MBA questions

Parents Forum
1

<p>Since we have a very informative law school thread here, I'd like to start an MBA thread as well to clarify some hearsays and myths about attending an MBA program. Many CC posters here have had kids who had graduated from college a few years ago and are now contemplating grad schools, especially in business.</p>

<p>I'd like to hear from people who had gone through an MBA program to tell me if it's worth the $120K COA and of course not to mention the loss of two years' salary. Are name brand MBA schools as important as in law schools? Are post grad salaries higher if one attended a top 10, top 15, top 20 schools vs. the rest? Did having an MBA enhance your chances for promotion? MBA programs are known to be a good place for career switchers, do you agree?</p>

<p>Will you be as involved if your child is searching for an MBA program? Will you be a helicopter parent for grad schools?</p>

<p>Here's an interesting article
<a href="http://www.businessweek.com/bschools/content/apr2007/bs20070416_089164.htm?chan=bschools_bschool+index+page%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.businessweek.com/bschools/content/apr2007/bs20070416_089164.htm?chan=bschools_bschool+index+page&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

2

<p>Most people work a few years before going to business school. Depending on the job you get sometimes they will pay for/subsidize further education in business. However not so much a few years out of undergrad, more like several years into working for them and getting an executive MBA. Or becoming a certified financial planner, etc.</p>

3

<p>I got my MBA about 100 years ago from University of Washington. I went back after working for 2 years. It was well worth the time and money (no where near $120k, but maybe with inflation.....). My MBA played a part in getting every job I've had; it has opened many doors. More importantly the analytical skills I learned there are still useful to me and serve me well. A bigger named school would have made no difference in my career path, but regionally UW is a big name. Perhaps if I wanted to work in NYC or DC, Harvard or Georgetown degree would most likely have attracted more money. </p>

<p>My advice to potential MBAers - go to work for a two or three years first. Try to get some supervisory experience (so you know how not to do it). Go to a well known biz school near where you want to live. Ask what companies recruit there. Go full time, I'm not a big fan of MBA-Lite, I mean Executive MBA programs. Make use of their career centers before you graduate. Save your class notes and books - I still use them 100 years later.......</p>

<p>Will I be a helicopter parent for grad school? Probably, why stop torturing kid now?</p>

4

<br>


<br>

<p>Not as much (I'm sure)! But D knows where to come for info now...she asked me to check CC to see which GRE prep book everyone was advising as the best.</p>

<p>(Answer: Barron's, hands down.)</p>

5

<p>You need the GMAT for b-school, not the GRE.</p>

<p>Skiers-mom is 100% right in every respect. Me too. Etc. +1</p>

<p>The biggest difference for me between my BA and my MBA is that I learned specific skills that I use all the time in b-school, while my BA was more about developing critical and analytical skills. If you want to make a career in business, and don't know quite how to go about it after a couple/three years of full-time work experience, go back to school full time and get a regular MBA. I doubt you'll be sorry.</p>

<p>My MBA is from the University of California, which charged less than $700 per year in tuition back in the Pleistocene.</p>

<p>Regional reputation is powerful in business schools. I'd rather have a degree from the UW than Duke or UCLA living here. In SoCal, I'd rather have a degree from UCI, UCLA, or USC than the UW or Columbia. Lots of working alumni in the area can outweigh the "prestige" of a bigger-name school.</p>

6

<p>This is an interesting question, and one that was discussed even in MBA classes when I attended Chicago some years back.</p>

<p>To answer the OP's question, one needs to parse the issue a bit more:</p>

<ul>
<li> National school? Regional School? or local no name?</li>
<li> full or part time?</li>
<li> skills or credential?</li>
</ul>

<p>For some folks, the goal of an MBA is to have a credential. For others, it is to gain a new skill. For some (few, I suspect, though) it is to get both.</p>

<p>Graduates of Nationally known schools command a big premium in the workplace. The reason has been debated endlessly in academic circles, and seems to come down to credentialing by the admissions committees for the national MBA programs. In other words, HR departments delegate a screening function to these schools (pretty theoretical and academic an explanation? Maybe, but...)</p>

<p>As others noted, gradss of schools with a strong regional reputation will face good local job prospects, but will probably not draw a huge salary premium. No 150,000 first year salaries, in other words. But one gets a good launch on a new career direction.</p>

<p>Schools with no real name recognition can teach a set of new skills that the grad may or may not be able to put to use, but that grad is unlikely to find much if any salary boost just because of the degree. Of course, if the person successfully uses the new skills, the degree can be of immense value.</p>

<p>My own bias is that the only programs worth going to full time are the nationally ranked programs. Perhaps if one can get a good deal at a strong regionallly recognized program, full time could be an option but be wary. Otherwise, go part time to whatever works and fits the best. The ROI for a full time program, especially when you factor in the lost income, is iffy at best.</p>

<p>One final comment is that the nature of MBA programs varies widely. Some are completely practical, taught by part time faculty with loads of business experience. Some are quite theoretical, taught by true academics. Some are truly terrible, taught by folks that have little qualification for what they are doing. So buyer beware.</p>

7

<p>Also depends on what field you want to work in. If you have an undergrad degree in Comp Lit and want to work in HR, then pretty much any MBA can teach you "stuff" and give you a leverageable credential for a Fortune 1000 entry level HR job. Local is fine; night school is fine. Nationally ranked school is better, but if you mine the local school's alumni network you'll probably get yourself launched adequately.</p>

<p>If you want to work in a top tier investment bank or consulting firm, you need good (great) grades from a top MBA program. If you want Brand Management at a top tier consumer products company, you can take the long route and start in sales, or the short-cut and get an MBA from a nationally ranked program or strong regional program. Night school probably won't do much for you other than give you another line on the resume.</p>

<p>I would never suggest that investing in human capital is a bad idea or a bad investment, but it is fallacious to assume that an MBA from a program nobody has heard of is going to do for you what you read about in the WSJ. The bidding wars that break out between Hedge Funds or Private Equity funds for brand new associates just graduating from HBS or Wharton don't apply to you if you're finishing your MBA at University of New Haven. Not to say you shouldn't do the program at New Haven if you want to learn the subject matter.... but it won't have the kind of career leverage you might be hoping for.</p>

<p>My personal POV is that if you're deciding between full freight at Wharton and low or no cost at no-name school, take the loans and go to Wharton. It can pay out in 3-4 years just in short term salary differential and opportunity. If you're deciding between two more comparable situations (full freight at Fordham or full ride at Baruch) then it will depend on what your career aspirations are, and how realistic you're prepared to be in terms of time to pay off the difference.</p>

8

<p>I posted earlier under "Hi Moderator!" that it may be useful to have a Parent Forum for Grad school, post Graduate studies etc. So if you think it's a good idea, you may want your Voice heard by the Moderator too- so post your request for this forum under thread called Hi Moderator
My kid is looking at Law Schools. We'll never get it if we don't ask for it.
Thanks
Marny</p>

9

<p>Blossom, </p>

<p>What you said is all true and excellent advice, except for the Wharton part!</p>

<p>Most kids from even the Whartons and Harvards do not end up in private equity or consulting (and some would argue that the HOURLY rate in those fields is not so great anyway...), but in more traditional MBA jobs in finance and marketing. They pay well, but not so stellarly, such that the opportunity cost of two years of lost wages (not to mention experience) can be difficult to make up on an ROI basis. And those loans are tough to pay off. I know from experience.</p>

<p>So some win big. Some break even, and some lose. </p>

<p>But, I suppose the main reason one goes to a Wharton is not just one of $$.</p>

10

<p>Another Pleistocene era MBA here. From a "nationally ranked" school in my case. It opened doors, no doubt. Most lasting value to me, though, now that I am finished needing to open doors, are three of the "off beat" elective courses I took: Creativity in Business, Interpersonal Dynamics (which we called Touchy-Feely) and Negotiation. All three have served me deeply in every aspect of my life. </p>

<p>Not what I thought I was spending the big bucks for (well, they were big bucks for the time) and, in particular the foregone wages for 2 years as I already had a moderately high level career. But worth it for sure.</p>

11

<p>For those who went through MBA programs, did you get your first post grad job through the career office? through networking?</p>

12

<p>I got my first post-MBA job through networking with someone I met at b-school.</p>

<p>By the way, Blossum,
[quote]
If you have an undergrad degree in Comp Lit and want to work in HR

[/quote]
-- how did you guess my background?? That's exactly my undergrad major, and was exactly my career interest when I went to b-school. But I did go to a nationally recognized b-school and think it made a huge difference in having great companies offer me jobs.</p>

13

<p>I got my first post-MBA job through career center. All jobs since have been network-network-network. Most of those contacts were from non-profit boards I have served on.</p>

14

<p>Remember that most B-schools have a relationship with the business community. My first post-MBA job was with Andersen Consulting (now Accenture), which both recruited on campus and sponsored a variety of other activities. I showed up for everything that included Andersen, and I met anyone I could before recruiting started. By the time I formally interviewed I understood their business, their structure, and knew half the people on the recruiting team.</p>

<p>Since then, I've had one job through an Internet job placement (my current position as it turns out) and everything else was through networking.</p>

15

<p>cbreeze-- networking and career office can be one and the same at many schools. The career office of many B-schools maintain a database of alums who are willing and interested in providing information about their company, discipline, career paths, or whatever. While these conversations are usually not interviews, it is not uncommon for the alum to pass the resume on to someone in recruiting, or for a job to materialize out of an informational meeting. So while these contacts require a tiny bit more effort than the traditional "show up and smile" interviews through the career center, they don't actually require much int he way of initiative.... the alum signs up, the student sends an email. It's not like cold-calling!</p>

16

<p>First job was networking; definitely B-school related. The Chairman of the Board of the company I went to was also a member of the Board of Advisors of my B-school. This was in an industry where few MBA's go (ie, not investment banking or consulting) and I think he liked that an MBA was interested in his company.</p>

<p>Second job, networking. All other jobs (as well as positions on non-profit Boards etc): networking.</p>

17

<p>Changing the subject slightly......is getting a MBA with a specialized concentration a good idea? For example, one can get a MBA with concentration in Information Systems, International Business, Health Organization, Entrepreneurship, etc. There are probably pros and cons. It may help getting the dream job, but it may also narrow job opportunities. More pros than cons? Or the other way around?</p>

18

<p>I don't know. When I was at Stanford ( a 100,000 years ago ;)), they did not allow concentrations. Everyone attained an MBA. Period. Obviously, you could go heavy in some areas of interest, but your degree would in no way reflect that. </p>

<p>I think, if it were me, I would still prefer that route. You can feature your specialty interests on your resume by highlighting coursework, projects, research, experience in those sub-fields without having your educational credential permanently limited. Gives you the opportunity to focus your resume to reflect changing interests and different job opportunities you wish to pursue. Just one opinion based on limited experience.</p>

19

<p>Thanks, jmmom. Sounds reasonable to me. Along the same line, I suppose one can feature the MBA with specialty or just emphasize only on the MBA, depending on the type of job pursuing.</p>

20

<p>Right. I was thinking that too. But if your school is known to offer sub-specialty degrees, you might be asked which one you got. If you decide to go into finance later on, and your subspecialty was marketing management or whatever, that might limit you. I'm sure there's always a work-around.</p>