Looking for advice in Merit aid for a top 1% student

If South Carolina is a possibility, look at Clemson, too. They have scholarships for OOS applicants who meet the criteria for their in-state awards. https://www.clemson.edu/financial-aid/types/scholarships/clemson-scholarship-recruiting.html
Both USC and Clemson have club-level women’s ice hockey, though they compete against DIII schools –
https://clemson.campuslabs.com/engage/organization/icehockey
https://garnetgate.sa.sc.edu/organization/icehockey

Congratulations on your three extraordinary daughters. Am trying to see how this info can help OP and many who are like him whose have to get high merit money in order to go to college. Your youngest daughter, as talented as she is, has options not available to anyone who is not going to get financial aid, and whose family can only come up with $15k. The OP’s DD needs a full tuition merit scholarship.

That would knock MIT off the list. They give zero in merit money. Same with CMU and Penn. Even if she wanted to apply to any Ivy League school, they are all zero probability of giving out needed merit money, because they give none.

The OP’s DD is not instate for Illinois, so the remarkable deal your daughter has with this top flagship is not happening for her. She also is not a NMF, so some of the goodies available to your daughter are not on the table for this young woman.

I love UMich too. My youngest was accepted there EA. But they didn’t offer him a dime. They do give financial aid and maybe some merit money to OOSers but somehow I don’t think the likelihood of her getting one of the few Stamps awards is very high. In fact it’s very low. For you, no big deal since you can afford Michigan just fine without that award, but it’s a very low probability endeavor even among the lottery ticket tries this young woman is taking. Boston College, the same thing; better odds there since there are 15 awards given and there are fewer EA kids accepted there. But BC does not have Chemical Engineering or any engineering department at all.

I believe OP is considering Duke , and Wash U along with like schools among her lottery ticket picks. She’s going to have pick her personal favorite from those top schools that do give out big enough merit awards to make it possible for her to go to the schools.

We have been suggesting Alabama, and perhaps she’ll apply there. Yes, it’s great to have that very early accept with money in hand. I think her sure thing school will be Kentucky.

I believe your older daughters’ experiences with USC are very relevant. Some of the comments have suggested USC and I think that has been duly noted. Again Kentucky seems to be her school of choice for sure big merit which is difficult to find these days. USC has a chem Engineering dept as well, so it is a most relevant suggestion. You are referring to University of South Carolina , not Southern California, right?

I always like reading about outcomes of those posting here. Please keep us apprised as to what awards your daughter gets. She’s an incredible young woman as is the OP’s DD. That she ventured across the country for a New England boarding school experience with a full scholarship. at such a young age is amazing. She is fortunate to have a parent to help her through this college process, given that she HAS to get a large merit award or commute to schools her state school choice since CA colleges aren’t so giving in merit money as IL, your state, or for that matter, NY, my state are. She seems to be resilient and taking these monetary limitations well. That the family has a disabled child that requires large monetary consideration appears to be something she understands and supports

I think both of these women will have some good choices in the spring.

CMU will give up to full ride merit scholarships to truly extraordinary math students through the Knaster-McWilliams program. Mere mortals need not apply - these are for the top 0.0001% of ability.

From the CMU website:

“Carnegie Mellon doesn’t award merit scholarships, except for limited performance-based scholarships awarded by our School of Drama and School of Music, which are included in a student’s financial aid package. To be considered for all available financial aid, you must submit the required financial aid documents.”

CMU used to give out some scholarships for women in STEM and I have heard of the Knaster-Mcwilliams program as some of the top mathematicians winning awards have been part of it. I have no idea whether merit money is involved, if it’s an outside award or whatever. I just googled it and came up pretty much empty.

One of my kids went to CMU, another accepted there but declined to go and a third visited it and decided not to apply there. It was my first choice school in the Dark Ages when I was looking at colleges. But that award, though I’m residually aware of it , I have no clue how it is given. Last info session I attended there, the director of Admissions said there was no pure merit money. No idea how this award is classified

@cptofthehouse , I am definitely not an expert on monetary awards given in college, but in my limited experience, some students are given awards at college. A student I know was awarded a 5k discount off his tuition for having the highest GPA in his freshman year. My kid (different college) was given a (tiny) cash award for being the best in her year for a particular subject. Both of those awards were from long-established alumni funds. So I am guessing that some awards are given based on student performance once the student is enrolled at the school. Others might have more knowledge.

@KevinFromOC - Any update about narrowing down schools? How is your daughter doing with the initial applications? I know this is a busy time for her.

Yes, it’s been a busy and distraction filled week…

She submitted Alabama, but now has to apply to their honors program.
She has several more locked and loaded, going over essays with her counselor and a teacher, that we hope to fire off by Friday - Pitt, ASU, Colorado School of Mines, Miami Ohio, and Northeastern. Pitt was a tough one with 5 essays, but we think now that she’s got those, plus the common app essay and most of 3 or 4 others done, she’ll be able to pull from that collection for other unique essays.

Right after those come Stevens Institute of Technology, RIT, RPI, USC, and the UCs - all probably in 2-3 weeks, then Rice, Clarkson, and Mudd.

I think we’re ruling out Georgia Tech, as their merit aid is hard to figure out, along with Virginia (I don’t think her school will be upset that they nominated her for the Jefferson but she won’t even apply) and Franklin Olin

As far as the automatic full tuition or better based on grades and/or NHRP, we’ll probably go with ASU, Alabama, Kentucky, Utah, and South Carolina, and forgo Huntsville, Arizona, and New Mexico, with Nebraska and their late submission requirements being a solid maybe.

The undecideds are Maryland, WPI, Ohio State, Purdue, Delaware, Rose Hulman, Boston University, Illinois Institute of Technology, Tulane, and Vanderbilt - she’ll apply to maybe 3 from that group.

It still looks like it’ll be 20+ applications (though that could still change), but spread out over several months. The 3 or so reaches that don’t offer merit aid (such as Princeton) will go last.

@KevinFromOC Good plan, and it looks like everything is on track. Make sure your daughter mentions her NHRP status in all her applications. If she is uneasy doing so before getting the official NHRP notification she might want to wait a few more days. It should come very soon now.

Also, if she has time and wants to visit ASU by herself in the weeks or months to come, registration is open https://barretthonors.asu.edu/admissions/student-experience-day/
ASU takes care of almost everything (you have to pay for the light rail but it is only $2 each way). They even provide the bedding and the towel! It is very well organized and I think safe. As I wrote earlier my son really enjoyed his trip last year and that sealed the deal for him.

As long as she submits the Pitt online app with the three short answer questions, she should hear back about acceptance soon, and hopefully be in the first rounds of merit review by the scholarship committee. The other two essays are for honors consideration which as an engineering student she doesn’t really need (at Pitt). She could submit those later.

Send SAT score and transcript now, if you haven’t already!

I’m concerned about how she’s going to decide. She’s going to get in with merit to a large number of schools. She will have five to choose from even in the safety category and there will be more acceptances with merit too.

S19 had nine acceptances and he had to prioritize where to revisit (or visit for a first time) in the spring. With school still in session and his spring sport, it was difficult to find time. At the beginning of April, we made flight reservations for four visits. (Yes! Four different round trip flights!) He went to two and decided the second school was the one. Asked to cancel the other visits. But…he still had schools on his acceptance list that we never visited that could have been amazing for him. It was a VERY stressful April.

Now, for him, almost all of his decisions came in March. The OP’s daughter will be getting some sooner.

@KevinFromOC , will your daughter be researching each school as acceptances come in? Will she be eliminating some safeties this fall as those rolling decisions are sent out? How many schools will she visit? Does she have time and resources to get out to these schools?

@homerdog I actually think, from having faced a very similar situation last year and using the same process as @KevinFromOC , that it is going to be easy to narrow the list of candidates. My prediction is that the two top contenders will be UC Irvine and ASU, both ranked #39 in Engineering Programs in the 2020 US News ranking, both having great Honors Colleges and more importantly both guaranteed to end up under 20K/year including all the fees. The other schools are either further down in the ranking, or likely to end up more expensive.

I agree with @NJEngineerDad - this will come down to cost and strength of program. I don’t see this applicant needing to visit every school that accepts her. She can also further narrow down by preferred size/location.

@NJEngineerDad then why apply to 20 schools? ASU and UC Irvine are not reaches and the OP’s daughter isn’t choosy about location/vibe, etc.

US news rankings should not be a major deciding factor, IMO.

I think UC Irvine is only on budget if commuting.

Engineering rankings don’t tell the whole story. Access to research, coop connections, program specifics (no GPA or other gatekeeper to desired engineering specialty) are important considerations.

She would do amazing at a number of good merit options, including Alabama, Ohio State, U Delaware, Pitt etc

For many of these options being in honors or not is not even a deciding factor because the engineering program is strong independent of honors.

But time will tell.

I think the decision part will be hard too, but DS has just 4 acceptances and we’re already racking our brains over which one to go with. I keep thinking we should throw a few more apps out there, but I think it would just be overwhelming for him at that point. Hopefully, things will be clearer with the financial aid and merit info.

@homerdog Well I am just making a prediction. I cannot really see the future :wink: Maybe she will get a full ride at a lower ranked school and decide that saving 20K/year is a smarter choice. Or maybe somehow she will get a very large scholarship at a higher ranked school and decide it is worth spending a little more.

Because the admission process is holistic, and because the criteria to get merit scholarships at some of the schools are secret, it is hard to know for sure what to expect…

And maybe once she has some acceptances, she will jettison the idea of applying to 20 more schools.

DS applied to 11 schools. He was accepted at 9, waitlisted at one, and rejected by one. Looking back on it, it was way too many schools to keep up with. I think about five would have been a better number.

I will muddle the issue. My advice is to go for the best school your daughter can get into (it sounds like she has a very reasonable shot to get into at least one top tier school). If she gets a hit at a top school, take loans if necessary. It will be worth it. If she doesn’t get into a top school, then consider the merit offers she receives from those schools. My student had similar academic stats, considerable sports and music accomplishments, and other notable activities. Great essays. Received merit offers (about 25K per year) from Northeastern, University of Rochester, RPI. Accepted into UVA, VT and GT for engineering, but with no merit money (typically at all three, the merit money is reserved for in-state students only). The Georgia Tech acceptance was so hard to get as an out-of-state student, and this is one of the top engineering schools in the world, so it seemed ridiculous not to go. We will take loans if necessary. We were also deemed ineligible for need-based aid, which to us is absurd. Starting salaries for GT students are high.