Minority (AA) Parents in NY

<p>My D is a junior at public high school and I'm not too familar with the admissions process.</p>

<p>She wants to be a bio or chem major and minor in film. She does not want to go to anallblack school. She wants a diverse campus. The only diverse ones are the SUNY schools such as Stonybrook and Binghampton. Can you give me some pointers on what schools to choose on east coast. She is six feet tall but doesn't play basketball. if thats what it takes to get into a top school, she'll have to practice her jumpshot.</p>

<p>Stats:
Junior Black Female in NYC Public School
SAT:May 2005
SAT II: Taking Math II in JUne
AP English and US History in May
GPA: 92</p>

<p>Curriculum:
9th-Honors Geometry, Honors Biology, Global, Spanish 3,4, English, Art
10th-Honors Algebra, Honors Chemistry, Global, Spanish 5,6, English
11th-AP US History, Honors English, Physics, Math B, College Business Course, Medical Lab
12th- WILL BE AP Calc AB, AP Biology, English....</p>

<p>ECs:
Altar Server (9,10,11)
School Step Team (10,11)
Church Youth Group (9,10,
Church Sunday School Assistant (9,10,11)
Church Choir (11)
History trip to Paris (10)
S-prep courses (chemistry) at Columbia University (10)
Volunteer in Dean's office at school (10,11)
Gateway Institute for Pre-College Education (9,10,11)
Worked in Pediatric Ward at hospital (9)
American Chemical Society Project seed (10& 11) (research lab)
Fashion Model
NAACP Act-SO Competition</p>

<p>Leadership:
Leader of Step Team in Fall</p>

<p>Awards:
Student of the month_Social Studies
Perfect attendance
Second Award and NAACP award at NYC Science and Engineering Fair</p>

<p>She looks like she is taking a very challenging set of courses and doing well in them. Do you have a sense of how she will be doing in the SAT (based on her PSAT performance)? She could be admissible at a number of highly selective colleges. Some that are diverse and where she could feel quite comfortable are: Brown and Wesleyan. Harvard and Yale are reaches for everyone, but they do have visible AA communities. For film studies, she should consider NYU..
Maybe Sybbie can make further suggestions. Her D got into Dartmouth from NYC.</p>

<p>Are you limiting it to certain parts of the country? Does she prefer rural, suburban or urban? Its very hard to tell until we know her SAT scores. What was her PSAT?</p>

<p>Her PSATs are horrible.</p>

<p>51 crit/ 46 math 58 writing skills. she had 155 indeex. </p>

<p>She is taking princeton review but her practice tests are not getting higher. I really don't know what to do with her.</p>

<p>Relax. Thed GPA is more indicative of college success than SAT scores according to many adcoms. What is her GPA?</p>

<p>She will likely get into many reputable schools. There are dozens we can think of but you'll need to get it narrowed down before many of us can spurt them out. Location and size would help. It is sad to say but at most schools the diversity is lacking and 5-15% African American is about the range you will see.</p>

<p>Bard College, you don't have to send SAT scores and they are looking for students interested in the sciences plus have a decent film department. They have special scholarships for NY residents as well. Check out the website.</p>

<p>why does she want to stay on east coast?
LA area is great for film- you might want to look at Occidental- great school and very diverse</p>

<p>If you feel that her GPA is a much better indication of her abilities than the SAT, look into colleges that do not require the SAT.
<a href="http://www.fairtest.org%5B/url%5D"&gt;www.fairtest.org&lt;/a>
The colleges which will try to recruit her the hardest are the ones that seek to increase their African-American representation. Despite their efforts, they are not as successful as they would wish, partly because of their rural location which is not appealing to city-raised kids. Your D may feel comfortable in such colleges. Among them are some excellent ones: Bates, Bowdoin, Mt Holyoke come to mind as colleges that do not require the SAT. </p>

<p>For practice on the SAT, look up tips by Xiggi and ask her to use the 10RealSATs. Many have found these more useful than PR.</p>

<p>Thanks for the advice. I don't know why she likes film. I know she watches alot of T.V. and she knows the character's lines before they say it.</p>

<p>She does want to be a pediatrician.</p>

<p>I hope she can get atleast an 1800 on the SAT's. We will see on May 7 on how well she does. </p>

<p>I hope she can raise her 92 avg this semester</p>

<p>Connecticut College doesn't require SAT Is -- You can submit SATIIs or ACT -- log onto the website for more information: <a href="http://www.conncoll.edu%5B/url%5D"&gt;www.conncoll.edu&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>She should defintely take the ACT exam. Its a different sort of test and some do better on it than the SAT. Both are accepted at almost every school. The good news about the ACT is that no one has to see it if she does not do well. Unlike the SAT where you list schools before taking it and then they send in every score.</p>

<p>I have 2 more weeks to pressure her to review.</p>

<p>My suggestion is to get her an SAT tutor. Some kids like my younger S simply refuse to review on their own (In fact I think that most kids are like this!), but will do so if structured by a tutor.</p>

<p>Try Fordham or Syracuse. I know that Syracuse has a very well regarded film school. It also is very diverse and has been admitting AAs since the early 1900s. Because her grades are solid, I think your D has a shot at both colleges.</p>

<p>I agree that F and S are two excellent suggestions. Also consider Rutgers, Northeastern, Drexel, Temple.</p>

<p>
[quote]
I hope she can get atleast an 1800 on the SAT's. We will see on May 7 on how well she does.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>I don't think those scores are going to do much for her cause is she is looking for selective schools as the pool even among african americans is becoming more competive.</p>

<p>Over the next few years, the competition to get into college especially selective schools is going to be really stiff just because of the sheer number of applicanats (this includes URMs). </p>

<p>From the Journal of Blacks in Higher Education </p>

<p><a href="http://www.jbhe.com/latest/100704_b...lment_yale.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.jbhe.com/latest/100704_b...lment_yale.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>*Yale Tops the Ivy League in Black Freshman Enrollments: *</p>

<p>JBHE has completed its annual collection of data on black first-year enrollments at the eight Ivy League colleges and universities. Blacks make up 9.3 percent of the first-year students at Yale University this fall. This is the highest rate in the Ivy League and the highest rate at Yale in the past decade. A year ago, only 6.7 percent of the entering class at Yale was black. </p>

<p>Harvard University also had a good year in attracting black students. There are 145 black freshmen at Harvard this fall. They make up 8.9 percent of the first-year class. </p>

<p>At the University of Pennsylvania, Princeton University, and Dartmouth College, blacks make up slightly more than 7 percent of the entering class. At Columbia University and Brown University, blacks are 6.8 percent of the freshman classes. </p>

<p>As has been the case for the past 13 years since JBHE began collecting statistics on black first-year enrollments in the Ivy League colleges, Cornell University has the smallest percentage of blacks in its entering class. This fall blacks are 4.7 percent of the freshman class at Cornell. </p>

<p><a href="http://www.jbhe.com/latest/021005_a...th-harvard.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.jbhe.com/latest/021005_a...th-harvard.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>Black Applicants Surge at Harvard and Dartmouth: </p>

<p>Harvard reported this past week that it received a total of 22,717 applications for the class that will enter this fall. The number of applicants rose by 15 percent from last year's total. Black applications for the freshman class increased at an even higher rate. Harvard reports that black applicants increased 28.3 percent from last year. A university spokesperson stated that the huge jump in applicants may be due to the new Harvard Financial Aid Initiative, which essentially eliminates out-of-pocket tuition and room and board expenses for students who come from families with incomes of less than $40,000 per year. </p>

<p>In the year after the Cornel West controversy, black enrollments dipped slightly at Harvard. Now it appears that Harvard has weathered that storm as well as last summer's controversy surrounding the denial of tenure to African-American studies professor Marcyliena Morgan. This denial of tenure caused Professor Morgan and her husband, Lawrence Bobo, the esteemed sociologist and member of the National Academy of Sciences, to take tenured teaching positions at Stanford. </p>

<p>At Dartmouth College, overall applications surged to their highest level in history. The admissions office reports that applications from "students of color" represented 25 percent of the total pool. Applications from blacks were at their highest level in the past four years. Good evidence that a frigid winter climate does not necessarily deter black applications to a college that is otherwise seen as receptive to black students. </p>

<p>Because there are more applicants applying to both of these schools this year, the 44% admit rate that Blacks got admitted into Dartmouth in the class of 08, is most likely going to decrease for the class decrease this year.</p>

<p>What does this mean overall for blacks; every one has to step up their game as being a URM is still going to be a hook, the pool in this population is going to be more competitive, whith more choices given to those that bring the overall "A" game to the table, as the pool is also participating in more rigerous courses offered by their school.</p>

<p><a href="http://www.jbhe.com/latest/022405_a...entcourses.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.jbhe.com/latest/022405_a...entcourses.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>*Black Participation in Particular Advanced Placement Courses: *</p>

<p>In 2004 more than 78,000 African-American students took Advanced Placement examinations. Blacks now make up 5 percent of all Advanced Placement test takers nationwide. For both blacks and whites, English literature, American history, English composition, and calculus were the most popular AP courses. Blacks were 6.9 percent of all students who took the AP test in French literature. This was the highest participation percentage for any of the 34 AP subject tests. Blacks were also at least 6 percent of all test takers in the subject areas of English literature, world history, macroeconomics, and French language. </p>

<p>The lowest level of black participation was on the Spanish literature test. Only 56 black students nationwide took the AP test in Spanish literature in 2004. They were only 0.6 percent of all test takers in this subject. Blacks were also less than 2 percent of all AP test takers in the subject areas of electrical and magnetic physics, Spanish language, computer science, and German. </p>

<p>Also keep in mind..</p>

<p>*Black Students Are Beginning to Seize the Early Admission Advantage *</p>

<p><a href="http://www.jbhe.com/features/43_early_admission.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.jbhe.com/features/43_early_admission.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>just an excerpt.. read entire article</p>

<p>At the nation's highest-ranked colleges and universities, the percentage of college-bound blacks who apply for early decision has always been far below the black percentage of the total applicant pool. The reason that college-bound blacks generally shun the binding commitments of the early admissions process is that their acceptance commitment cuts them off from the process of negotiating a favorable financial aid package from competing universities. </p>

<p>But JBHE statistics show that black students are now beginning to apply for early admission in much larger numbers.
In past years college-bound blacks have been much less likely than whites to seek early admission to the nation's highest-ranked colleges and universities. African Americans have avoided making the binding commitment to enroll if accepted because the rules of early decision eliminate their chances to "play the field" and consider a wide range of financial offers from competing universities. As a result, blacks have not been able to take advantage of the fact that early decision applicants generally achieve a much higher acceptance rate than applicants who choose to go the regular route. </p>

<p>For African Americans, the early decision process is assuming greater importance for the simple reason that early decision applications now make up a very large percentage of all admissions decisions. For example, this past winter Princeton University admitted 581 students under its binding early decision admissions program. This group is about one half of the freshman class that will enroll at Princeton this coming fall. </p>

<p>*Blacks Who Applied for Early Admission in 2004 *</p>

<p>JBHE has surveyed the nation's highest-ranked colleges and universities to determine how the controversial issue of early admissions actually affects black access to higher education, particularly admissions to our most selective institutions. JBHE asked each of the nation's 25 highest-ranked universities and the 25 highest-ranked liberal arts colleges for this year's early admissions data. Some of the nation's highest-ranked institutions such as Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Amherst, Williams, Stanford, Dartmouth, Duke, and Columbia declined to participate in our survey. </p>

<p>We believe that the reason for this reluctance has to do with the fact that at most highly ranked colleges and universities there is only a very small trickle of black early decision applicants. Publication of this shortfall tends to hurt a school's reputation for its commitment to racial diversity. It is likely, although by no means certain, that universities and colleges missing from our statistics have a low percentage of black early applicants.</p>

<p>sybbie; you are such a font of knowledge! Loved reading that post...</p>

<p>Paul,</p>

<p>Mount Holyoke is also SAT optional.</p>

<p>How are her regents scores in context to her GPA? (They would be looked at if she is applying to the SUNY/CUNY schools and even some of the colleges in NYC because they woudl be familiar with the NYC public school system).</p>

<p>Depending on her SAT scores, don't rule of the CUNY honors program or the Sophie B Davis School of Bio Medical Education as Dartmouth Medical School has just become a Partner
<a href="http://dms.dartmouth.edu/news/2005_h1/02feb2005_partnership.shtml%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://dms.dartmouth.edu/news/2005_h1/02feb2005_partnership.shtml&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>Does your school rank? if yes where does she fall?</p>

<p>I would suggest that you obtain a copy of the profile which your school send out to the colleges as part of their recommendation package (ask the guidance counselor).</p>

<p>If you cannot get this information, I would suggest that you look up your school on the board of ed website </p>

<p><a href="http://www.nycboe.net/default.aspx%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.nycboe.net/default.aspx&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>there you should be able to find the average SAT scores for your school, graduation rates, etc. This way you could see how she scores in relations to others at her school.</p>

<p>I also sent you a PM</p>

<p>She has a 90 or above on all Regents exams. Her Ap test is the day before the regents and she wants to focus on studying for that than the SAT. I'm just getting so depressed about this.</p>

<p>Just so you know, if I translate her PSAT scores into SAT scores, they would be a 510, 460. That puts her at about the 76th percentile on her verbal for African Americans and at the 60th percentile for math for African Americans.</p>

<p>This is based on info that the College Board published in 2003. Unfortunately, since then, they don't seem to have put this kind of racial info on-line, and they seem to have taken off the info that I downloaded then. However, I imagine that the percentiles have stayed about the same. Unfortunately, African Americans are the group in the US who perform worst on the SATs when one looks at scores by race and ethnicity.</p>

<p>What this means for your D is that you can't write off colleges because her scores seem low for them. A big advantage that your D has that many African Americans don't have is that she has been taking honors and AP classes. In addition, her gpa is strong.</p>

<p>GPA predicts college performance better than SAT does, so that also will help your daughter. It also would be to her advantage to apply to colleges that deemphasize standardized test scores.</p>

<p>I also am wondering if she practiced for the PSAT. From what I have seen, far more white and Asian students take tutoring and do regular practice (such as an hour a day over the summer) for the PSAT. Most black students, however, seem to see it as mainly a test of luck or simply a practice for the SAT. As a result, they may not perform up to their potential on the PSAT.</p>

<p>Anyway, I don't think you should be discouraged. I believe your daughter has good chances to get into some nice colleges including Syracuse and Fordham, which I believe both have the major/minor possibilities she's considering.</p>

<p>Paulchem. I also say relax. Your daughter has excellent grades in school, which are a bit more important to colleges than exam scores because they indicate consistency. As an AA with such grades (make sure she keeps them up there) she'll be a highly desirable applicant at many schools.</p>

<p>On top of that, I don't think that Harvard and Yale have particularly good film departments, if they have them at all. If your D is serious aout a film program (and that could change between now and next April -yessirree, it could change), then start the search by looking for schools with decent film programs, bacause many schools will have decent chemistry and biology programs.</p>

<p>Think about the suitabiity for her of larger vs. smaller school, urban vs, suburban vs. small-town or rural school, and the cost factor. There are a lot of good schools in the east that offer merit aid, and it sounds like she could easily qualify for some (see the merit aid thread at the top of this board).</p>

<p>Good luck and keep asking questions here.</p>