<p>I sent you a PM, but the next step is to have his SAT scores and transcript sent to the coaches ASAP. They will run his numbers by admissions to see if he is in the ballpark before they extend an invitation for an official visit in the fall. The prime recruiting time for crew is July and August before senior year. By September most coaches have their recruiting lists finalized.</p>
<p>Thanks Opie,
You wrote: "We're all just one injury away from watching our favorite sport rather than playing."</p>
<p>Amen to that. One of the very interesting things about rowing is that it often attracts kids, like my son, who were not athletic growing up. He played the clarinet in a jazz band from 4th grade on and was never particularly interested in, or much good at, sports. And then he found crew in 9th grade and he has just blossomed into an amazing athlete. Sadly, he gave up the clarinet but something had to give! Anyway, your son's story will be a good one to share with him because, unlike before he started crew, he now sees himself as an athlete and I think could imagine picking up another sport if, heaven forfend, something made it impossible for him to do crew.</p>
<p>Bay, you are right that he might not be happy on a D3 team. The boy really wants to row in the big time. Thanks very much for the reminder that our job is to protect his interests. I can do that!</p>
<p>Thank you Cookiemom. We have sent transcripts and PSAT scores (hasn't taken the SAT yet) to the coaches already - I was kind of hoping that the fact that they are all still emailing him meant he was in the ballpark stat-wise but perhaps that is premature of me. Great advice re July and August - I guess this means they have to be ready to go with at least a couple applications by the beginning of September. Is that right?</p>
<p>I agree that it sounds like your son really wants to row in D1. And it sounds as though his academic ability will be a good fit for an Ivy team. Like you said, there are no athletic scholarships in the Ivy League, but the upside of that is if for some reason you son in unable to compete, or decides not to compete, his financial situation will not suffer by losing an athletic scholarship.</p>
<p>As to having apps ready by Sept., some of the Ivy schools are EA, some ED, some have no early application option at all (Princeton and Harvard), so you need to think about that. If you son has a clear favorite, and you can get a clear understanding from the school as to the financial details, then he can apply to one school ED in the fall. If he wants to keep his options open he can still apply early in EA, and also hold out for RD applications to Princeton and Harvard -- that way, he can see how it all shakes out.</p>
<p>For "safeties" you can apply to some good D3 teams, but also some great D1 teams that are just a hair less difficult to get in academically. I have a feeling your son will have as many wonderful choices as he needs or wants. :)</p>
<p>Excellent advice, 'rentof2 especially about the "great D1 teams that are just a hair less difficult to get in academically" - he should definitely be thinking of them too. </p>
<p>This whole process feels a bit like being asked to jump into a Scottish reel without ever learning the steps. I appreciate all or you CC pros' efforts to coach ME in the intricacies of it all.</p>
<p>The visit part gets tricky because NCAA says the kids can't be brought to the campuses at the college's expense until after the first day of their senior year. This means visits will be compressed into Sept and Oct. YOU can pay for visits any time between now and then, if it is important to you and your child to visit the school, meet the coach, and some of the athletes. We were glad we'd done some of the visits on our own, and used the fall visits for the top few choices.</p>
<p>Oops, just realized I hadn't responded to riverrunner's post about her daughter's experience. Oh, in my dreams, my son will get an offer from his true love. But in the meantime, what you say about the D3 schools waiting to see who gets taken off the dance floor early makes a lot of sense. In a way, their dance just gets going in December, after the big D1 and Ivies have gone home. Thanks!</p>
<p>Thanks Runners2. The consensus seems to be that he would be in the running academically for the most selective schools so long as he is applying as an athlete/scholar. In terms of his rowing, he seems to be right where he "should" be for the Spring of his junior year. That said, he still has to get his times down a bit by the fall.</p>
<p>And yes, riverrunner, we are planning to pay for a series of visits as soon as the crew season is over and school is out. If we can follow your plan, and use the fall visits for the top choices, that would be ideal. Thanks again!</p>
<p>Seems you've already gotten some great advice, but here's my two cents, having just gone through the process with my D. Although her sport is track, crew may be similar. It does make sense to try to help your student-athlete manage this complex process, as it can get very intense in the fall.</p>
<p>Coaches have different styles. My D has strong academics and athletics and was heavily recruited by Ivies as well as other D-1s and a few D-3s (though they sensed they were at a disadvantage). However, some coaches were more proactive than others. This was baffling at first since some weaker programs showed less enthusiasm than strong programs. In retrospect, I believe this had more to do with style than actual interest. Unfortunately, there's a learning curve -- and the coaches are savvy Bear in mind that they have a difficult task -- and have an interest in keeping all prospects in the queue. Silence is less significant now than it would be in the fall when they want to lock in top recruits.</p>
<p>Ultimately, we found that team spirit and coach are very important, but most important is finding the right fit academically and socially. That may not become apparent until the official visit, which is usually late in the game. My advice is to select 5 or 6 schools of particular interest, visit unofficially and meet the coach (if you can) by early summer. For D-1 (including Ivies), July 1 is the date they'll contact their top prospects. It makes sense to be on their radar by then. </p>
<p>I definitely recommend your S having a couple of applications more or less ready by September. In my D's case, at least one school wanted the application then, and others (including Ivies without ED or EA) weren't about to be left in the dust. Most coaches are willing to discuss prospects candidly -- and I wouldn't hesitate asking questions. In my D's case, it all became clear down the stretch, and thankfully it worked out. You're asking all the right questions.</p>
<p>Just keep in mind that Men's Crew is NOT an NCAA sport, so NCAA rules do not apply. It's governed by the Intercollegiate Rowing Association that has been around long before there was an NCAA.</p>
<p>Another thing I learned is that certain sports have a much easier time finding strong athletes who are also very strong academically. Crew, cross country, swimming, and some others just seem to be sports that have a lot of academically high-achieving kids involved. Others, especially football and hockey, are more pressed to find strong players who are competitive academically with the non-athlete applicants. That creates a situation where it's more likely for a football or hockey player to get admitted with sub-standard grades and test scores, then an athlete from a sport that is rich with top students.</p>
<p>So crew can be a great wedge for a great student, but probably not as much a wedge for a strong, but somewhat less-great student. Sometimes it's even worse than that; we have a friend who is a top rower -- competed on a national level more than once -- who is a National Merit something-or-other, perfect GPA, 2300+ SAT, and she was flown out to visit some Ivys, but got deferred from one she applied to. She subsequently got into another super-selective top ranked D1 school, which is where she really wanted to go anyway, so it all worked out. But even for the very best, it can be very competitive in that particular sport as well as a few others.</p>
<p>On the other hand, I think if you have interest coming from BU and Northeastern already, while I'd hesitate to call them safeties, they are probably strong possibilities. It seems to me like you're covering your bases pretty well.</p>
<p>Christcorp does not understand the situation at many highly selective D3 schools. Having gone through the process, I know as a matter of fact that athletes is some sports are admitted at the most highly selective D3 schools in the country with academic records that would not even be considered to be in the ballpark for nonathletes. That having been said, the amount of influence that a coach has varies greatly from sport to sport and substantially from school to school.</p>
<p>Best advice that I can give: have S make a list of school in which he has particular interest and then have him call the coaches at those school to show his interest.</p>
<p>EMM1, I do understand how it works. But we are talking generalities. I never speak in the definitive. Nothing is that black and white. But, generally speaking, D3 schools concentrate more on academics than they do athletics. D3 schools don't offer athletic scholarships. D3 primarily are private and/or religious schools. (Not all, just the majority). As such, the athletes need to be able to get into the school based on their academic achievements.</p>
<p>Now, does that mean that there aren't ways around the academic requirements? Of course not. There's always ways around any policy or standard. I was only mentioning what it's suppose to be. There are plenty of ways to get an athlete in when their academics aren't up to par. Diversity is the most popularly used method. Every school uses that to their advantage. It could be race, sex, national origin, state of residency, etc... When my son spoke with certain prestigious schools, he asked about their "Acceptance" rate. Trying to judge his chances. The counselor explained their acceptance policy. They did mention, and I quote: "You do have a little better chance because you're from Wyoming". In other words, they like to show students from every background imaginable. If a school doesn't have ANY students from a particular background, they use that to their advantage.</p>
<p>Sports are no difference. If they want an athlete bad enough, they can find a way in. There are however certain standards. Even with D1, D2, D3, and NAIA schools. Our high school graduated one of the best basketball players in the entire country. Just about every school wanted him. He is at a very prestigious D1 school and is a starter as a freshman. They did however require him to get his SAT/ACT/gpa high enough to get into the school. Not that he was a failing student, just that the school had their requirements. There are limits to how much fudging they can do. This is with one of the BEST athletes in the entire country. The only difference with D3 is that they don't give Athletic Scholarships. But there most definitely are ways to get them into the school, assuming they meet some basic entry requirements. Again, that is unique to each school. Some may not care, but most do have minimum entry requirements. My example of our schools national superstar is a prime example. The school could have found a way to waiver his SAT/ACT and GPA, but they didn't. If he didn't bring up the scores, he wasn't going to school there. Again, he was one of the best and that was that school's policy. Every situation is different.</p>
<p>A DIII coach for a highly selective LAC explained it to me this way:</p>
<p>Recruits are evaluated by admissions and given an academic score, lets say a 1, 2 or 3. 1's are kids who would be candidates for admission WITHOUT their athletic ability. 2's are on the bubble and 3's wouldn't be admitted. Coach can submit his list of favorites. All 1's are likely to be admitted, a couple of 2's and ONE 1, who would be considered a "developmental admit." Coach would have to decide how to use up his 2 and 3 ranked choices for the final roster he sends to admissions. </p>
<p>This is for a non-revenue sport like track, XC, etc. (maybe crew?), where there are about 5 new recruits per year. I don't know if this is a global practice among LAC's.</p>
<p>'rentof2, I have heard that crew attracts good students - I think that is partly due to the fact that no one is in crew for the pot of gold that sits at the end of the the football, basketball, or soccer rainbows. </p>
<p>Sheesh, that story about your friend is scary - a good story to tell my son to keep him from getting too big in his britches. Talk from the coaches, no matter how sweet, is awfully cheap.</p>
<p>riverrunner, that makes great sense. Crew is definitely not a revenue sport, though because of its long intercollegiate history, I think it has a very particular kind of prestige for some colleges. The information about the academic score and the coach's list is another great nugget to give to my S. He is not really in control of where he is on any coach's list, but he is definitely in control of his academic score.</p>
<p>Cookiemom, I know that the sport is not covered by the NCAA, but am unclear on how that impacts the recruiting process. Does that mean he doesn't need to register with the NCAA? Coach's definitely refer to the NCAA as in "NCAA rules mean we can say no more than "hi" at this time in person" so that is a tad confusing...</p>
<p>Christcorp:</p>
<p>First, one cannot generalize about D3 schools, even highly selective D3 schools. Do the latter have minimum academic standards than NCAA minima? Sure, but that is true about even some D1 schools (Stanford stands out particularly in that regard). </p>
<p>At some highly selective D3 schools (Caltech) coaches have no pull. But at (for example) the high NESCACs (Williams, Amherst, Wesleyan, Middlebury, Bowdoin etc.) otherwise unexceptional white kids from eastern metropolitan areas who are athletes are admitted with academic records that are very substantially weaker than those of any white nonathlete whose family has not given a whole lot of money to the school.</p>
<p>While I am most familiar with a child who was a coach's top priority, my sense is that the "bubble" to which riverrunner refers gets substantially larger for athletes in some sports (i.e., an athlete who otherwise would have had only a 10% chance of being admitted is considered one who "may" have been admitted w/o athletics.</p>