<p>Hi, I am currently a 2nd year about to apply to McIntire and am pretty nervous about it. I am wondering how much of a chance I will have getting in first round (March) with a 3.7 GPA? There was a post last year after admissions came out for the class of 2015 that stated the first round acceptance GPA and deferred students GPA's, however I cannot find it anymore. Does anyone remember what the numbers were/where the post is?</p>
<p>Also, I was wondering if there were any third years or anyone here that is currently in the school that went through this process almost exactly a year ago that could give insights/tips/things they would have done differently for their application?</p>
<p>This isn’t really something anyone here can answer. McIntire has stats on their admission website, but the only way to know for sure is to apply.</p>
<p>Gouvawahoowa: please take this in the contructive spirit intended (and it applies to many other posters besides you), but it is somewhat off-putting when students fret when they have outstanding grades and scores and are looking for reassurance. My daughter came to UVA to pursue a business degree, and it is almost certain that she will not be accepted into McIntire due to her GPA. She was accepted into Va Tech’s honors program and business school, and is now second guessing her decision to come to UVA. So please think of others when you fret about your 3.7 GPA.</p>
<p>I remember the first round average GPA being low or mid 3.7X. The post was on the McIntire blog, which can be found as a link on the Comm school’s main website.</p>
<p>I am a third-year in the Comm school. If you send me a message I would be happy to answer your questions.</p>
<p>While I would congratulate anyone with a solid GPA (3.3+) , I would only classify a 3.9+ as outstanding. Since most people I know in the Comm School have a GPA in the 3.7 range.</p>
<p>Yes, a 3.9 is the level of outstanding at McIntire. </p>
<p>And, yes, a student with a 3.7 does fret over getting into McIntire first-round, so please give them the respect of understanding their anxiety of the process as well. </p>
<p>You had posted, a long time ago, about this when she was deciding on which school to consider, VT, UVa, WFU. Many of us gave you advice on this one, including myself. McIntire is highly competitive and if students are not strong in math it is a difficult path. You may want to advise your daughter to also submit applications to other schools as a transfer. Or you can have her look at other majors, i.e. Economic, Foreign Affairs, Etc. As I have suggested on CC to other students, find great internships, take courses in the COMM school that allow A&S students to enroll, keep your GPA up and stay active in clubs and leadership roles that you enjoy. It all works out for everyone. She can even apply for the McIntire MS program if she so desires in a couple of years if she wants the business degree. </p>
<p>My best to her and all the other students that are applying to McIntire.</p>
<p>You make an excellent point, and I should not have been so flippant in my previous response - I apologize. I believe, however, that the Comm school should probably be a bit more frank with incoming freshman, although their website has EXCELLENT data and very good information. Nonetheless, it does seem to stress the whole person concept, and that GPA is but one component. I would suggest that the Com school stress that X% of applicants are not granted admission, which means that those students have to pick a different major. I know that sounds ridiculously obvious, but I think that there are a good number of kids who may have made a different choice if they were more aware. At the comm session for admitted students, the panel was bombarded with questions that revolved around admission to the comm school - nothing else…they were generally deflected with “just do your best”. I think they more honest answer would be, “you must realize that a significant percentage of applicants are rejected…and that the average GPA of admitted students is well above the UVA norm.” I know I am beating a dead horse…thanks for your indulgence.</p>
<p>They do read holistically, and want students that have other activities and credentials beyond a GPA. (It has been known that they have rejected 3.9 students due to no other activities aside form academics.) Most students considering McIntire start to self-select out of the process over the first year and a half. Please note that I agree with you, many students are not aware of how competitive the process is to get in. However, the competition is across the board-meaning activities, leadership, GPA, rigor of courses is all considered. Students do not realize how math intensive most of the prerequisites can be. McIntire wants students, even those looking to concentrate in marketing, to know and understand all facets of the business sector. </p>
<p>With all that said, they do consider students with lower GPA’s if everything else is in place. If your D has done her best and feels she is a good fit then she may not get in first round, but possibly for the second one. </p>
<p>However, if she doesn’t and really really wants to do business, I reiterate, she should ALSO do the following:
Apply to other schools as a transfer for their business program. JMU is ranked higher than Pamplin (VT). Wake Forest is also still a good option, but look at other schools too. Just as a backup. Not saying she has to go to any she gets into, but if she doesn’t get into McIntire then at least she will have options. Transfer deadlines are usually March 1st. I love UVa because I still believe you can do what you want if you find alternative ways to get there. Which brings me to my next points. </p>
<ol>
<li><p>Start looking for a good business internship for the summer while she is home over winter break. Even if she does or does not get in she needs to start building her resume in the area she has an interest. </p></li>
<li><p>Get involved at UVa to gain life skills. Have leadership roles, join clubs or activities she really has an interest in pursuing.I’m sure she is already involved, but take it to the next level. </p></li>
<li><p>Start looking for an alternate major now if she has not already done so. You have to declare during 2nd semester 2nd year. Too many students get themselves on one track and do not look for alternatives. Have her look at her Spring courses as well as the prerequisites for other majors and be sure she has a plan in place. </p></li>
</ol>
<p>Sorry this is so simplified, but to take the time to give you paragraphs on each of these is not something I have right now. </p>
<p>I know you want what is best for her. I am a firm believer that everyone finds their path regardless of the disappoints or obstacles that are placed before us. It truly will all work out, but planning, hard work and following your interest all need to be a part of it too. I’m sure you have given her great advice along the way. And I know all of this can be frustrating, but sometimes our role is to listen and not to try to fix things for our children. Showing them how to deal with life optimistically and realistically is my motto. </p>
<p>I hope you have a wonderful winter break with your D!</p>
<p>…Woosah - one thing I forgot to ask…has UVA/McIntire ever considered a direct application process for incoming freshman such as at Wharton undergrad? That would eliminate the issue I am raising in that you would know right off the bat if you were in or not. Wake handles things in a similar way to UVA, but it is clear that they “work” with you if you are not admitted initially…they want you to get in if feasible. Thanks!</p>
<p>I imagine that the Comm School likes the current system because it motivates first and second year students to work hard, and because they get students who have proven they can do extremely well in college level work.</p>
<p>UVa may lose some students who want assurance they will be able to graduate with a business degree. Those students may choose to attend business programs that admit students directly from high school, such as Penn and Villanova. Villanova is one of the colleges where it is much harder to be admitted to the university if you apply to be a business major.</p>
<p>Some other colleges offer admittance guarantees for some programs for students in their honors program, assuming that the students maintain a certain minimum GPA. That type of policy change could potentially be instituted with Echols. However, under the current system, that would mean there would be fewer spots for non-Echols students in the Comm School.</p>
<p>Another option would be to expand the Comm School to meet more of the demand. Alternatively, the College of A&S could offer more business courses as part of an Economics Degree to meet some of the demand.</p>
<p>I can understand that they don’t want to dilute their talent pool by expanding the program as they have achieved such an excellent reputation…I just think the Wharton model is a better way to go. It is very tough for a high achieving high schooler with a strong desire to pursue a business degree, even when presented with the cold hard facts, to decide not to go to a school like UVA because of the possibility of not getting accepted to the Comm school - even though that may have been the right decision. I am thinking of how Va Tech handles incoming engineers - you may be denied admission to the engineering program, but you maybe be admitted into the college instead. Then you can decide if you want to go or not. That is not a perfect analogy because at Va Tech you still have a reasonable path to get into the engineering program even if you are not directly admitted…but you get the idea. Since it is around a 40% rejection rate - I think that is significant enough to require more “straight talk” during the admissions process. </p>
<p>Another option would to allow a minor in Commerce…but again I think it is (rightly so) a prestige/dilution issue.</p>
<p>Wonder if Dean J has an (official) opinion on this topic? Thanks!</p>
<p>Above, I described the alternative model for Villanova’s business program. Their program of direct entry from high school has a major disadvantage - a student in arts and sciences has almost no chance of getting into the business program if they did not get accepted as a freshman. At least in UVa’s system, a college student has a fair chance of competing for the seats in the business program – after that student has completed a range of college level work and has had more time to think through their interests and abilities. It is really hard to make a major career choice as a 17 year old.</p>
<p>That is why students need to be aware of the perimeters, and level of admittance to programs prior to making a decision as to where to apply and attend. </p>
<p>Remember there are too many variables across the board to really be able to do an apples to apples comparison on this topic, i.e. rank of program, foundation of program (liberal arts or solely business), recruiting, rank of college, opportunities available. Every good business program has their own niche. </p>
<p>It is all about fit. Those students looking to study one set field truly need to look at not only fit of college, but fit of program. </p>
<p>UVa does allow students to take business courses that can give a student the foundation needed. You need economics, statistics, accounting, ethics, public speaking, and business law to name a good core. All courses a student not in McIntire can take. Intertwine these with internships, activities, study abroad programs possibly, and you can create your own foundation to enter the business sector. If you want marketing I would throw in psychology courses. Again, I could go on and on course wise to create a great path for a student pending on interest. You don’t need to say I have a business minor to achieve your goal. You can list relevant coursework on your resume. </p>
<p>So my opinion is that direct admit is great for the student that knows 100% what they want to do with their lives. However, I also believe one needs to have the opportunity to gain critical thinking and a knowledge of other subject areas to be truly successful in the business arena.</p>
<p>The “official” opinion on the topic should be evident on McIntire’s website. My personal opinion is that a foundation in the College is part of the reason our business graduates hit the ground running when they leave UVa.</p>
<p>Don’t underestimate the importance of writing and a broad-based education. There are certain things you learn in a liberal arts program that make you a whole person. </p>
<p>You will be crammed full of finance, marketing, and management principles at most business schools, but a strong liberal arts base can arm you with better skills than others with whom you’ll be competing later.</p>
<p>@EcholsWannabe - it won’t let me message you since I do not have more than 15 posts on here. Do you think there is another way I can contact you?</p>
<p>It’s interesting to read these comments and experiences. My D (OOS) is now at the critical decision time of deciding where she wants to enroll as a freshman. UVA was the only school she applied to that didn’t have a direct admission to the business school. Although she loves UVA, the McIntire uncertainty along with its added stress and anxiety(as if high school and college students aren’t already overly stressed), will most likely keep her from choosing UVA. If UVA McIntire was direct entry as a freshman, she would have already sent in her deposit. So it seems for now her short list is ND(Mendoza), Cornell(Dyson), WashU(Olin) and BC(Carroll). </p>
<p>I remember somebody noting that there are going to be less spots for McIntire for non-Echol Scholars. That just adds to my stress as an admitted student who did not receive the Echols Scholar. What is scary is that one of my friends who attends UVA as an Echol is having a hard time entering the business program as well. I love UVa and would really love to attend but all this uncertainty plus a huge price tag is pushing me away…</p>
<p>I can’t believe being a Echols Scholar even gets you more chances into the business program (and it does with priority registration and an intense educational environment of other Echols)</p>
<p>Please note that I was just saying that one alternative HYPOTHETICAL approach would be to offer some preference to Echols scholars in admission to the Comm School. I don’t believe that currently exists. We were just talking about alternative ways of reducing uncertainty for top students considering whether to accept an offer of admission to UVa. There are OTHER universities that provide preference in admission to some competitive programs for students who are accepted into their honors programs, such as preference in getting admitted to 2-2 nursing programs. </p>