Michele Hernandez's Activities List--opinions?

Parents Forum
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<p>I saw a recommendation somewhere on CC for formatting an activities sheet using the examples given in "Acing the College Application" by Ms. Hernandez. For those of you who haven't read the book, the general idea is to expand on the Common App's limited space for ECs that aren't self-explanatory. Unlike a resume, the activities sheet is formatted to emphasize a description of the activity/group/team and the student's unique contributions. "Sounds like a great idea," thought I. You're probably thinking that, too. Then I looked at the samples. Here, let me give you a few:</p>

<p><a href="for%20a%20group%20called%20The%20Entertainment%20Group">quote</a>
My major time commitment takes place outside of school. Driven by my passion for all facets of the theater, I branched out to new areas, specifically directing and theatrical production. In my role as assistant director in a professional production, I am required to manage the actors and technicians, as well as to maintain a prompt book, which holds all cues for the final performance. Additionally, after the director had staged a specific scene, it was my responsibility to clean the scene, ensuring a professional product. Lastly, during the performance, I detonated many large explosive devices, which produced a mystical flarelike effect.

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<p>Another:
<a href="for%20the%20activity" title="Hospital Visitation">quote</a>
In a joint effort with the Eucharistic ministry at my church, I visit the local hospital on a triweekly basis. During these sessions, I generally attempt to provide conversation and happiness to the otherwise lonely patients.

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<p>One last:
<a href="for%20national%20Honor%20Society">quote</a>
Although National Honor Societies sometimes can be titular in nature, our school's group is very active....

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<p>No, sorry, I can't type any more. My screen is turning purple. ;) Did I mention that the author says not to use big fancy words when you're writing your essay, so writing "I read a plethora of books" is a bad idea? (Personally, I use "plethora" far more often then "titular". But we digress.) </p>

<p>I now have questions for the wise heads here.</p>

<p>1) Does any applicant really, really write like this? These snippets, typical examples from what's shown in the book, seem so totally over the top that I can't read them with a straight face. Does this mean that I would make a terrible admissions staffer, or is this The Way Things Are Done for some schools? Because if so, there is no way in heck that I will ever get D1 to do this. </p>

<p>2) Is this type of list truly worthwhile? D1 has some uncommon ECs, and a couple of sentences explaining that e.g. her summer internship consisted of researching a specific policy question (as opposed to photocopying and being a gofer) would certainly add to her application. </p>

<p>Thoughts?</p>

2

<p>I cannot comment on Ms. Hernandez’s book or examples as I do not own the book. </p>

<p>However, both of my children and all the students whom I advise ,submit an annotated activities/achievements resume with all their applications, as well as give to their rec writers and guidance counselor in soliciting recommendations. </p>

<p>The application’s couple of inches devoted to ECs typically does not do justice to many kids’ activities, involvement, and achievements. The resume is more thorough and explicit. The annotations should make the student come alive and demonstrate a bit about them. The annotations should not merely describe what the activitiy entailed (as an employment resume would do) but the student should go on to describe why the activity was meaningful or what they got out of it, or what role they played in the endeavor and so forth. The resume should be organized by various categories as well, that make sense for each student. </p>

<p>Ironically, I was skimming CC just now on a break from having just edited such a resume for a student.</p>

<p>(I agree about “titular” though!)</p>

<p>By the way, the reason a resume is beneficial is for example, you said that just listing your D’s internship on the application doesn’t do justice to what she really did and accomplished on the job, and an annotated activity resume would do that.</p>

<p>The annotation above for the entertainment group is not a good one in my opinion. It just lists what the kid did and not what he got out of it or how it influenced him in some way or what he accomplished or why it was a meaningful experience. It also doesn’t show much about his personality and the annotations are a chance to show attributes about oneself.</p>

<p>Actually the hospital visitation one is not so great either. It should tell why this student found this activity to be meaningful or worthwhile and what he gained from it or an anecdote or even some humor about it.</p>

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<p>In the end my son decided his essays covered what the activities list would have. He did however have an annotated activities list for his GC.</p>

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<p>The admissions rep at Stanford told us that their staff HATES these resumes. Other reps were more diplomatic in telling the groups that they read applications for a living and that they don’t need to have the EC’s annotated or various awards explained.</p>

<p>Could you imagine reading 20,000 applications per season if only 25% of the kids decided that the questions you asked were somehow inadequate and that you needed to provide more explanations? That’s an extra 5,000 unnecessary pieces of paper.</p>

<p>It’s an application, not a deposition (we also heard that at Stanford). Everything on the application must be 100% truthful, but you don’t need to include absolutely everything you have ever done or include your motivation for every decision you’ve ever made.</p>

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<p>I haven’t read Ms. Hernandez’s book, but I agree that her examples appear to have been written by an adult. I also agree that these examples are pretty horrible and not worth emulating. </p>

<p>Here’s an example of a brief description of an EC from the application of a girl admitted to MIT in the spring of 2007 (my daughter). We made a copy of her application before sending it out, and this is fairly representative of the language (with names changed in brackets):</p>

<p>“[County Science Fair]: I have participated in the [local science fair] since sophomore year. In 2005 I did an environmental science project. Last year, I did a physics project. This year, I plan to do a computer science project.”</p>

<p>Her language is very straightforward. The claims expressed here are supported by awards won at the science fair, reported elsewhere in the application.</p>

<p>Not only was this girl admitted to MIT, but she was also admitted to Yale, Stanford, Berkeley, Duke, etc.</p>

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<p>Well, blossom, perhaps Stanford states that but I had a student submit an annotated resume to Stanford this year and she was accepted. These resumes really show the student much more so than the two inches where ECs are listed for those who really have been very involved outside the classroom and often in activities that are not so self explanatory in terms of what they achieved. All I can say is that it never hurt my own kids in competitive college admissions and I have not noticed it hurting the students I work with as many have a myriad of acceptances and all have submitted such documents. In my view, I think it helped certain kids as their resumes really gave a good profile in ways that the little charts on the application did not allow. </p>

<p>Here is one example. My nephew applied to college and got in nowhere. He took a gap year. I helped him with every aspect of his college process this time. Now, I can’t claim exactly what worked on this round but will say that this time he did have an annotated activity resume (sent in with his apps and also given in interviews and to all his rec writers) and he also had a music resume (he was seeking recorded music degree programs). This time he got in everywhere. I can’t say it was the resumes, of course. He did many things differently this time (though his “stats” did not change). This was one thing done differently. His apps showcased him much better than before.</p>

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<p>By the way, there are many awards that are not self explanatory and I have had to have students explain to me what they were for. There are also many activities, internships, and summer programs that are not clear what they are by name or what the student’s role was in the endeavor. If a student initiated or created the entire endeavor, for example, that would not come across on a list of activities. </p>

<p>For example, if my D had listed “Peace a Pizza” would you know what it was? I think not. It so happens when she was chosen to be something called a Tisch Scholar (something that we never knew existed until receiving the letter), and it listed the traits they used to select these handful of students, it was so obvious to me that they had read the activity resume (and recs) as there were activities on there that demonstrated these traits they were seeking but without the activity resume, there was no way to ascertain that. “Peace of Pizza” and a few other things on that resume were not self explanatory but their annotations truly fit the qualities that Tisch Scholars were seeking (which again we had no idea about until after the fact).</p>

<p>I have read countless activity resumes (once they have been polished) and all I can say is that they have given me a great picture of the student (outside of the classroom) in ways that the little chart on the application did not. Add in the essays and I get a full sense of the student beyond their stats.</p>

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<p>An experienced counselor advised that the resume should make the reader want to meet the applicant. The applicant should take one or two activities or groups of activities that s/he loves and write an interesting and engaging paragraph about why these are important to him/her, kind of like speed dating…you want the reader to love you in three sentences. And activities that the applicant isn’t as passionate about can just be listed without descriptions.</p>

9

<p>Both kids submitted these annotated activities sheets. If the staff doesn’t like them, they don’t have to read them.</p>

<p>Each was accepted to his/her number one school.</p>

<p>I don’t like the word plethora either. I think everyday words are best in all writing.</p>

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<p>I really hope students aren’t stressing over crafting these activity sheets. If it’s a helpful exercise for the applicant, that’s great. I don’t think any should feel burdened by the task.</p>

<p>I like it when students fill in the chart on the app. Most positions and activities can be adequately described on the chart. I also like it when they use the text box that follows the chart on the Common App to provide detail about a special or important activity.</p>

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<p>When applying to schools in the 2009-2010 admissions cycle, I did follow Michelle Hernandez’s advice from her book and submitted an activity chart with annotations for each entry, but I adhered religiously to her suggestion that the activity list not be more than 2-3 pages of size 12 font. What I found was that annotations as long as the ones she shows in the book are not compatible with such a length. I also realized that lengthy paragraphs would probably only frustrate an adcom hoping to get a quick sense of an applicant’s personality amidst the bustle of admissions season, so decided to space things out a lot and convert my paragraphs into bullet point annotations. To me, this seemed like a happy medium between making the application my own and giving the admissions committee all the information I felt they needed to know about my activities, some of which were a bit unorthodox and required detailed explanations, while also remaining succinct.</p>

<p>Did it work? Of course it’s impossible for me to answer that question since I wasn’t present for the admissions committee’s deliberations, but I did have the good fortune to be accepted to 8/10 schools where I applied, including several super reaches, so I can’t imagine my activity sheet was do disastrous as to be a deal breaker. Additionally, when I handed the activity sheet to alumni interviewers, I noticed that they were able to skim through it and get a sense of what kind of activities I was interested in and develop appropriate questions from the activity sheet in a minute or less.</p>

<p>So in my case, I felt that doing the activity sheet was worth it. But I do remember really struggling with whether or not I was helping or hurting my case when considering whether or not to send such a detailed supplement.</p>

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<p>Dean J –
I know you don’t represent every school, but I LOVE it when you respond to this type of thread.</p>

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<p>I would never want someone to stress over crafting such a document. I would hope a kid would want to show about themselves and be happy to have a way to do it. I have yet to have a student say they don’t want to do it or who has been unhappy with the final document. I think they see once they get to final draft, that it really does show a lot about themselves that was not able to be shown on the little application chart. </p>

<p>As an alum interviewer myself, I WISH students brought such a document to their interviews. NONE do. My kids and my students always do, however. I also think the document helps their rec writers and guidance counselor. It is a great snapshot of the student and if organized very well, is easy to skim. Annotations should not be long but should show about the student and not just facts about the activity. After reading some comments on this thread, I went back and opened up a bunch of activity resumes from both my own kids and many of my students and upon looking at these again, I see many activities and accomplishments that just could not be shown effectively on the little chart on the application. </p>

<p>Also, in recent years, even the Common App has allowed applicants to attach such a document. </p>

<p>If adcoms don’t want to read it, that is their choice. As I said, when I saw my D selected for a special program we didn’t even know about when she applied to her dream school, and what they were apparently seeking for these “scholars”, I realized that they had to have read her activity resume to have truly gleaned the kind of leadership and initiative traits they were seeking. Many of these traits do not come with titles like “captain” or “president” but are significant endeavors students have created and led and started that would not be obvious by the name of the activity itself.</p>

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<p>I read Hernandez’s book and crafted an activity list in the format she described. Like a poster above, I kept it to about 3 pages (horizontal page in text boxes). </p>

<p>I can’t remember if I sent it in to schools or not (I think I attached it but I may have decided to ditch it at the last moment). But, I did give it to my recommenders and guidance counselor who were tremendously grateful. I believe most applicants would be well served to make one, if only to practice elaborating on their activities to others, as I can say without hesitation that it helped my teachers write better letters of recommendation.</p>

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<p>A plethora of responses! :D</p>

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<p>Just to show how contrary admissions people can be, :slight_smile: D1’s school had an adcom from Caltech talk to the parents. He urged us to have our children describe their activities in more detail. His example of an applicant who shot him/herself in the foot was a student who wrote that they did “cancer research” during a summer program. No further detail than that. CalAlum, I’m certainly not arguing with your daughter’s approach, because obviously it worked. It’s just amusing (and a little frustrating) to hear such contradictory messages. </p>

<p>cig210, I like the sound of bulleted annotations rather than blocks of text. More importantly, I think my D1 will like it. Ditto for Muffy333’s advice to make the reader love the applicant in three sentences. </p>

<p>blossom, D1 isn’t interested in Stanford at all :slight_smile: but I’m curious how the Stanford adcom would decode something like my D1’s internship being real rather than make-work. Another of her ECs has a foreign title where even if you speak the language you still wouldn’t know what the EC really was. Just last night, working on her resume, she was struggling with how to explain an EC that was a class with a strong service and activism component. </p>

<p>This is all very helpful, especially seeing how other students used the list in interview and recommendation letter settings.</p>

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<p>The problem with such anecdotal evidence is that nobody (except the readers and adcom) will ever know if the students was admitted because of doing XYZ or despite of doing XYZ. </p>

<p>As an example, I have always believed that the application essays should NOT be a substitute for an activity list, and actually should not rehash a single thing that can be found on the application. It appears that Mathson did just the opposite and it … worked for him! Shows how generalizations work! </p>

<p>As another example, Blossom is warning us via the ad rep to avoid sending one of those dreaded things! Unfortunately, adcoms come and go. The person who spoke two years ago on behalf of Stanford might, today, very well be filling a bunch of numbers in an mind-numbing admission sheet across the bay, or be teaching speed reading in Korea. His replacement, another twenty something with little to no experience might just LOVE the list as it helps him in the correct evaluation.</p>

<p>Anecdote for anecdote, I can share that I asked Mrs. Hernandez about the activity sheet and the seemingly dislike of such things at The Farm. The response? Or, they may not have liked it, but they read it, and they … admitted all my clients! </p>

<p>For what is worth, if a student does have enough activities to fill a reasonably compelling activity list but has a set of parents worried about annoying the adcome, there is a diplomatic way around the problem. Submit the activity list to your favorite teacher or your GC and ask that nice person to attach the activity list to the LORs. My understanding is that all the READING material that goes to a folder (positive or negative) HAS to be considered by the reader. </p>

<p>My own take on it follows the line of …nothing ventured, nothing gained. One cannot be accepted if he or she does not apply. In the same vein, the adcom will NEVER know about activities you FAIL to share or describe. It’s good to remember that adcoms look for reasons to ADMIT a lot more than reasons to reject.</p>

<p>Of course, this does not mean that parents should send a couple of scrapbooks with baby pictures! Regardless of tempting it might be! Now that box of award-winning cookies, that is something else! :)</p>

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<p>xiggi, that’s a good post!</p>

<p>I agree also that the essays need not be about ECs. I recall one (of many essays) D2 wrote and one main one that went with a bunch of apps had to do with her sister leaving for college for the first time (which was right when she was applying). It had nothing to do with her ECs. And if another essay was related to her EC (in her case, her ECs were in the field of her college major and career), it certainly did not hit on all her ECs. The activity resume was a great overview of her endeavors outside the classroom. While I am not an adcom, I can’t truly imagine if I were one, that I would not find such a document useful as part of the package as the document addresses what the application is asking about anyway (activities and achievements) but it is more clear and provides a good overview than what the little chart allows. The student still fills in the little chart and the adcom can opt to just read that or this nice document that gives a fuller picture. </p>

<p>It hasn’t seemed to hurt my kids or students as colleges accepted them anyway. We have no way of knowing if it helped but it didn’t seem to make them get rejected.</p>

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<p>This seems so wordy. It’s evident that it’s outside of school, the “driven by my passion” feels superfluous. Isn’t this just “Stage manager, crew assistant and special-effects operator for XYZ Community production of Play Name”? </p>

<p>To me, this is like puffing up a resume for waitress (a job everyone understands!) by saying “Motivated by the desire to provide prompt service to hungry customers, I serve them food that came from the counter. In addition, I refill their coffees. Lastly, after the meal, I present them with the check.”</p>

<p>I just saw a similar resume to Ms. Hernandez’ example – the student did get into USC, Vandy, Emory, Tufts and Notre Dame – but it felt overly wordy to me and I didn’t pass it on to my kids.</p>

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<p>D found the list idea really helpful and it added to her applications. She wrote her own descriptions.</p>

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<p>“but I’m curious how the Stanford adcom would decode something like my D1’s internship being real rather than make-work”</p>

<p>Stanford is very direct on their application website about EC’s: </p>

<p>“We are more interested in the depth of your commitment and achievement than in the sheer quantity of your activities. An exceptional experience in one or two activities demonstrates your dedication more than minimal participation in five or six clubs. We want to see the impact your participation has had on that club or organization, in your school, or in the larger community.”</p>

<p>Stanford asks for a number of short supplemental essays. If an activity is signifcant to the student, they would expect it to have been written about in at least the common app essay or one of supplemental essays - or be a part of the counselor and/or teacher rec. </p>

<p>It may not seem “fair” to some parents, but what matters to many of the elite schools is not what your kid actually did, but what they contributed, what they learned from it, and how it changed/improved/impacted them. One kid may have had an internship filing, photcopying and running errands for a politcal campaign and another kid may have been writing speeches for the candiate. The kid who wrote the speeches would seem to be a more impressive applicant to most schools – but if the kid doing menial work had an unusal experience with another campaign worker, a community member or the candidate that they write about in a compelling way in one of their essays — that student may be considered the “better” candidate, from an EC/Activity perspective.</p>