<p>Well, I'm black and I want to get to the crux of a big issue here on CC, how much does race play a factor in admittance to an elite college? I'm looking for URMS w/ there SAT score/ GPA and which schools they got accepted to and which they got denied from. </p>
<p>Thnx</p>
<p>First, information of the type you seek is available by analyzing the posts on the Official Harvard EA thread. Ditto for Yale or Princeton. Of course, all CC posts are of limited value because they are self-reported.</p>
<p>Second, for the Class of 2009, the average SAT score for African-American Harvard admits was approximately 1400 versus 1480 for the Class of 2009 as a whole. I do not know what the data are for other URMs.</p>
<p>swbutterfly1: Where did you get that information about the average SAT I scores for African-American admits?</p>
<p>I suspect he made it up. </p>
<p>Harvard has reported the yield rate separately, but not other stats.</p>
<p>Right, there's no way any college would release the average SAT scores by race.</p>
<p>The OP posted the below ECs on another thread. His or her ECs are very weak. When it comes to all students -- including URMS-- places like HPYS are looking for more than the stats. They also want strong ECs, and there really are URMs with the stats and strong ECs who are applying. Of course, there are exceptions for people of all races who have strong stats, but have family responsibilities that don't allow them to pursue ECs.</p>
<p>If you don't believe me, just check out the archives of the HPYS forums on CC.</p>
<p>"ECs</p>
<p>Chess Club
Habitat for Humanity
TSA
Sadly not much more.."</p>
<p>Northstarmom is absolutely correct. There are a numerous number of URMs here that I have met that have astronomical scores. At the same token, I've seen Asians and Whites that do not have such astronomical scores.</p>
<p>Lol, lets bump this thred yoooooo!</p>
<p>While not at liberty to disclose the source of the '09 data, there is published information and commentary that is generally corroborative of my post above.
For example:</p>
<p>"Consider a table (page 62) from the Thernstroms' America in Black and White, based on an article in the Journal of Blacks in Higher Education. These data, for freshmen enrolling in 1992, paint a different picture than that offered in The Shape of the River. Among these universities, the difference between the average white SAT score and the average black SAT score is smallest at Harvard, which engages only in relatively modest affirmative action and is able to take the best of the applicant pool because of its reputation. But as one moves down through the Ivies, the gap increases."
(<a href="http://www.reason.com/9902/bk.re.unexplored.shtml)%5B/url%5D">www.reason.com/9902/bk.re.unexplored.shtml)</a>.</p>
<p>And consider this (note it predates the SAT score re-centering which boosted scores, on average, by nearly 100 points):</p>
<p>"At Harvard, for example, the midpoint SAT score for blacks in the freshman class in 1992 (I have not found more recent numbers) was 1305, a score that would get these students into any university in the world, a score so close to the white midpoint score that it was described by an affirmative action critic as not "statistically meaningful." (<a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/affirm/stories/aaop011298.htm)%5B/url%5D">www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/affirm/stories/aaop011298.htm)</a>.</p>
<p>I don't see how this supports your figures. The reports seem to suggest a very small difference between SAT scores for blacks and others at Harvard.</p>
<p>I share the skepticism that the 80 point figure is correct. I would be surprised if Harvard calculated the mean SAT by race at all, even with no intention of releasing these figures.</p>
<p>Finally:</p>
<p>"Among elite institutions the gap is smallest at Harvard, which generally gets its pick of the top scoring black students in the country. The gap between black and white SAT scores is 95 points...(all of these data are from the freshman classes of 1992)." <a href="http://www.contumacy.org/3WasGragliaRight.html%5B/url%5D">www.contumacy.org/3WasGragliaRight.html</a></p>
<p>You are citing 15 year old data for enrollees. Your initial speculation concerned ADMITS for 2005. Any documentation of that? </p>
<p>How does the 92 data account for overall changes in the black-white gap over this time, and increases in the share of top-scoring balcks who apply to Harvard?</p>
<p>Blacks applying to Harvard will typically have to score 2350 or above and be in the top 2% of their high school class, just like everyone else</p>
<p>This has to be true since the Harvard itself states it does not discriminate on the basis or race, color, or creed</p>
<p>Now why would anyone doubt this?</p>
<p>Harvard may not explicitly take into account race, gender, etc., but it definitely plays a role. Like most other colleges, Harvard doesn't want to consist solely of whites and asians, so they'll make more of an effort to snag a quality black student over a quality white one. Race may be fairly low on the admissions checklist, but given the level of competition most good applicants are fairly equal with regards to everything else, so that can be a tie breaker.</p>
<p>Cambridgeguy, I know URMs turned down by Harvard with scores that fit their range well. I also know some accepted with scores that are much lower than the lower 25% range. Though I have never seen the breakdown of accepted scores by URM status, my son's highschool keeps record of every college their student have appllied to. If you go to its Harvard page, you can see the SAT, GPa numbers for each student who has appled there. It also identifies each applicant by sex, URM and any hook. There are codes for legacy, development, special relationship (celebrities' kids), recruited athlete, strong performing arts resume, national recognition on things that top schools consider important (highly ranked in debate for instance, Siemans finalist, etc). Most of those accepted had a specialty code, and it there were as many non URMs with below average academic stats as there were URMs. I did not see many accepted, URM or not, without that code.</p>
<p>This is interesting, but I am looking for actual scores as well. But please feel free to post.</p>
<p>I know these are the scores of URMs from my school who got in last year (both African American):</p>
<p>4.57 Weighted GPA, 1970 SAT
4.47 GPA, 2120 SAT</p>
<p>Thank you Monsieur! Do you know if these kids were truly African American or did they or their parents immigrate from Africa or the Caribbean?</p>
<p>I believe they were truly African American, although I'm not 100% sure.</p>
<p>bump.... I'm really interested in this.</p>