Midwest Parents: Is UIUC "better" than IU Bloomington and UIowa?

Parents Forum
21

<p>Agree with mom2collegekids! You are really going about this all wrong. For one thing: the “prestige” factor is immaterial, especially among the schools you are talking about. To the outside world, they are all Big 10 flagships. All three are respectable. Second, most people working in business do not have undergraduate business degrees. And if you think it’s something she “might come to enjoy” you are admitting she doesn’t “enjoy” the idea of it now.</p>

<p>Have you visited all three schools? Can you really find a good reason, other than the BF being there, to keep her from choosing Iowa? If not, let her go. She will either a) thrive in college with this same guy at her side the whole time or b) move on and immerse herself in a social life with new friends/dating prospects or c) decide she didn’t really want to be there and transfer out. She is (or will soon be) an adult. Treat her like one.</p>

22

<p>Except in science, I am not sure what the tangible differences in education are between these schools. UIUC has slightly higher average ACT scores requirements than IU Bloomington, which is higher than U Iowa. It’s not a huge difference, but the classes may be geared to a different caliber student. </p>

<p>Other than that, I’m not sure what the difference in education might be in fields like business or the humanities as a consequence of the faculty being somewhat more regarded at UIUC. (I could tell you that in science, the experience in a lab and the influence of the lab director’s recommendation will be significantly different.) Still, even in science, the caliber of the faculty and its ranking is only a factor to consider. Sometimes gut instinct is the best way to make a big life decision, because your unconscious considers factors that you may not be aware are important.</p>

<p>I agree that going where her boyfriend is going is not a great way to make a decision, though. </p>

23

<p>She has also been accepted to two private schools with nursing as a direct admit student: Marquette and St Louis Univ. All of the schools (other than UIUC, so far at least) have offered her half tuituion merit scholarships that of course would not be available to her as a transfer student, so if she makes a bad choice she will be not have as many options available without significant financial impact. She professes to “love” SLU’s campus feel, nursing school facilities and urban setting. And of course she already feels that she goes to Iowa. </p>

<p>I am losing way too much sleep over this, as I imagine most parents do! DH feels that we should complete the process of in-depth visits at all of the schools (we have been to most more than once), waiting until the May 1 deadline. I have plans to have her meet with the career counselor at school and am considering telling her that I will not allow her to enroll in a nursing program unless she meets/speaks with the many healthcare professionals I have enlisted to counsel her.</p>

<p>Thanks again for all of your comments. </p>

24

<p>Iowa has two nursing tracks–early decision admission and competitive admission. Do NOT give up that early decision admission if she wants to be a nurse. The competitive admission model adds a 9th semester to the program. It is also competitive enough that I’d worry about her being admitted. </p>

<p>You know Iowa is a campus with over 30,000 students. If the boyfriend doesn’t work out, it’d be pretty easy never to have contact with him again (as long as he’s not also a nursing major). </p>

25

<p>Where the rubber meets the road for business schools, is placement data. If I was a parent of a business school wannabe, I would look at that data first and foremost. Which brings up the question, does the op’s daughter have any interest in studying business at all? Too many business students only major in business because their parents ‘forced/guided’ them down that path (often the path of least resistance to finding a solid job/career). That tends to create business students that are pretty conservative(boring) and not very creative. I’ll hang with students majoring in geography, CS, econ, film, etc any day over the typical business student.</p>

<p>If she decides to attend Iowa, both nursing and business are open to transfers from within. Business is a pretty easy admit, nursing is a lot tougher. </p>

<p>Some placement data from 2012…</p>

<p>IU
The top states were Illinois
(36%), Indiana (22%), New
York (9%), Ohio (5%), and
Minnesota (5%).</p>

<p>U Iowa
37% took jobs in Iowa.
33% in Illinois
17% other midwest</p>

<p>IU
Major Median Starting Salary Range </p>

<p>Accounting $55,000 $20,800–$75,000<br>
Finance $55,000 $25,000–$75,000
MIS $60,000 $38,000–$70,000<br>
Management $52,000 $21,000–$67,000
Marketing $50,000 $20,000–$70,000</p>

<p>Iowa</p>

<p>Accounting 48,000 35,000-110,000
Finance 40,000 25,000-112,000
MIS 47,000 42,500-60,000
Management 42,750 30,000-50,000
Marketing 37,000 27,000-56,000</p>

<p>And as a point of reference, Iowa State data. Iowa State is lower ranked than all 3 schools(by quite a bit in business)…but note that median salary for Iowa State is higher than Iowa for 3/5 programs despite placing a higher % of students in lower cost of living areas. Iowa has a higher range in accting and finance because they have a specific program that places some of these students with IB in NYC and Chicago.</p>

<p>Accounting 45,700 27,040-65,000<br>
Finance 43,250 19,240-55,000
Management 41,500 26,000-60,000
MIS 50,000 24,960-65,520
Marketing 39,250 24,000-61,000</p>

<p>Moral of the story, career services matters when considering business as a major.</p>

26

<p>Thanks Haystack: I did indeed look at placement figures at UIUC and IU and was quite impressed. DD wants to make “a lot of money” and there is a big difference between the starting salaries at those schools and Iowa, which really adds up over a lifetime. She seems to think she’ll be able to start as a BSN making 50K, but what I can’t seem to get across to her is that there is not a lot of upside potential for most nursing jobs. It is one thing to accept a lower income potential if you love the field. She has said that she’d switch to business at Iowa if she is not happy with nursing but I imagine that being around ambitious students, which presumably are at the higher tier schools, will rub off on her.</p>

<p>She was accepted to the early decision nursing program and I will schedule a meeting with the rep when she is in the Chicago area to ask some of the “hard” questions that DD may not do on her own when she is out there this week.</p>

27

<p>Be aware that most nursing and certain business programs/schools are not auto transfer. You have to apply. If there are too many who apply in a given year, not everyone who does apply gets into the program. Also grades and courses taken come into play as to who gets accepted and who does not. It’s not an auto admit to a lot of these programs even if you are a student already in the school. I know a number of parents/students who got hit with this. My son’s GF did not get into some program despite a 3.6 average. There were single digit openings for it that year. </p>

28

<p>“and am considering telling her that I will not allow her to enroll in a nursing program unless she meets/speaks with the many healthcare professionals I have enlisted to counsel her.”</p>

<p>holy smokes. Do you realize what a control freak this sounds like? You really have to back down. “will not allow her to enroll in a nursing program”…wow. Who’s going to school? You or her? </p>

<p>Your D is on the brink of adulthood. You need to tread very carefully or in a few years she’s going to shut your opinions out completely as a payback.</p>

29

<p>"DD wants to make “a lot of money” and there is a big difference between the starting salaries at those schools and Iowa, which really adds up over a lifetime. "</p>

<p>You can’t look at starting salaries that way. They don’t have to do with where you went to college. They have to do with what cities you work in and the COL there.</p>

<p>A student can graduate from College A or College B…but Hospital X will pay each the same because that’s the going rate in that city. Hospital Y in another state may pay more or less, but that amount will be based on that city’s going rate…not the school the student went to.</p>

<p>So the BSN from SLU or Iowa will get paid the same as the other new hires of where she’s employed. It won’t matter which school she went to. Your concern about “adds up over a lifetime” doesnt’ apply. it will depend on where she WORKS. </p>

30

<p>I call it informed decision making, mom2collegekids. College choice is a big, costly decision, one that is being provided by me, for her benefit. I would prefer not to get more “feedback” on this issue from you.</p>

31

<p>She could absolutely graduate making 50k as a BSN. Absolutely.</p>

32

<p>What mom2c said re salary - it is metropolitan area based and not based on what school you went to. She could go to community college and then transfer into a BSN program and make the same money.</p>

33

<p>That may be true in nursing but not business. School matters.</p>

34

<p>

</p>

<p>If that is the case, and the she is admitted directly into the nursing major, then Iowa will keep her options reasonably open for both majors, at least for now.</p>

<p>If she attends Iowa and wants neither nursing or business, most other majors do not require competitive admission to change into (exceptions listed here: <a href=“Majors, Minors, and Certificates | College of Liberal Arts and Sciences”>Majors, Minors, and Certificates | College of Liberal Arts and Sciences; ). Changing into the College of Liberal Arts and Sciences is not difficult (see <a href=“Changing Colleges”>http://admissions.uiowa.edu/academics/changing-colleges&lt;/a&gt; ).</p>

35

<p>As a midwesterner (Michigan), I regard these three universities as outstanding flagship state universities, among the best in the country. I agree with mom2collegekids: there’s no market advantage from attending one over the other of these universities. A student’s career choice, and where they live after graduation, are far more important to their financial situation. But what they study also matters, and by that I don’t mean only what they major in but also what skill set they move to moderate to advanced levels, including writing, math, science, among others.</p>

<p>It is possible to get an outstanding education at any one of these: IU, Iowa, and UIUC. It’s also possible to lose sight of the core opportunities available at such strong institutions, by going overboard on the ‘extracurricular’ side – not referring to athletics or other organized options, but rather to not giving adequate priority to the curricular side of college. I’m thinking of a study reported yesterday by the Pew Research Center, in which 75% of young college grads regret that they didn’t study harder, gain more work experience, or start looking for work earlier (probably worthwhile getting a copy of the original study): <a href=“Widest earnings gap for college grads in 48 years”>http://finance.yahoo.com/news/widest-earnings-gap-college-grads-172803584.html&lt;/a&gt;.&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Both of my kids wanted smaller colleges, so neither ended up at a large state university. My daughter expressly stated, “I don’t want to find myself in a college class sitting next to people from my high school.” She scatted about 750 miles east of here and to art school, but later earned an MBA and works in the field of sustainable product development. My son wanted a college where it was safe to be a “thinker” but where the students weren’t blowhearted “intellectuals.” He ended up 200 miles from here at a private college in a large city, majored in economics, and now works as a statistician. We were happy to defer to their interests and preferences for types of college and locations, knowing that they probably couldn’t go wrong in deciding among the small number of places they applied to, and that getting a solid undergraduate education was foundational to a very wide range of future careers. Both aimed to live in a big city after graduation, and that’s just what they’re doing now (NYC).</p>

<p>Again, our position was to help them make good choices of college but neither we nor they were fixated on a particular list of colleges or a particular one. Nor were we in the business of choosing their careers for them. They’ve done that all by themselves.</p>

36

<p>Pretty sure she could go to either of those three schools and get a solid, competitive business education, barrons, with Indiana and Illinois being a smidge more prestigious than Iowa (but not by much). But a nurse is a nurse is a nurse. Really interested to hear what the kid wants to do though.</p>

37

<p>Getting into the U of I College of Nursing is not a slam dunk. For early admission, high school students must have a minimum 28 ACT Composite score, a minimum 3.8 or higher GPA,a minimum 25 ACT Science Reasoning Score, and no deficiencies in the minimum high school course requirements. Of the 128 total nursing students admitted, up to 64 can be early admits. Good luck! We need great nurses out there!</p>

<p><a href=“https://www.nursing.uiowa.edu/academic-programs/bsn/early-decision”>https://www.nursing.uiowa.edu/academic-programs/bsn/early-decision&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

38

<p>My point is that companies recruiting at various schools and doing most of their hiring from that pool will vary by the school. Less important in actting and most in finance. </p>

39

<p>Everything about this thread says “train wreck,” from the daughter who is apparently ready to sign up for a nursing program because she likes fashion, music, money, and a boy, to the mother who is hell-bent on directing her daughter to a major in which the daughter apparently has no interest and is obsessed with prestige which doesn’t matter to the daughter . . . but hold on!, the prestige obsession may only be a ruse to separate the daughter and her boyfriend . . . .</p>

<p>I can’t wait for the threads next year: My daughter is blowing her merit scholarship! My mom railroaded me to a place I hate and now I want to transfer but it’s going to cost too much!</p>

40

<p>msd228, mom2collegekids is expressing things a lot of us feel. You are coming across as heavy-handed and attaching a lot of conditions to your daughter’s decision. We all get how much college costs and understand that we will be paying the bills. Many of us also have stubborn teenagers and understand that dynamic as well. </p>

<p>I have seen too many parents seriously damage (or outright ruin) their relationships with their kids over the choices that are being made at this time in their lives. Obviously you are a caring and concerned parent and you are doing a lot of research, which is great. Just try to look at the long view! </p>