<p>After looking @ award letter a second time I noticed that the university
did not itemize the EFC in their communications to D. I thought this to be a little strange for a big time school.</p>
<p>EFC is $23,000 according to FASFA</p>
<p>Proud2bherdad, in my experience, the EFC is often not itemized even by schools that exclusively use FAFSA, and nearly never mentioned in schools that ask for other financial info and "tweak" the EFC. </p>
<p>In your specific case, if the EFC is a number you feel is reasonable and doable, the gap of $1600 is probably very doable, and your D has a very nice package as she could probably borrow or work the amount of the gap without too much trouble. I have seen families, however, where the family business has $20K or more riding on the kid--to replace him when he goes off to school is going to cost at least that. So there is no way the kid can work any harder at an outside job to come up with the money and the family is already stretched just letting the kid go away. So a gap of even that amount can be a big issue. Congratulations to your D for getting such a nice award.</p>
<p>jamimom, I didn't itemized the need based aid. In my instance, the need-based aid included students loans up to the current limit. The bottom line is the merit aid displaced need-based aid and didn't supplement. My contention is if all students in that particular EFC situation were awarded X dollars of need-based aid, this should be subtracted first and then the merit aid should be applied as a reward for being an outstanding student. If the result is the net cost is lower than the EFC, then so be it. This is not the way it generally works. The merit aid usually displaces need aid dollar for dollar.</p>
<p>Many times it does. I have seen cases where the financial aid office and the scholarship awards committees work separately, and then the awards have to be examined. In such cases if the financial aid did NOT meet the COA-EFC or demonstrated need, and many colleges do NOT provide 100% of demonstrated need, then merit award is applied up to the demonstrated need level. I believe Thumper has had experience with this situation. But most schools do not give financial aid beyond what the need is as it goes against the very definition of their financial aid policies. ANY money you get will reduce the aid, as this is supposed to be the last resort of getting funds. There are some exceptions, but rare. There are some schools that do allow some bonuses in that area, and certain federal grants do not get reduced, but I have not seen to many such cases. What occured with your student is more typical. And supposedly,in most cases, your loans would have been displaced first, though, again this does not always happen. You would have been able to see more clearly what process was at work if your student received an outside scholarship or an award clearly defined in dollar amount AFTER the financial aid packet was awarded. You would have to report such outside scholarship and you would see how a particular school would apply that scholarship. As I said earlier, it does differ from school to school. Some will reduce the loans and self help first--in fact, in my experience, most do. Then the grants disappear. THere are some schools that will let some kids keep some of the surplus, but not too many. In your case, since the grants were awarded all at once, it is impossible to see what the merit award would have been had your student not be eligible for financial aid. There are schools that do integrate their athletic, academic and need awards to varying degrees, and that may well be what happened to you. There are also often merit within aid awards that only financial aid beneficiaries can get and I have seen them at school that offer NO merit aid, such as the ivies. The bottom line is that it is not easy to make money off of financial aid, but those who get merit money and don't need it, do make out. Very unfair, but that is the way it goes.</p>
<p>My S got his first FA letter from a private U.
I've been reading these message boards trying to make sense of his letter, I was hoping you can help me, I have a feeling it's not the greatest aid.</p>
<p>Our EFC from the FASA is 457</p>
<p>Awards:
Pell Grant (estimated) 3600
Mass Grant (estimated) 1500
Supplemental Grant (SEOG) 2000
Deans Scholarship 6000
President Incentive Loan/grant 1800
Est. Sub Fed Staff Loan 2625
Fed. college work study 1900</p>
<p>What I'm trying to figure out is what portion has to be paid back, and how much in loans he will have to take out to meet the COA of $35,000.
Also, why does it say estimated after the grants? could this amount be less?
The Deans scholarship is renewable each year with a 3.0 GPA.</p>
<p>Thanks!
Lynn</p>
<p>It appears to me that your S has received about $13,100 in grants--money he definitely does not have to pay back. The estimated is usually put in there because you may have to provide tax info (or have provided actual tax inf) and it has to be verified with the numbers used to come up with the government amounts--those are not up to the school to give as the government issues them. Whereas with the school money, the school does have some leeway especially if it is merit based. A few dollars off on the return from the estimates may not affect the award--government does not work that way. The part of the package that is not claear is the President Incentive Loan/grant of $18oo. Is it a loan or a grant? Does it have to be repaid? Assuming that it is a loan, you have gotten $6325 in self help funds which gaps your need by a little more than $15K. If your son works like a fiend over spring break, takes a weekend job and then double shifts over the summer , he could make $5-10K depending on what work is available. But then next year that could affect the EFC as it will be included in his income. Make sure he spends his money first so that he does not get double hit by the accumulation of student assets as well as earnings! For the remaining $5-10 K, either you or he has to assume a loan unless you have another source for that money that is needed. Since he is already borrrowing about $4K assuming that the President Incentive Loan/grant is a loan, you need to consider how much debt he should shoulder over 4 years. I would suggest calling the school about that $2625. If it is not a loan, he would not be as burdened to borrow more.</p>
<p>It says the President Incentive Loan/Grant doesn't have to be paid back if he graduates from that particular school.
That makes sense about the tax info, I was chosen for verification, which wasn't a problem because we had our taxes done and all the info has been sent already, which was the same as 2003.</p>
<p>So do you think that's a good package?</p>
<p>I guess I've answered that before anytime anyone asks if a package is good. It depends on whether you and your family feel that the package is good. A full ride can be tough package for a family who runs a business that depends on the student to do alot of the work, as he will have to be replaced. Plus there is no way such a student can work to make any money for school if his income is needed at home. The EFC is really a meaningless figure without the family's take on it. If you and your family believe that the school is worth the out of pocket, loan and extra work that it is going to take, then it is a good package. If your student has better alternatives that will make the financial burden less and not make anyone feel cheated, then it is not. Your family has to come up with $15K more than federak methodology feels you should. If it can be done without too much sacrifice, it is a good deal. It is doable, but is going to take a lot of work and borrowing unless there are some extra funds in the picture somewhere. Hopefully the education the student gets from the school will put him into a situation to repay the money he borrows without too much hardship.</p>
<p>My personal feelings about education has always been on the extravagant side. We could never afford what we took on in the name of education. And it seemed like things always somehow worked out. As I am getting older, I can see that some of our decisions were not so sound and the "somehow" may well have been foolhardy. But I still maintain that it is a personal, family decision. </p>
<p>If you want to see how your student falls in the merit/financial aid amounts, look up the school in the USN:&WR Ultimate guide. In the financial info section of the school's writeup, it will tell what percentage of students apply for aid, get aid, how much of need is typically given and the breakdown between self help and grants, merit and need, and how much a typical student there takes out in loans. That info can gauge where your student stands in the this crowd. Also a peek at where he stands SAT1 score wise and grade wise in relationship to the rest of the student body can be helpful. If he is an academic catch for the school, I would appeal the package, as it is way off the EFC. Every bit counts and you just might be able to get a bit more from them. It does not hurt. Most families I know who negotiate or appeal, are protesting the EFC. When there is a gap between the two and you are below the average in getting % of need met, and the student is above average statistically at the school, there is a good argument to bump the grants up a bit.</p>
<p>Thanks for all your help, I appreciate it! It's always great to get an experienced voice on the subject, especially as FA is new to us! I was just excited he got into a small private small school with aid. Even though he also got accepted to a state school as well,we haven't heard about decisions from many others. Where he will feel more comfortable in the end is where he will go, no matter the cost! I'm just so proud of him!! </p>
<p>Thanks again
Lynn</p>
<p>Lynn, congratulations to him and to you. So many of us are still waiting for decisions, and for him to have such good news already is wonderful. You will, hopefully, have some offers to compare and some horsetrading might be in order. As I suggested before, do a little research on the school and how it tends to give out aid, so you know where he stands and if he may be entitled to a bit more. Some of these smaller schools that are that far off on meeting the EFC are amenable to negotiation if the student shows interest in going there but the financial are making him hesitate, and if you can see from their record that he is getting on the low end of what he should be getting even by their own history. A $15K gap on a $400 EFC is going to mean a program of austerity, borrowing and working hard for a while. Good luck to you and to him, and do let us know what else you hear and if you were able to negotiate. This question comes up often on this forum and every experience helps another.</p>
<p>Is there a website that lists the different schools for the USN:&WR Ultimate guide?<br>
I looked on that college's website and didn't see anything listed except that expected merit aid would be between $500 & $5000 and he got $6000, so I don't know how much room there is for negotiation.
Thanks again!</p>
<p>jamimom...hope you hear GREAT news from admissions soon! Waiting is the hardest part, we thought applications was rough. Hopefully everyone will love the schools they are accepted to, Good Luck</p>
<p>Lynn, if you go to their web site there is an upgraded subscription where you can get the info on line. I chose instead to buy the big, fat telephone directory sized book, as I can just browse through it without a computer. Great bathroom reading! It's about $30 and you can get it at any Borders or Barnes & Nobles, or any bookstore. Mine is all marked up.</p>
<p>Actually, since you are done with the college business, just plop yourself down at the bookstore and look up the particular college! And the other ones you are awaiting. Buy yourself a special coffee with that $30!</p>
<p>Sounds like a good idea, we have some great bookstores around here and I haven't had time to visit in quite a while, I'll look for that book...Thanks you've been very helpful with everything.</p>