Mentoring Kids on COllege Process ?

Parents Forum
1

<p>Having struggled with the process of helping my first child apply to, and head off to, college, I'm left pondering the extreme difficulty underprivileged kids must have in navigating the process, and how many fall by the wayside because they simply don;t have the family resources (I'm talking non-financial resources) to start and complete this complex and bewildering process. </p>

<p>Have any of you parents taken on the role of mentor/assistant/coach with kids who might otherwise drown inthe detail and deadlines of the college process ? Now that I have this knowledge of the process, I'm pondering whether I can provide some life-altering assistance to kids who might otherwise fall through the cracks. </p>

<p>Please note your experiences, and any pitfalls you might have encountered as well.</p>

<p>Thanks.</p>

2

<p>I've done that by offering free workshops at the school that S used to attend (It had lots of low income students, and very overburdened GCs). I'd cover things like providing info about how they could qualify for merit aid. </p>

<p>Unfortunately, even though the workshop was on a Sat. or evening, most of the kids and parents who came were the middle and high income ones. No matter what I did, I found it very difficult to get the students who were first gen college, low income, and their parents to come to get the info. I hope you have better luck.</p>

3

<p>I did actually try once, but in the end the young man did better on his own. He is very strong in humanities, not so strong in math/science, so he was aiming at schools like Bard, but needed plenty of FA. He was admitted, but not offered the FA he needed and, I'm pretty sure, deserved. He's a URM and athlete, aside from having real writing talent. But as a friend, and respectful of his family's privacy, I couldn't very well demand their financial records. The young man filled out his FAFSA and Profile (I didn't ask to see them), and I didn't see his EFC. I just assumed all would be well because I knew he lived with a single parent, has sibs, family income is low, and the absent parent provides no support. When all the lovely acceptances came in, he got virtually no FA. So he went to the state uni and he's happy, and all's well that ends well.
BUT -- his little sister asked me for help this year, and I'm going to tactfully try to advise on FA without intruding on their privacy. Wish me luck.</p>

4

<p>It was actually disturbing to me, how some of D's friends last year who were decent students didn't have guidance/interest by their parents - parents who were professional working people!!!!</p>

<p>If they asked questions we helped, some asked my D to help review essays etc. so we did what we could, when we could without interferring with the family. </p>

<p>I actually find the whole college process SO interesting - even now that we are done for child #1. Guess that's why I (and you anyone?) spend so much time here...</p>

5

<p>I have volunteered in the College and Career center at our local high school since 2000, when my oldest D was a freshman in high school. I started then because I was decades away from my own college admissions process (which wasn't particularly evolved anyway) and wanted to see what the present day landscape looked like. I figured that I would learn a lot from the ladies staffing the Center and just by poking around in the corners for 3 years. </p>

<p>I still volunteer at the Center (D is a college senior now), not only because I have another D who is a high school junior, but because I want to share what knowledge I've accumulated through the years--out of the books and having seen 7 classes graduate. I think that the Center is under-utilized...the top of the class kids circa 2000 would gather around and talk about the college application process (a la CC)--I don't see that anymore. Most kids seem to believe that they know what they are doing and don't need your help--sometimes, unjustifiably--but you can't force a horse to drink.</p>

<p>The kids that I get to help the most are the kids whose parents know that I work in the college and career center (kids either from the neighborhood, the band, or from church). The parents either insist that the kids come see me or I answer questions the parents might have (sometimes, both). </p>

<p>We talk about testing (when to take the SATs, what SAT 2s to take, taking the ACT instead, importance of the PSAT if you have a shot at being NMF, SAT prep--please do it, taking the SAT more than once), the essays (good topics, bad topics, organization), GPA, course selection, how to get a recommendation, how to put together an application, etc. </p>

<p>We also talk about what colleges interest the kid and then look up info about the college in the College Board books. We also go through some scatterplots so that the kids can see a general idea where their GPA and scores fall in the spectrum of kids who are accepted to colleges. Kids appreciate the visual--and the scatterplots do a pretty good job in showing the kids that their chances at UCLA (for example) are very slim so don't fall in love with UCLA, but also show them that there are lots of colleges that would love to have them (a big ego boost).</p>

<p>The Center is lucky in that they have a person who comes in twice a week to help kids with the financial aid side of the equation. This person is paid by a grant and is there to help low income kids, but will help anyone who needs it. He's pretty knowledgeable about FAFSA, Pell grants, etc.</p>

6

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<p>I do have to echo this sentiment by NSM. Most of the kids I help are middle income kids (some are 1st generation though). We do have a rare low income URM in the top of the class, but the counselors handle these kids themselves with very good results. </p>

<p>I think a lot of the low income URM kids who aren't top of the class plan on going to community college or the state schools--which isn't a complicated process here in CA--and so therefore don't cross my path much.</p>

7

<p>A while back on CC I read about College Summit, which works with school districts, schools, and students to boost college enrollment among low-income students: <a href="http://www.collegesummit.org%5B/url%5D"&gt;www.collegesummit.org&lt;/a>. College Summit has sites in four states (CA, WV, SC, CO), St. Louis, and the Washington, DC, area. It sounds like a wonderful organization. </p>

<p>College Summit offers four-day summer workshops led by volunteers on college campuses: <a href="http://www.collegesummit.org/volunteer/%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.collegesummit.org/volunteer/&lt;/a> Sounds like a good way for CC parents to contribute what they've learned.</p>

8

<p>My kids went to school with lots of underprivileged kids. The ones who were top students would get some help from GCs, and lots of sitting-around-talking help from other top students -- the kind of thing ellenemope says doesn't happen any more at the school where she works, but was a daily part of my kids' lives. Sure, there were some FAFSA footfaults, or disappointing FA results, and maybe scholarship opportunities missed, but generally they come out fine and much-bescholarshipped. The less-top students tend to limit themselves to state schools (some of the top students do that, too) or community college, whose process is really not that hard to negotiate.</p>

9

<p>I have helped some very low income kids with various parts of the process, but none from beginning to end.</p>

<p>Here are a few of the difficulties:</p>

<ul>
<li><p>Inability to visit schools (unless they are very close) due to finances - and therefore, it makes it nearly impossible to think about how they could actually attend an out of town school.</p></li>
<li><p>Kids who have never even been across town and can not imagine going away to college. (Much less to some quaint, lily-white, quintessential college town.)</p></li>
<li><p>Kids who are (understandably) very frightened of attending a school where they are in an extreme minority situation.</p></li>
<li><p>Unwillingness of low income parents to fill out FAFSA. Some low income parents have a major reluctance to release information to the government (fearing it may compromise their social service benefits), some have child support issues, some are of questionable immigration status, some can't read and don't want to tell you that, English may not be their fluent language, credit/indebtedness problems, etc. </p></li>
<li><p>Parent who doesn't want child to attend college - this is, unfortunately, more common than you might think. In this case, they want/need the child earning money for the family, babysitting (very common for the girls), etc. The flip side to this is a huge sense of responsibility that many low income kids have to help support their families (and certainly to not be a financial burden to them).</p></li>
<li><p>Kids with decent grades from lousy schools, but very low standardized test scores because they simply have not mastered the subjects. Relative to other kids in their school, they are good students, but relative to the rest of the world it is a problem.</p></li>
<li><p>Families without internet access, email, a regularly connected phone number, a stable mailing address, etc. Makes it impossible for them to be part of the process. Not only that, but it makes it very hard to do the financial aid process for 4 years!</p></li>
<li><p>Criminal records.</p></li>
<li><p>Kids with parental responsibilities.</p></li>
</ul>

<p>Not to paint a dismal picture, but these are just a few of the problems we've had to deal with. Some colleges are very well equipped to deal with these common problems, but they are generally community colleges or state schools (and not necessarily "flagships"). And a few kids actually overcome all this stuff and get themselves where they want to be. (I am always pleasantly surprised at how many underprivileged kids are more resourceful than some, ahem, rather spoiled kids, like mine for instance.)</p>

10

<p>This is actually a really neat program, aimed at helping unprivileged (mainly rural) kids with the entire college process. I heard them speak at a conference, and it was the best idea I've heard of yet.</p>

<p>
[quote]
University of Virginia’s College Guide Program
Mark Caldwell and Lauren Ross – University of Virginia
The College Guides Program seeks to help more Virginia students attend college or other postsecondary training. Through a generous gift from the Jack Kent Cooke Foundation, recent U.Va. graduates will be able to serve as college guides in selected public secondary institutions throughout the Commonwealth. Guides will assist students with admission, financial aid, and scholarship applications.</p>

<p>About the Program:
In the fall of 2005, the University of Virginia launched the College Guide Program with the goal of increasing college enrollment numbers for high school students throughout the Commonwealth. Although 79% of Virginians ages 18-24 have high school diplomas, only 53% of Virginians attend college directly out of high school. To address the widening gap in college participation, the University of Virginia is placing recent graduates in public high schools throughout the Commonwealth to assist students with college admission, financial aid, and scholarship applications. Given their idealism and fresh perspective on the college experience, recent University graduates serve as perfect advocates for higher education. During the year, Guides spend forty hours a week working alongside guidance counselors —and in some cases in coordination with other access programs—to motivate and assist students through the college application process. College Guides act as mentors to students and create educational programming for the high school students and their families.

[/quote]
</p>

<p><a href="http://www.virginia.edu/cue/guide.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.virginia.edu/cue/guide.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

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<p>Good for those kids at your local high school, JHS!</p>

12

<p>I've mentored three boys into near-full college scholarships. </p>

<p>Confronted with a group of boys, I take every opportunity to rave about the residential college experience and consider myself part-mentor to another dozen boys (and one girl) who are now in college --or are headed to college. My mentees are nephews, friends of my son's, children's friends, neighbor's children, client's children. They are from various ethnic and economic backgrounds. A few have been from working lower classes though none have been desperately poor.</p>

<p>Once they are in, I make serious inquiries about their efforts. It's not enough to get a boy into college. He has to make it through the temptations of freshman year before a mentor can breathe easy.</p>

<p>Start openly championing the residential college experience and opportunities will arise, golf.</p>

13

<p>An interesting thread that speaks to some of my concerns.
Having parlayed some of my energies into getting D into school via the athletic route, and prepping S via the academic route, I find it facinating helping them to navigate the college prep experience. Being driven from not taking advantage of opportunities when I was younger, I have been very fortunate to have some wonderful opportunities presented for my children on the secondary and post secondary levels and am left wanting to share those opportunities with others.</p>

<p>In beating the bushes to find as many opportunities as I could for my own children, I was suprised and disheartened by the challenges that face many that are less fortunate, especially urms (of which my children would be considered). I am acutely aware of some of the obstacles that many face in attempting to further educate themselves. My mindset is simply that I will provide whatever information and resources (which are limited) that I can, to illuminate potential opportunities for others. For those that are willing to listen and apply themselves and persevere I believe they will more than likely have positve outcomes. For those who make excuses or discard the information and opportunities, that is their choice as well.</p>

<p>I'm somewhat reluctant to go beyond my small circles of acquaintances because I have no formal training, just my own positive experiences assiting my children with overwhelming results. I'm so convinced of sharing the benefits of cultivating a love of learning with others though, that some of my friends kid me about my "obsession",lol. A forum such as this helps me to think of various types of situations or venues that I can share my knowledge with others to help them realize the potential that lies in higher educational attainment.
I'd be very much in hearing in what capacity others here have attempted to share their knowledge with others.</p>

14

<p>Hi y'all. Jumping in with a question.</p>

<p>Let's say hypothetically that a (very small) student club with some seniors in it wanted a project of connecting experienced parents with some of the lower-income students at the school who needed mentoring help.</p>

<p>This is a large public school, lots of financial and ethnic diversity. It has a college information center, but it could be better used, especially by some of the students who just dismiss college as "not for them" because they don't have the money and don't think they have the smarts.</p>

<p>How best could a student group help make connections, without violating any privacy? And would a two-year commitment (or a year and a half) be too much for parents who had already launched their children into college?</p>

<p>Let's say the students compile a database of willing parents, through word of mouth and contacts among friends. They then find (?) a counselor/club leader/administrator who works with "at-risk" students, sharing the names and contact info. of the parents. I'm guessing because of confidentiality, the students who compile the mentor list should not know who gets linked up with the mentors.</p>

<p>Finding a way to sustain the mentor list over time might be a tough question....anybody have ideas/thoughts/pitfalls to avoid? Anyone know students who have done this?</p>

15

<p>For boys, you need a four year committment that starts the summer before 9th grade. Raging testosterone is not conduscive to long range planning. However, the time needed is very minimal except for the 8 months before apps are due.</p>

<p>That is a great idea though, p. If you draft a charter, you might post a 'How-To' thread on CC. I'm sure other CC parents could easily contribute to that kind of effort in their own communities.</p>

16

<p>I think that when the connection needs to be made is 8th grade because that's when students have to select their high schools and h.s. curriculum, both of which impact their college options.</p>

<p>The problems that I have had in mentoring low income students have been that: the parents and students are focused on graduating from h.s., not getting into college because often the parents aren't h.s. graduates; the students if male assume that sports prowess will get them into college and pay little attention to academics (The sports time commitment also impacts both the parents and students' abilities to participate in mentoring); and the students tend to move a lot, including changing schools and not having telephones or Internet connection.</p>

<p>The people easiest to mentor, I've found, have been low income students whose parents are immigrants who came to the U.S. to get good educational opportunities for their kids. Some such parents had been highly educated professionals in their home countries whose credentials were not accepted by the U.S. </p>

<p>Unfortunately, the students most in need of mentoring were the ones that no matter how hard I tried, I wasn't able to connect with.</p>

<p>I see that in NYC, the mayor is now using foundation and his own money to offer money to low income parents to support their kids' education. While some think that this is condescending, I think that it may work well because of the immediate benefits that low income parents and kids would get. It can be hard for such people to think of longterm benefits when they've never had the opportunity to experience the longterm benefits of things like education. </p>

<p>From Newsweek: </p>

<p>"Sept. 3, 2007 issue - Paying kids for good grades is a popular (if questionable) parenting tactic. But when school starts next week, New York City will try to use the same enticement to get parents in low-income neighborhoods more involved in their children's education and overall health. </p>

<p>Mayor Michael Bloomberg has raised more than $40 million (much of it from his own money and the Rockefeller Foundation) to pay families a modest amount for small tasks—$50 for getting a library card or $100 to take a child to the dentist—that could make a big differenceThe experimental program, called Opportunity NYC, is modeled on a 10-year-old Mexican program called Oportunidades, which has been so successful in reducing poverty in rural areas that it has been adopted by more than 20 countries, including Argentina and Turkey.</p>

<p>International studies have found that these programs raise school enrollment and vaccination rates and lower the number of sick days students take. "</p>

17

<p>Thanks for your thoughts.
I agree that the motivation/mentoring needs to start before high school (and inattentive to class and grades in 9th and 10th grades).
I think there are some grant programs out there trying to do that.
Maybe we'll be a little less ambitious and try to connect some juniors up with mentors -- if they were thinking no college, maybe they'll think community college; if they were thinking state college, maybe they'll stretch a little farther.
Worth a try. I'm betting cultural divide could be tough though. The matcher-upper person would be key.</p>

18

<p>Also consider vocational schools, too. Those are important. Not everyone needs or wants to go to college, but virtually everyone now needs some kind of post high school training to be able to gain employment to support themselves.</p>

19

<p>
[quote]
I think that when the connection needs to be made is 8th grade because that's when students have to select their high schools and h.s. curriculum, both of which impact their college options.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>I think this strategy is good for those who have demonstrated, at this juncture, some consistancy and tangible proof of academic competency, for lack of a better word. Many of these children and their parents don't really consider strong high school options or college for various reasons. Unfortunately, intervention or the "seed planting" if you will has to start much earlier. Lower income and particularly AA children can start behind as early as preschool and continue to lag behind making the academic disparities harder to close by the time they are making their high school choices.
It has been my frustration in trying to sell higher education to even middle class african americans, without sounding elitist(which kinda cracks me up when I hear those comments) or condescending. While these are just a few of the obstacles I face in trying to encourage those in my circles, I just keep plugging along. The more that I am able to share my own children and those I have mentored accomplishments, I hope will make it an easier sell.</p>