@WayOutWestMom
Thanks for your insights and clarifications. Expecting to be a full-pay for D’s medical school (bsmd).
Auntyji, Namaste!. Academic professors do practice medicine and conduct clinical research for advancement of medicine. Research is also a factor in medical school admission.
Yes, absolutely. DS has worked at a research lab for over two years including full time one summer (not this summer) and he definitely enjoys it. Not sure the MD/PhD path is right for him, though he’s not ruling anything out right now.
@auntyji @grtd2010
Applying to MD/PhD is a whole different thing. Applicants are applying to both PhD programs and MD programs simultaneously, must receive IIs from both halves of the program, be independently interviewed by both and be independently accept by both. MD/PhD applicants need to have CV that looks like a straight PhD applicant along with an excellent GPA and MCAT and all the typical pre-med ECs. MD/PhD admissions are much more competitive than applying to MD programs alone.
A MD/PhD program takes longer than a a plain MD–typically in the 6 to 8 years range. And, though many or even most MD/PhD programs are fully funded–not all of them are. Any student who drops out the PhD portion of the program automatically loses all their funding–although students cannot not be charged retroactively for the portion of their program already completed.
MD/PhDs have different career trajectory than MDs. MD/PhDs typically enter research track residencies that are longer than standard because they have several research years built in. Ditto for fellowships. Unless a MD/PhD goes into consulting/research for industry or government, academic MD/PhD positions are split between the lab and clinical duties. (Split varies, 70% lab-30% clinical is considered ideal, but 50-50 is common.) Because basic and applied research is expected of MD/PhD, early career MD/PhDs spent a good deal of time & effort developing their research reputations and working toward qualifying for their own independent R03 grants. (43 is the average age for receiving one’s first R03 grant.) Having been married to one research STEM PhD and having another as a SIL, I can assure you developing your research reputation and expertise is extremely time consuming, requiring very long hours. (D1 says her husband is the only person she knows who routinely worked longer hours than she during her residency. She’s finished with residency, but he’s still working long hours, even though he’s a tenured professor.)
You can be an academic physician without a PhD, but academic medicine also has its own career track which starts with doing one’s residency at a research-oriented academic residency/fellowship program and doing research during residency/fellowship to develop a area of expertise that goes beyond what is typical for an attending in one’s specialty.
I think DS knows a fair amount (he has some great mentors!) but this is certainly eyeopening for me. Thank you so much for explaining…
I should also mention that over a career, a MD/PhD earns literally millions of dollars LESS than their MD colleagues. MD/PhDs spend longer in low paying residencies and fellowships than MDs. And because MD/PhDs see fewer patients than their MD colleagues their overall compensation is lower. Academic research just doesn’t pay well.
Academic medicine (whether a MD/PhD or MD) pays significantly less than private practice.
Thanks for all the info. Is Federal Direct Unsubsidized loan for professional studies ( health professional’s limit 40.5 k/yr ) based on medical student and spouse’s FASFA only ?
For any institutional aid, parental financial information is needed to determine the family contribution.
Are Direct Grad Plus loans based on credit worthiness of the medical student or a cosigner’s credit can be used.? A UG student may not have much of a credit history of his/her own.
That is a huge difference over the long term! Definitely something to be mindful of!!
One more question for the gurus… I tried filling out the EFC here since they had it available https://meded.hms.harvard.edu/package-determinations just to see.
And now I’m confused about the sibling attending school full time part of the equation. There is a chance that our youngest might be in grad school in 2022 or perhaps 2023 onward. It seems to make a difference in calculating EFC on the face of it. But @texaspg mentioned that Columbia and Yale did not factor that in the FA package in their experience.
Should a sibling be attending grad school for part of DS’s hypothetical four years in med school, would that be impact FA as the IM EFC calculator seems to suggest?
Here is an informative guide from Griffin Medical School (UCLA) on medical school Unsubsidized loans.
https://medschool.ucla.edu/workfiles/FAO/MED_Guide_to_Unsubsidized_Loans.pdf
@grtd2010 Any individual in professional school who fills out a student FAFSA, who has no student loans currently in default, and who has not exceeded the maximum allowable federal loan limit will be eligible for an unsubsidized federal direct loan.
Grad Plus loans are based on the student’s creditworthiness and do not require a co-signer. The student either qualifies or they don’t. If they don’t qualify, then even having a co-signer won’t make them eligible.
The bar to qualify for a Grad Plus loan is pretty low. No bankruptcies. No student loans in default. No major adverse credit notations (i.e. no delinquent credit accounts.) But they do need a credit history. It doesn’t have to be years and years long, but no credit history = no Grad Plus.
An fairly easy way to help your student create a credit history is to get them a student credit card in their own name through a bank where they have a saving/checking account. The credit limits on these types of cards are pretty low–$500 to $2000. Have them use to card to make some small purchases every month and pay off the entire balance every month. Both my kids got student credit cards as soon as they turned 18.
There are private student loans that offer lower interest rates than federal direct & Grad Plus loans, but private loans are not eligible for federal repayment programs.
Sibling in grad school–typically grad students aren’t included in family EFC calculations because they are considered independent for FA purposes. However, some schools may offer some consideration.
@auntyji - I was in the unique position where both the kids were starting different levels of college (second hadnt started) and it sounds like you might have a similar problem. If your second kid is currently in college your numbers may come out differently when you start working on the forms end of next year if he is still in college during 21-22 irrespective of starting a masters. What you spend at the beginning of 2022 will change the dynamic of your FAFSA and CSS profile.
If a student is applying this cycle to hopefully begin fall 2021, would the parents 2020 tax return or 2019 tax return be used for EFC?
2019 for FAFSA.
Yes, S graduates ‘21 and D in ‘22. He’s applying ‘21 cycle to start in fall ‘22 right after she graduates. We will see how it plays out. At least I feel more informed now! Thank you all for sharing info and advice!
Thank you for this thread. We (parents) are wondering the same thing, and there is so little information! My daughter has basically the same stats as your son. She decided to work for two years at a hospital in Texas and became a TX resident. LOL-couldn’t believe she became so sensible!
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The threD is over a year old and info may be dated. You’re better off starting a new thread. Closing.