<p>Oh wow, that is funny. Now I’m wondering which schools met with his piercing/weird hairdo index evaluations? Or was it the only art school department he visited because I actually found it to be the norm more or less. This is way off topic but I remember how my brother and I were cracking up back in the 60s when an uncle insisted that his daughter attend the college near us because being “on the coast” would mean exposure to drugs (this was the 60s remember). In fact, the school he thought was “safe” was hotbed of just the sort of activity he was trying to avoid. You never can tell!</p>
<p>And by the way my cousin being who my cousin was managed to graduate with honors and avoid all that activity anyway just as he probably would have at a more “liberal” school. While we all know our kids to an extent it’s probably not predictable as to what piercings and weird hairdos mean at an art school and they might not go that route anyway. My kid has been in an environment that could be described that way for many years and looks pretty darn conservative, no piercings, no “tats” no weird hairdo.</p>
<p>My parents sent my brother to Centre college because it was in a dry county and looked very conservative. Ha! he was high or drunk most of freshman year. The faculty advisor straightened him out and probably saved his life but Centre had some party hearty people. My parents always joke that Center took the “colleges that change lives” pretty literally in my brother’s case…</p>
<p>Funny about my H…he is not too conservative in many of his political/social views, but, as an immigrant, he is appalled by poor hygiene when you don’t even have the excuse of lack of running water…similarly, why would you add piercings to a body and more scars when you are blessed with smooth skin from good diet and healthy environment? Don’t get him started on dreadlocks! It is a bit like his view of camping…what are American’s thinking CHOOSING to cook over a fire, give up hot showers, and spend time building tents, scrounging for firewood, stubbing toe to go to pit toilet at night…this is recreation? this is the reality that millions in the developing world are trying to escape from.</p>
<p>PS Brother is fine, upstanding citizen and successful engineer.</p>
<p>“why would you add piercings to a body and more scars when you are blessed with smooth skin from good diet and healthy environment”</p>
<p>Well, we are in total agreement on that one! My sentiments exactly . . . </p>
<p>I realize that maybe what happened is that having a child who likes to be “different” and that child having been in an environment where having piercings, tats, weird hair was more the norm made looking a little more conservative the way to be different! Don’t know but could be.</p>
<p>Your husband’s take on things is very interesting and logical from his perspective. My mother still gets almost furious about people who don’t want preservatives in their food having grown up with home canning, she’s got some hair raising stories about families getting boutlism because the canning didn’t work. Well now we’re getting really off track but I found your husband’s take on things very interesting.</p>
<p>The story about your brother is a good caution for parents who are looking for a safe school. I think these kids are going to be exposed to stuff no matter where they are, well there might be a few exceptions but we’re not talking your basic liberal arts or art school in that case.</p>
<p>I was talking with friend of mine who went to SAIC let’s see… four decades ago?
one semester costed $750, the school was in the musty crammed basement of the institute. Kids are to take academic classes at U Chicago. She lived with her aunt and worked part time.
The one and only instruction she got from painting chair bigshot grandma was
" that, is not an art" as she walked by while she was painting.
There are some big name nicer instructors; some dead some forgotten some still going.
It was just lots of fun meeting people, talking art, first time in the big city.
There is this summer retreat named Ox-bow she spent 9 weeks in summer. You’d get own cabin, she worked at art supply shop in exchange of room and board, tuition was covered by scholarship.
Graduated with BFA debt free.
Put down paint brushes some two and half decade ago due child birth life change etc etc
what left is few sketch books and the memory…
and could not would not believe COA of now 50K let alone hyped nutso parents ( her kid is art free)</p>
<p>Ox-bow is still operating. I am actually tempted. Drae?</p>
<p>[Ox-Bow</a> :: Visitor Center](<a href=“http://www.ox-bow.org/visitorcenter/]Ox-Bow”>http://www.ox-bow.org/visitorcenter/)</p>
<p>So Centre is the college that “save” lives… too bad I didn’t go see.
though Mr. Pope has rather tacky taste judging from the schools I did see. His fav line is "this school would be so much more popular if it was in the corridor " (or something like that, I don’t have the book in my hand to be super sure) I would say, it will look so fake in comparison if it was amongst Williams Swat Yale Harvard whatnot whatnot, though I don’t get sucked in for physical beauty of the campus any longer.
He doesn’t worry much about greek life, traveling accessibility, food, religion thing, diversity, nor money, which all are big for us.
Someone we are supposed to listen to recommended highly and I read both of his books, it helped, sure, but wonder how much of his own bias have gotten on the way, he could not possibly visit every schools up to date, he did add bit of them here there - but books kept selling pretty much the same as its first edition.</p>
<p>Thanks for the art school comments. We are concerned about the unstructured feel of SAIC (aside from the lack of campus) for a kid who is struggling through high school with time management issues as well really enjoying a social life (music, friends). I am having a time of it finding the courses online. Sometimes I think the pass/fail narrative grades would be a relief for her, even though she worked hard in some ways, she’d miss a the higher grade by a point. (Guess I am more comfortable with a hard copy catalog.) </p>
<p>MICA still has the issue of safety that is bugging me. The school support is very, very helpful. We wish we had looked at more schools, but that’s hind-sight. This has to be her decision ultimately, but we need to see her put together a pro|con list. Hopefully, this weekend the choice will be made. She visited Humboldt and was not as excited about their art department as she had hoped. Have to look at the art options again at Evergreen, too. Keep those thoughts coming.</p>
<p>I have been thinking a lot about fineartmajorsmom’s husband and his perspective on our society. It really touched me and has been on my mind. I am wondering how many of these schools actually do much about social consciousness and thinking about the world at large and an artist’s position in the world at large. Especially since art can be (isn’t necessarily) a field that can be a bit self-focused and self-congratulatory. I do know that SAIC seems to have some outreach to expose students to the world at large or am assuming that since we toured there right after the Haiti earthquake. Sadly it was noted in the student magazine that they lost someone (grad student or teacher, can’t remember) from the school who was in Haiti at the time working on a project teaching people woodwork in order to build housing. As I remember it there were others from SAIC there at the time working on the same project. Is this typical, did anyone run into this at other schools…and I’m really talking about projects outside the typical go to Europe and see the museums type of thing.</p>
<p>As for time management issues, I don’t know the answer. Sometimes I wonder if at this age it isn’t better to be put into a situation where you need to learn how to do that without a tremendous amount of structured coursework. When you’re in the real world as an artist you’ll certainly need those skills anyway so at what point do you start learning how to do that. Or is a school like RISD’s approach better where you just work your socks off because you must and then that sticks.</p>
<p>I wish we had gone to see MICA, a friend went there and speaks highly of it. But my kid just locked into a decision very early on and actually reading everything here I think I’m fine with the decision.</p>
<p>But I have noted that many (even outside this site) mention the safety issue so there must be a real concern there. I saw something posted here where a girl complained that she got in trouble for not locking her dorm door at MICA when she wasn’t in the room or was in the room, something like that. I assumed immediately that this was not a city kid. One word of caution for any kids coming from quieter areas to a city and I’m including Providence in this. Lock your doors even when you’re in the room. You will not be in Kansas anymore! (Or perhaps this would be a good practice in Kansas also nowadays). But I’m getting the impression that at MICA this is more than a better to be cautious issue. Anyone…?</p>
<p>where that brianm kid go? I shoulda asked more questions about MICA. though he might not aware of girls’ safety issues</p>
<p>What are you wanting to know?</p>
<p>Cities are cities, cities have the capability to be dangerous, and Baltimore is a city. Any account of crime that I’ve heard about that’s happened around campus has been when people are alone. It’s not a matter of bad people striking down on MICA students, it’s caused by students lack of judgment. A group of three or more people walking around will more than likely not be encountered. Those who leave themselves vulnerable and walk alone anytime are opening themselves to crime. It’s really just a matter of knowing your surroundings.</p>
<p>Thanks. That’s good information to have. As I said any student in a dorm in any city should be locking their dorm rooms and using good judgment when going out. I suspect some of this is the difference between any city school as opposed to a bucolic country setting. Anyone else…?</p>
<p>D stayed in the freshman dorms “the commons” for the summer program. It was very safe and you can’t go in and out of the complex without passing through a gatehouse that always has someone there. If your room was unlocked, only another student could rob you. I’m not sure how prevalent that sort of thing is at MICA. On a different thread, some students complained about theft by other students (at Oberlin). We’ve visited schools (Alfred, Haverford) where kids leave ipods and other things lying around, sometimes backpacks in a big pile, and no one will bother them. </p>
<p>I wonder how much of the perception of danger at MICA is/was fueled by “The Wire”. I wonder how much people talk about it on the Hopkins forums…</p>
<p>greenwitch, I have to say Charles Village, the neighborhood that Hopkins is in, has a completely different feel than Bolton Hill. They’re just two places with different atmospheres. It’s definitely not a bad thing though, if you get tired of the area surrounding MICA, it’s so easy to go up to Hopkins, or Towson, or down to the Harbor if you want.</p>
<p>My daughter is just finishing her freshman year at SAIC. (Shes now one of the pierced flesh / weird haired tribe btw). A few thoughts.
It is widely known among current SAIC students that first year [experience] is a weed out year. If you are not committed, and not willing to spend as much as 18 hours immersed in art (classes are either 3 credit / 6 hour adventures, or 1.5 credit, 2-3 hour labs, then you go to the studio / lab/ computer, and do homework for another 4-6 hours)then you might want to consider a more traditional school. It is also behind the high drop out rate first year. The school expects that. Since, as has been mentioned, there is no SAT test to quantify artistic ability, it is useless to discuss selectivity, grading or any other quantitative measure of qualitative efforts. Unless you just want bragging rights.</p>
<p>It is also generally believed that the school invests in the top 20-30% of the incoming class, based upon their estimation of potential-which not surprisingly also is reflected in the merit awards. This tends to increase the retention among that group. Sometimes they get it right, sometimes they dont.</p>
<p>While it would seem that kids can attend SAIC and just kind of float, the truth is that its really a waste of their time and nothing comes of it; if you don’t get credit for a class (recorded as NC) you lose your merit. If any kid misses more than 2 classes, merit or not, you get dropped from that class. I don’t know about you, but if my parents paid $1000 plus per credit hour, for a class I didn’t pass and 3 credits I didnt get-grading system or not- I would be in deep deep trouble and looking for a job. That’s direction enough for many kids-mines included.</p>
<p>About my pierced and weird haired youngun. I dont remember a time in High School when she actually stayed on top of her homework, got to class on time, or remembered to bring all the materials she needed for any particular class. I made runs to drop off forgotten items more times than I care to mention. We decided on SAIC in spite of this, owing largely to the fact that her talents didn’t fit neatly into the traditional atelier type schools. Her skills and interests cross over from fibers to installations to sculpture to…well you get the idea. There are very few schools that allow you to cherry pick classes (though even there are more restrictions that originally thought) across departments, and not declare a major. Experimentation is a wonderful thing as has been stressed on this thread. In her case it has been a God send because most of the classes she expected to like most were almost always the ones she liked least. She has discovered new interests, and is thankfully able to pursue them without setting her back with respect to a major.
So how is she doing? She gets herself to class (maybe a couple of sick days), gets her work done, and manages her money (well…sorta) beyond our expectations. This is not to say that there haven’t been hiccups. I think the fact that she won a very nice merit award and feels a sense of responsibility to keep it, that she is in charge of her choices, has made a real difference for her. Realize that these kids are in class at least 6 hours a day five - six days a week. To me thats a lot of structure. The self directed piece comes largely from the fact that you have to make a lot of choices, rather than follow a very strict curriculum, that a lot of the work is highly conceptual, that you have to figure out where to get materials, and meals, and maybe even cook them in the kitchen in your loft like apartment / dorm room v hangin in the cafeteria. Not for everyone, but not quite as loosey goosey as one might fear. My kid certainly surprised me with how well she is managing all this. For her, finally being completely in charge of her choices has been a real growth experience.</p>
<p>Thanks for taking the time to write this, I think it’s very instructive and a good insight into the structure versus non-structure question. And I’m with you on that running forgotten items to school part…been there, done that.</p>
<p>This is a great story and gives hope for all of us who are still doing way too much for our disorganized offspring in high school. I definitely think the merit aid is helpful for making the kid feel like they are a good “fit” (feeling the love) but you make an excellent point that they now have skin in the game. If they screw up they lose the aid and perhaps the opportunity to attend the art school of choice. I am hopeful that S will become self directed and keep track of his belongings once he knows there is no mom-safety-net. Hopeful but not convinced and if he felt SAIC was too lose for him well…he probably knows himself well enough and the good merit aid did not convince him otherwise. He will work hard…he already can do this for things he enjoys…but some kids also want a little bit of pressure/structure to direct their energies. It sounds like your daughter has really figured things out for herself.</p>