math sat question

Test Preparation
1

<p>I am a parent of 2 sons, one starting at UVA this fall, and the other a rising junior in HS. Both of them complained about the math SAT being material that they learned in 8th and 9th grades, and they couldn't remember some of it. The older son scored 720, and the younger 680 in their best attempts. Both made A's in AP calculus A/B and B/C. The younger son has scored a 5 on the AP Calculus B/C exam. </p>

<p>Is it typical to score that low on the math SAT when you do that well in calculus, etc?</p>

<p>Lesson learned, probably, is that they should have done some prep work. To me it's odd that the test is stuff that the math oriented kids learn in 8th grade.</p>

2

<p>SAT math is basically algebra, geometry, and now, with the new test, some trig. 720 and 680 are not low scores. For the ivies and other highly ranked colleges the 680 is low and the 720 is close to average, but for 96% of all colleges, those scores are on the high end. That you have one in UVa seems to indicate that the score no longer matters -- i.e., its only purpose is to help get into college. The other is a rising "junior" which seems to indicate it will be taken again toward end of junior year and thus there is still time for prep. Prep helps, partly for the reason you state -- to work on recall of math learned a couple years ago. The SAT is a test designed for use by all colleges and students applying to them and is not designed to see who took calculus or who the math wizards are.</p>

3

<p>Taking the SAT too long after taking basic courses like algebra/geometry isn't a plausible excuse for a low score. The math portion tests very basic skills and, more importantly, problem solving. The only trig one has to know is basic 45 45 triangles and 30 60 triangles which are given to you in the info chart at the beginning of the section. Problem solving/critical thinking are tested more than what you remember from 9th grade geometry</p>

4

<p>I trust you, Boridi, but I am just perplexed that you can ace the AP calculus classes and the B/C exam and not get a very high score on the SAT. I think it's just a matter of refreshing yourself before the test, which my kids were too lazy to do.</p>

5

<p>
[quote]
I trust you, Boridi, but I am just perplexed that you can ace the AP calculus classes and the B/C exam and not get a very high score on the SAT. I think it's just a matter of refreshing yourself before the test, which my kids were too lazy to do.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>The questions on the AP exams are more straightforward than the ones on the SAT (hence SAT I: Reasoning), which requires more "thought" or rather attention to detail.</p>

6

<p>I took AP calc BC this year (5) and i also took the SAT and SAT II math 2. i got an 800 on both. I think that if you have a solid background in math and a fundimental understanding of it, there is no reason to forget how to do easy stuff you learned a long time ago. Its not like you don't work with trig in calculus (related rates questions) or algebra (everything), etc.</p>

7

<p>I think that there are two very different approaches to math that can explain this dichotomy.</p>

<p>First off, a lot of schools (I know mine does) stress rote memorization and completion of exercises in their math classes. What I mean by that is, for example: here are two lines on a plane, here are two particular methods to find where these two lines intersect, solve these 8 different but very similar systems of equations. Now, people who do well on these are just good at following algorithms, and often they can get 100% and think "Wow I'm good at math!" Ok. That's one approach.</p>

<p>The other approach is far more organic and interesting. Instead of following algorithms to solve Exercises (which test one's ability to use a mathematical tool, say, intersecting lines or chain rule or taylor series), people learn math by understanding the fundamentals, the symmetry, elegance, and ... 'tricks' behind the math. These are the people who succeed on the SAT, because when you near the end of the test, quite a few problems require this kind of thinking (and remember, 2-4 problems is the difference between 720 and 800). When people approach math like this, not only do they not have to memorize anything (everything is UNDERSTOOD), they have the ability to learn more math with much more appreciation and depth of understanding.</p>

<p>Another thing about the SAT is you have to be extremely careful. More often times than not a question is deceptively simple. If your sons have 5s on AP Calc they might be deceived into thinking that the questions are all simple exercises (as opposed to problems, which require more creative and intuitive thought). Some are not. There are a few that catch people off guard. I recommend, after the first 7-10 problems, that you devote an entire minute to each problem. Even if you get it in 20 seconds, spend another 40 seconds reading each word twice. That'll help a lot.</p>

<p>Of course, there are only like ... 3-4 questions that really require this kind of thinking (it's still only the SAT), but this attention needs to go for every problem to go from a good score to a great score.</p>

<p>Btw 800 on both SAT Math and SAT II Math II and 5 on AP Calc BC</p>

<p>But can you tell not an 800 on writing? LoL.</p>

8

<p>Thanks for the advice, everyone!</p>

<p>I am going to try to get my younger son to take the SAT one more time this fall (his senior year). He has 700 CR, 750 Writing, and 680 Math so far. If he can get the math up just in the low 700's, it will help a lot, because he has real good scores on AP (5 on B/C Calc, 5 on French, and 5 on US History, and SAT II (800 on French, 770 on US Hist, and 740 on Math 2). The funny thing is, he is considered a math brain, but did better in the non-math stuff. I just wish he would do some prep work. I am willing to pay for the class if he will go.</p>

9

<p>Namtrag,
My S is in similar situation. Took SAT as part of talent search at age 11. Scored 560 math. Now rising junior. I figured SAT math would be at least 700 easily. However, highest practice test so far is 670. He also said that he didn't remember some of the stuff from 8th/9th grade. Gets A's in math courses and has always done well on standardized tests. Right now, he's doing better on the CR and writing sections. He just finished a prep course. Some of the practice tests at home haven't been under ideal circumstances (TV on , etc.). He did take ACT as soph and got 33 on math section with no prep. Has your son tried ACT? Also, is your son rising junior or rising senior? Wasn't sure from your posts. I'm going to encourage more prep (I know he still has a lot of time). However, unless PSAT scores are in national merit finalist range, I'll probably encourage him to stick with ACT</p>

10

<p>My son is a rising senior. I may have him take the ACT, don't know where it's offered in Virginia. I have never heard of anyone taking it in our circle of friends. We live in Norfolk-Va Beach area.</p>

<p>prefect, my son is the same weirdness. He got like a 2100 on his PSAT in 10th grade, did not retake it as a junior, so he is not eligible for Merit Scholar (I don't think). We were overjoyed because we always heard you supposedly go up 100-150 points on your SAT, but not my son.</p>