Low Income Students and Majors

<p>Hi everyone, I haven't posted in a while--I wanted to ask for advice on an issue that's really been giving me trouble. </p>

<p>I'm a rising sophomore at Harvard and come from a low income family. I have one more semester to pick my major. I'm interested in and fairly good at many disciplines, some of which are "useful," such as biology and applied mathematics, but most of which (and the most prominent of which) are in the humanities (and I'm not a pre-med). In a perfect world, I would spend my remaining three years in college studying Spanish or another language or anthropology or social studies (for those of you who aren't familiar, it's a cool major we have at Harvard that describes itself as "an interdisciplinary concentration in the social sciences"). Our peers and advisers and even the Harvard College Handbook tell us to do exactly that--major in something we truly love--and remind us that students who major in "impractical" fields end up doing perfectly fine. And a few years ago, that's exactly what I thought I would do. But increasingly, as I approach adulthood, I am beginning to worry. </p>

<p>Lots of my peers and friends are majoring in seemingly impractical fields, and they generally seem very excited and unconcerned about the future (at least outwardly). Yet I constantly remind myself that this is because the vast majority of Harvard students come from upper-middle class families. They don't need to worry about money in the same way that I do. I feel silly even comparing myself to them. I cannot expect to fall back on my family's income if I have trouble finding decent employment. </p>

<p>And because students who share my financial situation are pretty uncommon at Harvard, I feel that there hasn't really been a precedent set for students like me -- there's no blog or book called "What Low Income Students at Harvard/the Ivy League Need to Know." If a guide like that existed, what would it say? Would it say "it's true, there's no need to stress about your major because it will hardly be relevant to your career prospects"? Or would it say "no, actually, what is written in Harvard's handbook applies to most of its students, but not to you--if you don't have a substantive family income to fall back on or a large inheritance, you better pick a profitable major"?</p>

<p>So, with all of this said, does anyone have any thoughts or experience to share? Many thanks, and I hope that lots more people can benefit from this thread :).</p>

<p>Cry me a river…</p>

<p>Highly suggested majors: computer science, finance.</p>

<p>I am a low-income rising junior at Harvard, majoring in Near Eastern Languages and Civilizations and I’ve thought about this issue quite a bit too, as I found myself “good” at math&science but far more interested in things like history and politics. A few comments:</p>

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<p>I’m not sure how realistic this is. Excluding trust fund kids and the insanely wealthy, I don’t think most students at Harvard (i.e. the upper middle class) would be comforted by the prospect of having no employment after graduation. Sure, they have the advantage that they are unlikely to end up on the street after graduation. But that doesn’t mean they or their parents are content with them living in their parents’ basement for an indefinite amount of time. Everyone is worried about finding a job in this economy, whether their parents drive a Mercedes or a used Corolla. Perhaps the difference is that your worst case scenario is working retail or something, whereas theirs is just doing nothing. Both are equally unsustainable, in terms of both finance and personal satisfaction.</p>

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<p>You are referring a dichotomy that is commonly assumed but I’m not sure exists. Essentially you’re saying math/science is practical and profitable, whereas social science/humanities is impractical and futureless. This dichotomy is based on a little bit of truth, but there are some important things to realize.</p>

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<li>Your undergraduate major only matters if you plan for it to be your terminal degree, or if your eventual terminal degree requires a certain undergraduate curriculum. Yes, if you graduate from Harvard undergrad and plan to directly enter the workforce, you will find that an Anthro degree did not teach you “practical skills” in the same way that a chemistry degree would. That does not mean that people don’t hire Anthro majors! That just means that other issues will be more important in the hiring process, such as your work experience, relevant internships, leadership experience, personal accomplishments, interview skills, networking ability, etc etc. The quintessential example is Ibanking and Wall Street. They will hire any undergrad major in theory, but most of the time successful hires have made it through an arduous internship track that begins in your undergrad summers. No one in Ibanking or finance is going to test you on your anthropological knowledge of how language impacts cultural development but hopefully in your undergraduate studies you picked up some critical thinking skills that will stand out in more relevant ways to the people looking to hire you.</li>
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<p>As for grad schools requiring specific undergrad curriculums, I mean if you’re looking to do Russian History graduate studies you most likely have to do Russian History undergraduate studies.</p>

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<li><p>Most science majors are not inherently more profitable. There isn’t exactly an abundant list of things you can “do” with an undergrad bio major as your terminal degree. Most at Harvard go to med school, which you can (technically) do as an Anthro or Philosophy major if you want. Many others continue on to do graduate studies. Those that do directly enter the workforce often face the same kinds of extra-transcript requirements that students from other departments face. If the average salaries of bio majors after 20 years are consistently high, that is likely the effect of medical school, which isn’t really relevant to your issue of picking an undergrad major.</p></li>
<li><p>Some majors require more advanced study than others to have successful chances at landing a job. Ignoring all criteria except your major, a computer science major probably has a better chance of getting hired out of college than does an African and African American Studies major. That’s just the reality of the American job market. But if more advanced schooling is an option for you and you are content with your ability to find internships, network with people, spend your summers wisely, etc., you can make any major work for you. </p></li>
<li><p>Harvard is an exception to many rules. I’m not talking about the Harvard brand name being magical, because it won’t get you hired anywhere by itself, but attending a top school gives you opportunities in the “less practical” fields you speak of to improve your chances at being hired. At Harvard you can become the editor-in-chief of a magazine that’s distributed on every continent. At Harvard you can have unique access to competitive internships and better your chances to get into unique study abroad programs. At Harvard you can network with alumni in powerful positions. At Harvard you can get recommendations from world-class professors that carry a ton of weight in grad school admission. And sometimes, certainly in the case of Wall Street, the brand name does help on occasion. Not to sound elitist, but I would say the major you pick at Harvard is less important than the major you would pick at a school with less opportunities to become a competitive job applicant in other ways. The practical vs impractical issue is less of a problem here.</p></li>
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<p>Like I said, I thought about this too. I’ve done really well in all the math/science classes I’ve taken here, which isn’t a small number. I asked myself if choosing a humanities/social science major is an impractical decision given my total lack of fallbacks if I can’t get a job. But the more I looked at it, the more it made no sense to pick a math/science major for these reasons. There is certainly no streamlined path for Middle East studies but there are certainly options like government work, further graduate studies in the field, law school, and others… it just takes some creativity and internships and networking. I don’t have a particular career in mind yet, but I’m happy with my choice because I can definitively say there’s nothing I’d rather study at Harvard, and that’s a good thing to be able to say. I hope you make a choice that enables you to say that.</p>

<p>A lot of what I’ve said is vague I know so I hope it helps somewhat. Feel free to PM me (or reply here) if you have any more specific questions.</p>

<p>Applied math, incl. statistics, would be much more practical than biology. What about combining applied math and social sciences, one as a major and the other as a minor? Job postings I have seen that accept social science majors also tend to want people who can work with or generate quantitative data.</p>

<p>Is there a career counseling and advising center that might help you explore your options, including summer job opportunities you should seek out? Maybe give you ideas about what other grads in <em>impractical</em> fields have done after they graduated? My understanding is that you cannot depend on your family to support you, but ALSO that your family is not depending on you to support THEM immediately after you graduate. To me, that indicates that you are not forced to enter a STEM field for the initial high income, but that you need to be employed and in something better paying than an AmeriCorps job.</p>

<p>Wow. I was going to try to say a lot of what Dwight did, but it means a lot more coming from him, who is in the middle of it all right now, than from me, 35 years removed from where you are (and never poor, although I certainly knew people who were). Anyway, what Dwight says is what I observed, and continue to observe recently. </p>

<p>One thing I would add to what Dwight says is that it’s good to start thinking now, and that while your major doesn’t matter that much, there are definitely things you can and should do to make yourself more employable. Including coursework. (For example, I was a Literature major, which was the height of uselessness, but I took a few accounting courses, some other econ courses, and I got an internship at a Wall St. bank through a university program, and I had absolutely no concerns about my employability – by the time I was a senior, I had a bunch of job offers, and could get more just by going to interviews.) I recently met an Anthro major who was going to work for Google (and she was a low-income kid, too, although not any longer now) and a Sociology major who was going to work for Bain (one of the biggest, fanciest consulting companies). But that didn’t just happen for either kid. They figured out how to pursue those jobs – they made themselves look like good candidates, and they went about the application process thoughtfully and carefully. (And, believe it or not, they did it without having “Harvard” on their transcripts, although the brand names they were using were still pretty good.)</p>

<p>You would be surprised at how much overlap there is between almost any of the core social sciences, or history, and the kind of skills that get you hired as an entry-level professional in the real world. But you have to make certain you pick up those skills from some of your courses, and that your resume makes clear that you have them.</p>

<p>Also, don’t worry so much about 5 or 10 years from now. Do a realistic budget to figure how much you absolutely, positively have to earn to support yourself in the immediate future. It isn’t that much if you don’t have a lot of loans to repay. Even if you have to work crap jobs for a while as you try to find a job that will give you traction on a meaningful career, I think you’ll find it’s not that daunting a task to support yourself at a subsistence level. My wife did that – graduated with two useless majors, and did anything for about six months, including working (simultaneously) as a salesperson for a wholesale jeweler, and as a swing-shift receptionist at a major hospital emergency room. She finally got a job she liked through VISTA, and it set her in motion for a great career, but it took about six months to get going. </p>

<p>I suspect that there are a lot more people like you at Harvard than you think, eliana, and probably almost all of them share the same concerns. Maybe YOU should start the blog. Because it would be a big help to you to talk to some seniors and recent grads about what they are doing. And you could put yourself in a position to help out kids like you in future classes.</p>

<p>Dwight and JHS have given you excellent advice, and I will just add my two cents. Just follow your passion and things will work out for you. There are plenty academic positions in social sciences and there are also plenty non-profit organizations to work for.</p>

<p>JHS, why do you say that " your major doesn’t matter that much"? This is one of the most important things for a college student to decide. To the OP, the fact that you say you’re good at applied math screams computer science to me. Computer science has good employment prospects and very good career advancement prospects. Furthermore, the application of computer science to biological studies (bioinformatics) is open too if you’re interested. Don’t make the mistake of randomly choosing a unknown major. Sure, the Harvard name will open doors but that will not make any difference if you choose a wrong major.</p>

<p>@Orbit196: There is no finance major @Harvard. </p>

<p>@eliana: I don’t have much to add to what JHS and DwightEisenhower wrote, but if it’s any comfort to you, I have plenty of friends who graduated with less obviously practical concentrations such as government, history of science, and neurobio doing everything from advertising, venture capital and working at consulting firms to startups, business school and law school. In fact, a decent percentage are doing something which has nothing to do with their concentrations. </p>

<p>If you want to do Social Studies, go ahead! It’s a rigorous concentration, and if you’re worried about having practical skills, take some additional higher-level statistics courses, which would be useful in the social sciences anyway. And if you’re interested in the humanities, do a secondary. Or not and just take a bunch of electives in subjects you’re interested in.</p>

<p>As for ‘wrong majors’–Harvard might be one of the few places where this is less of an issue. Not a non-issue for sure, but definitely less of an issue.</p>

<p>Addendum: For what it’s worth, a friend who is doing VC work but studied gov is now learning coding on his own and is contemplating taking some comp sci courses because he realizes it’ll be useful for work, at least tangentially. On the other hand, another friend who graduated with a comp sci degree is now studying orchestral conducting @ Juilliard. Life is not an unchanging, unidirectional path. Do learn and pick up useful tools and skills, but don’t do everything/stuff based on fear and worry.</p>

<p>Eliana, your post skirted the central questions: what do you want to do? what would you like to contribute? who do you want to be? Your major may, or may not, make a difference, depending on how you answer those questions.</p>

<p>As an Ivy grad (two degrees from Yale to be exact) from a poor family, I’m convinced that a good route to an unhappy life is to choose something you’re not excited about because the $ might be better. Mabe that would make sense if you were middle-aged with three kids to get through college. But, you’re a Harvard sophomore! Trust me, you’ll have opportunities when you graduate. But, it would be an excellent idea to figure out before then what opportunities would really appeal to you. </p>

<p>It’s not original advice, but it’s basically what Harvard is telling you: do what you love – the money will follow.</p>

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<p>Last time I checked, students in social science majors like anthropology earned more after graduation than biology majors ;). </p>

<p>Anyway, there’s not much I can add to the discussion other than to let you know that I was in the exact situation thinking about the exact same things a few months ago. But it’s not like Harvard actually gives us many choices of “useful/practical” concentrations, does it? So I thought I might as well just pick a concentration that has the courses I want to take, and see how things go from there.</p>

<p>Some interesting reads:
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1155657-how-did-you-your-children-decide-what-major.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1155657-how-did-you-your-children-decide-what-major.html&lt;/a&gt;
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1019481-student-invading-parents-forum.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1019481-student-invading-parents-forum.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

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<p>What concentration is that? Just curious :)</p>

<p>Something in the life sciences :). I PMed you.</p>

<p>Wow, everyone, thank you so, so much for all the fantastic advice! I loved reading your comments. It’s so wonderful of all of you to take the time to reply, and you’ve all made me feel a lot better.</p>

<p>Good question, Opensecret–if only I knew what I wanted to become! Something useful. Helpful. Something that exercises my intellect. If I’m lucky, something that will affect positive change. It would be great if I could use my love to use my love of languages and of the world in my career, though I do need to be pragmatic and honest with myself.</p>

<p>It sounds like the best thing for me to do is to compromise–I can take some courses in ec and applied math and maybe even get a secondary in mathematical sciences.</p>