second in undergraduate research opportunities (check out PR, for example, to see these rankings). She has sat and talked to many of her professors, shared ideas, received guidance, even mentorship...and all that in her first semester.</p>

<p>Athletics....Furman came very close to winning their football division this year. Their women's tennis team IS nationally ranked, and their rugby team was took the national championship a few years ago. Don't know about track, however. </p>

<p>We, too, had never heard of Furman and tripped across it while awaiting an overnight at a school in Atlanta in November of my D's senior year. She picked Furman over more "prestigious" schools, such as Davidson, Emory, and one of the Ivies.</p>

<p>As an aside, 4 Furman students just earned national recognition: 2 received Goldwater scholarships, 1 received a Udall, and 1 received a Truman (Furman Poly Sci students have earned a Truman just about every year). Harvard did a study aimed at "where do the smart students really go," and Furman came in at #30 of all universities and colleges, and just behind Williams, Amherst, Swarthmore, and 5 other top colleges (Furman was 9th). It may not be as known nationally, but then many people within the south have never heard of Middlebury or Bowdoin, both wonderful schools.</p>

<p>Furman is definitely NOT for everyone, and that's really just fine. But do not go away thinking it is a prep school or boarding school; it is definitely a fine school. I wrote a post (either on one of the other Furman threads or under the College search forum, a thread around page 2 or 3 under a title such as "dream school versus scholarship" that lists where students from Furman are heading to grad school (and 70% of grads go to professional or graduate school). In my D's area of interest it's mostly Stanford, Harvard, Princeton, and Duke...the same places students from FROM Stanford, Harvard, Princeton, or Duke go to graduate school. These grad acceptances are a reflection of the caliber of the students, the research opportunities, and strength of many of the departments at Furman. </p>

<p>I am sure students at Cornell, U of Chicago, and many other schools are working incredibly hard. But, I'm not sure that they are really growing more as people and having as much time to be creative or conduct personal research as students at Furman. It is not a pressure cooker at Furman; it is a steady, uncompromising pace to learn and grow. That's what my D has reported and why she is glad she choose Furman over her more "prestigious" options. But this choice is DEFINITELY one individuals must make for themselves. I think the chancellor of one of the ultra-elite schools said it well when he told us that "rankings and ratings mean nothing; the number one school for you is the one that you find meets your needs best."</p>

3

<p>I am a currently a freshman at Furman. Although most of what was said holds true, I feel like I might be able to give you a little perspective from the student side as well. First of all I would consider Furman to be very rigorous. I recieved the IB diploma in high school, and I still don't consider myself prepared for FU. It is a school that is very interesting but very challenging, and it's difficult to make A's. Class sizes are small, I've had classes from 16 to 24 people and they are all taught by professors. Socially I would say FU is much more homogenous. It would be a lie to say that there isn't a Furman stereotype of white upper middle class. However, this is getting challenged more and more every year and I think it has gotten a lot better. I don't see races or economic status as a real social divide though. Furman is also ranked as one of the top five research schools in the country, they work really hard to make everything related to practical life and life outside the classroom. The school is technically a dry campus, that is to say that drinking does occur, but most of what does occur is in the apartments or off campus. Drinking in the dorms really doesn't happen because of the policies, but like anywhere if you want to find it you will find it. Altough statistically furman has a not as active greek population, I beg to differ. I think the greeks are very present on campus, but differently from other schools. Parties are centered around frats and it would be a lie to say that there isn't drinking, but for guys I don't think it really creates as much of a social divide. It's not a big deal if you are or aren't in one, and if you do or you don't drink. There are less guys in frats than girls in sororities, or so it appears. For girls I think sororities are very different from state schools, it isn't as much hoopla and hustle and bustle. I was very anti greek when I got to Furman, but I changed my mind and decided to rush, eventhough I didn't join a sorority. I would say sororities are more important to girls than frats are to guys but its hard to understand without actually being a student here. As for athletics we have a national championship rugby team, and a very good football team. I hope that helps let me know if theres anything else i can address.</p>

4

<p>I find the whole frat/soror thing troubling, not just b/c of the drinking (and drinking at off-campus just means more dwi), but b/c they remain the most (only?) segregated orgs on campus - - just check out the photos on the Furman site. It's hard to believe that any campus where frats/sorors firgure prominently in the social scene doesn't have any race/class divide.</p>

5

<p>Greek life is not the center of social life at Furman. The FUSAB is probably just as visible. Athletics and music are also big there, too.</p>

<p>As and for drinking, I mentioned in a PM about a school in the midwest a friend visited. The real reason the young lady rejected that school was because her hostess for her overnight left on a Friday to go to a party and didn't return until Sunday AM still hungover. My D said she saw more drunk kids at one of the big Ivies than she did at a school "known" for drinking. if you reread what the previous poster said, you'll see it is not a condemnation of greeks, nor a suggestion that Furman has a particularly "active" drinking population. Having been on faculty at a private university, I would suggest that drinking is far less of a problem at Furman that at most other schools...and by far. Wherever you have young people away from parents, you have drinking. The question becomes, does the general school population encourage it or is the school environment/climate conducive to drinking? Furman is not a very conducive environment, but nowhere (even the service academies) can administration control student behavior off campus (and there are no Greek buildings on Furman to for the university to govern).</p>

<p>Note the remark about academic rigor. This is an often overlooked element at Furman. Classes are NOT easy.</p>

6

<p>NYC let me clarify what I said about the greeks. First of all I think you need to look at the demographic of Furman, they are making great strides in trying to diversify the campus, but it can't be denied that most of the people going to Furman are white and from a middle to upperclass background. Some people consider a lot of aspects of Furman to be "country clubby", from some of the freshman traditions during Oweek, to the general population and Furman stereotype. </p>

<p>Having said that, when you look at a sorority or a frat picture on a website most of the kids are going to portray that same ideal... because it is a predominantly white campus. I actually disagree that the greeks divide by class and race because if you are a minority and want to be greek affiliated it is actually easier to join than if you were white because the sorority/frat want to diversify their organization. I was also saying that the greeks fill a void for people who want that party atmosphere. I would never (and I stress that) consider Furman a party school, or a drinking school. It happens like any college campus but it is not big unless you outwardly seek it. If you are looking to drink then they DO dominate campus. if you are a big music person, or active in religious organizations for instance and aren't interested in parties... they will not affect your impression of school, greeks won't exist as far as i'm concerned. </p>

<p>As far as social divide is concerned, I think that as in any environment those who don't want to interact with other races or social classes won't... that is not the majority though. Furman from that aspect is no different to any other situation, it's about whether or not you want to be an integral part. I don't feel like there is a push to create divides within the student body. </p>

<p>Also from the beginning Furman tries to eliminate these problems by making your transition into school, about meeting all kinds of new people and really getting to know people. It doesn't give you time to be choosy about who to accept and not accept, because when it all starts you theoretically know no one...</p>

<p>You had mentioned Duke earlier, and I would say that the Greek life is bigger there than it is here, and that the issues with alcohol are much stronger whether you are in a frat or not in one.</p>

7

<p>jbstein85,</p>

<p>You misunderstood my question and my concern. I was not suggesting that there was "a push to create divides in the student body." I was merely commenting on the photos which indicate that the Greeks - - whose numbers (30-35% of the student body) and impact on campus social life are not insignificant - - are all-White or all-black.</p>

<p>I do not doubt that some members of the Furman community may wish to increase the school's diversity. But like many other schools (all of which claim to be interested in or to have made progress in diversifying) Furman is not very divere now. That absence of numerical diversity coupled with images of same-race social groups in the admissions video and on web site (all images the school chose as favorable or at least accurate) prompted me to question the students' openess. I commented on the Greeks because (1) my D isn't religious or into theater (she's an athlete), so frats/sororities will probably appeal to her, though she's no party girl (at least not to my knowledge), and (2) the same race photos were striking. </p>

<p>On the surface, Furman sounds like a great school and it offers much of what my D wants (academics, athletics, under 4000 students, warm weather), but I want to make sure she'll be comfortable. And gathreing info before her visit and interview will allow me to make the most of our limited time on campus.</p>

<p>(PS: As for your your it's-easier-for-blacks-to-join comment - - not the best example of enlightenment.)</p>

8

<p>I think it would be safe to say that if your daughter visits Furman and likes it she will like it if she comes here. What Furman shows you when you visit is a very accurate representation of what it is like to go here, there is really nothing hidden or misleading. As for the greek comment that you made in your (ps) I apologize, clearly what I said was taken in a context that I didn't mean. I obviously can't convey clearly what I was trying to say about diversity within the greek system or social life here. It is hard to really explain without explaining the entire process of joining a sorority. At the end of the day though, like I said before if your daughter feels comfortable when she visits, or even if she decides later on to do an overnight visit... and she feels comfortable, I'd be willing to guarantee she'll like it here. Furman is what it sells...</p>

9

<p>nyc, </p>

<p>Please allow me to clarify some concerns you may have about Furman. </p>

<p>"I commented on the Greeks because (1) my D isn't religious or into theater (she's an athlete), so frats/sororities will probably appeal to her, though she's no party girl (at least not to my knowledge), and (2) the same race photos were striking. "</p>

<p>1) Furman is known better for its athletics than for its theater programs, though we have an outstanding musical program. One does not have to be religious to come to Furman. I am not religious and that was one of my concerns about Furman. This is no longer an issue for me because if one does not want to be involved with religious life at Furman one does not have to be. I am not a big "party girl" either and this is also not an issue.
2) As to your comments about Furman greek life being segregated by race, this is not entirely true. Tri-delt has several girls who are not "white". Most of the sororities have memebers of different ethnic backgrounds. This includes the traditionally "black" sororities such as AKA. </p>

<p>It is true that Furman is a southern school. Its in the heart of the upstate of SC, but unlike other southern schools, races at Furman do mix and are not hostile to each other. Sororities are not exclusive and do NOT dominate social life. The sororities themselves mix and it is more uncommon to have friends only from your sorority than to have friends from all different organizations. Greek life is not the driving force behind Furman social life, nor are they religiously affiliated. Indepents and greeks work together to foster a better sense of community on and off campus. Just because a greek website shows only girls of one race in their pictures, does not mean that this is the case. Pictures are rotated often. If you seek a campus that stresses its diversity or even "shoves it down your throat" as one of my friends commented while visiting another southern school, Furman is not the place for your D. When you come visit Furman, please come with an open mind. Too often parents and perspective students visit a campus with preconceived notions, which are often untrue. These notions can bias their opinion of a school before they even set foot on campus. All this being said, Furman may not be the right place for your D, but I hope that you give it a fair and fighting chance. Good luck with your college search.</p>

10

<p>I Wouldn't want anything shoved down D's throat.</p>

<p>And while I like to think I approach most things with an open mind, I am not, nor would I encourage my D to be an empty vessel. </p>

<p>As for photos and the like, why display them if they don't accurately portray the campus or the organization? If you're not an all-White group, don't put up an all-White photo! And if you do put up the all-Whie photo don't be surprised (or angry or indignant) that viewers infer that you're an all-White group.</p>

<p>I must say, however, that I find southerns are often more open, honest and comfortable talking about such issues than folks in the north.</p>

11

<p><a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=2228&item=6958248325&rd=1%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=2228&item=6958248325&rd=1&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>This is a book that is on eBay that is supposed to be an "insiders" view of Furman. Some information in the eBay page is good.</p>

12

<p>I found the excerpts from the Furman book interesting, particularly in light of my initial iquiry (H's concerns more than mine):
- frats (drinking/homogeneity)
- academics
-conservative</p>

<p>Guide says academics not a problem (though "B" rating seemed low compared to many favorable comments).</p>

<p>No real mention of frat/Greek culture - which is more than membership - other than the following: "Girls are mainly pretty, southern society girsls . . . . Other types can be found but usually outside of the Greek scene" Drugs not really a problem on campus (but this doesn't appear to include alcohol).</p>

<p>As for social life in general, the school is repeatedly describe as "preppy," with girls dress for class, complain about not dating and are "bitter about not being able to find their husband at Furman."</p>

<p>And among the top 10 bad things:
# 2 - homogeneity
# 8 - southern conservativism
#10 - confederate-flag-waving locals</p>

<p>According to the squibs, these are comments from Furman students (probably not a scientific or random sample, but neither are the CC postings insisting that everyone gets along.) And this guide is not the first or only source I've consulted (including web site and admissions CD) to portray the school in this light. </p>

<p>How can a M read this an not be concerned that, despite the college's many attributes, her black D might not be comfortable!!!</p>

<p>And to look for the presence or absence of these conditions/sentiments during a campus visit is not closed-minded or biased, but good sense.</p>

13

<p>But with an open mind.</p>

<p>You are intelligent enough to realize that the only purpose to this series of "guide books" is profit for the publisher. So many other forums and sites frequently debunk the value of this series of books. My husband and I visited my D at campus earlier this week, and we saw a copy of this book in the book store. Looked through it and laughed, tisked, and scowled at just about every remark...according to her, none of it bore much resemblance to her experience with the campus. Asked some other friends to look through it, and they had similar responses; very little applied.</p>

<p>Remember that the students who respond to requests to participate in such surveys may not be totally representative of the campus. Have you looked at the information for many of the other "popular" schools in this series? For example, Duke certainly gets low marks in many areas, and so does Dartmouth in many categories, and most people find these schools terrific. So, I certainly wouldn't place much credence in this series. </p>

<p>All that said, I am confused as to why you keep posting on Furman threads when it is obvious you have already decided you would never seriously consider Furman for your daughter bacause of your concerns. Have you talked with any students at Furman of African-American heritage to gain their experiences, if that is information that would help you? Perhaps admissions could help find someone who will candidly answer any questions you may have. If you are looking for students here to engage in a debate with you, most of them are just too busy. And a couple have already tried, but I suspect that no one will be able to dissuade you from your perceptions (or, more correctly, your assumptions) about Furman, and this is not unkindly or meant. It's OK for you to decide that Furman is not the school for your D; perhaps it is time to just move on to other schools in your search and focus your energies there as a better strategy in your college search. Good luck in helping your daughter find her ideal choice next year:)</p>

<p>P.S. As for dressing for class, I really laugh at that one. My D gets up 5 minutes before she has to leave for class, barely combs her hair and usually wears no makeup. And from what I've seen, "dressing" up may mean a less shabby pair of jeans (perhaps a designer label fopr a very few) worn with the t-shirt or sweatshirt choice of the day. The students look just like kids on every other American campus; really, really the same everywhere... collegiate homogeneity of fashion! I suspect the info in these guides is WAAAAY out of date.</p>

14

<p>I don't understand why visiting w/ a critical eye would be less than open minded. I'm not looking for perfection, but I'd certainly like to know what D is getting into.</p>

<p>D and I will visit Furman in the fall and we will talk to students (haven't contacted admissions b/c I don't want to talk to hand-picked student). I accept that whatever we observe will be a limited picture b/c it will not reflect every student's experience. But, I am admittedly less interested in an objective assessment (if such a thing exists) than info that will assist me in determining whether campus is one where D will be happy, productive and safe. </p>

<p>(Good friend's exp as a female grad student in UPenn's physics prgm was very diff than that of the male students. For example, guys had computer terminals in their dorms; she didn't and often had to get locked in the library overnight to finish assignments. Needless to say, she was far more critical of the program than the male students and while her opinions were by no mean representative, they would be invaluable if you had a D applying to the program.)</p>

<p>As for guides, I find that every school embraces the favorable reviews and dismisses the unflattering ones as over-stated, out-dated or ill-informednegative ones (ie: Vandy will boast of if #8 ranking as a top university, but insists that the #2 in no race/class interaction is incorrect and unwarranted. Also, I don't know of a single admissions office that will acknowl anything other than racial harmony). That doesn't mean the guides inaccurate or even if partially inaccurate, that they aren't a good place to start - - flagging some possible issues or areas of inquiry. (AS for Duke and Dartmouth, both get what I consider an alarming number of negative reviews. But the fact that other parents/students chose the school regardless of those negatives doesn't mean that the negatives not exist or I ought to overlook them.)</p>

15

<p>nyc: You say that furman being in SC is too conservative yet frats=drinking both of which are not entirely true, so for clarity what side of the fence are you on.</p>

16

<p>I have a D who is a freshman at Furman. We are not from the south. We are not black, so I cannot speak from the point of view of a M with a D who is black. That is something you & your D will have to assess for yourselves. However, I can speak to a couple other points:</p>

<p>Greek life is ABSOLUTELY not an issue for my D. She had no interest in rush, so did not do it. Some of her friends did. Only one of her friends decided to pledge. It is a nonissue for her. They are all still friends. No one cares. And greek life does NOT dominate the campus. It may dominate some groups of students on campus, but it does not dominate the campus. D went to a couple fraternity parties early on (they are off campus, BTW), and she was not into the scene at all. So she no longer goes. However, she has a happy, fun social life. She does not drink, nor do her friends. She watches movies, goes to concerts, hangs out downtown. She volunteers, studies, goofs around with friends. It has been a nice year of growth & discovery for her.</p>

<p>As for academics, I can tell you Furman does have a good reputation (grad schools respect it). As for its rigor, I think that varies by student. My D says some students seem very stressed by the challenges of classes; she has not been overwhelmed. She has had some very good profs, and she has gotten to know some of her profs well. I do think it's very important to look at the course catalog to make sure that the course offerings interest your D ... paying attention to prereqs & distribution requirements ... this is something one should do for every prospective college.</p>

<p>Yes, Furman is southern. There is a Bible belt conservatism present. Some like it, some don't. I think it's important for a non-southerner to visit & see if she likes it. My D has found plenty of students who share her more liberal views. Also, she has not sensed the whole Confederate flag-waving thing. She had worried about that. One thing she definitely thinks is that Furman is homogeneous. BUT ... the school really is trying to change that. And if those they are trying to attract turn it down because they feel it's TOO homogeneous ... well, it can't change, then, can it? Of course, not everyone is comfortable being the change; it's an individual decision. One of my D's good friends is black, so I can say for certain that there are people of different colors who are hanging out together on a regular basis. People don't seem to NOT want the school to become more diverse.</p>

<p>Finally, I will say this: You are worried. You need to spend some time on campus IF you think Furman might really be a good place for your D. You will either find your worries validated, or you will decide the good outweighs the bad. In the end, there are many schools your D could attend. If Furman isn't the place for her, there are others. We are telling you that we haven't found the things you are worried about to be the case. You will never know for sure until you check it out for yourself & make your own decision.</p>

<p>Editing to add: Drinking is definitely not a big thing at Furman! There was a comic who came to campus & many of his jokes weren't even relevant for Furman students ... wasted people doing the walk of shame after a night of hooking up with someone they just met ... well, not really a Furman thing.</p>

17

<p>nyc, you just need to visit. FU is a good school and it will get your D wherever she wants to go if she puts in the work.</p>

<p>Take a look at the site to look at pictures/students:</p>

<p>Login</a> | Facebook</p>

<p>Or take a look at this from a Furman student:</p>

<p>EngageFurman</a> Journals - Sterling - Multicultural Weekend Madness</p>

18

<p>Check out the date for the previous post, uncfan33. You probably won't get an answer since it was almost 3 years ago. Just FYI:)</p>

<p>I'm referring, of course, to the posts by nyc.</p>

19

<p>Oh, for heaven's sake! I would not have bothered to post had I seen the original date!! I wonder what happened when all was said & done?!</p>

20

<p>All the posts contained some excellent information, however, so perhaps someone else will benefit from all the wise and insightful remarks.:)</p>