<p>As a response to if Stanford is really laid-back...I think it's a stereotype. Like most, it's based on some truth but a lot of exaggeration. I would say yes, people do sort of hang back, but don't be deceived for a minute-everyone (ok I should say most people) are giving it their all. I think that it would be pretty uneven (and untestable) to say that MIT's rigor >Stanford's rigor. Perhaps overall, there is no question that MIT students work harder than Stanford ones. But most of MIT's students are techies, while not so many at Stanford are techies (but there are still many) I think that if you are looking for challenging courses at either school, you won't have to look very far. Again, if OP is as passionate about all things math and science, he should try out the accelerated series in math and physics. Again, no one would go through either (and definitely not both) series complaining that there was not enough rigor in it for them. I think it would be a mistake to pick one school over the other at the risk of not being challenged or finding like-minded folks when we are talking about the premier engineering and science schools in the nation. That being said, from what I've seen, it seems like you'd be more comfortable at MIT, so I don't have any reserves telling you that if that's where you feel more at home, that's where you should go. But definitely give Stanford a chance =)</p>
<p>Morsmordre: I don't think people are saying Stanford students aren't working hard. I think the argument is that MIT students are often pushed (usually by themselves) to not-healthy levels of being hosed and learn how to sustain it. It's not necessarily a good thing from a "learning" perspective, but it does build a certain type character. </p>
<p>As one of my professors put it to me: "You know if I took a red hot branding iron and scarred you for life with some insignia? Well the idea of this course is that I'm going to brand you with the ideas and tools. It will probably be pretty painful. Oh well."</p>
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Hey, I tell the tale that I heard told. That's the view Stanford biology graduate students have of Stanford undergraduates.</p>
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I also mentioned in my blog entry that they have until 2029 to change the policy. ;) (Although I think that puts me having children in 2011, which is not really that long from now, and I still have a lot of work to do on my PhD. So maybe they have until 2030 or 2031.)</p>
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Hey, I tell the tale that I heard told. That's the view Stanford biology graduate students have of Stanford undergraduates.
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<p>I would be careful of broad statements like that-I don't know how many Stanford biology graduate students you have met/or have spoken to about Stanford undergrads-but seeing as how I would guess that the most represented ugrad school at Stanford's graduate biology program is Stanford...I think its safe to say thats not how all (or even many) Stanford biology grad students feel about ugrads.</p>
<p>About legacy, I think I've got it. I think they just do that to get the addresses and mail the alums about why they should donate to MIT. It was sort of odd when MIT asked for donations in the mail merely 3 weeks after rejecting me...</p>
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but seeing as how I would guess that the most represented ugrad school at Stanford's graduate biology program is Stanford
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<p>Actually, I doubt this. In science, universities tend to encourage their undergrads to go elsewhere.</p>
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I would be careful of broad statements like that-I don't know how many Stanford biology graduate students you have met/or have spoken to about Stanford undergrads-but seeing as how I would guess that the most represented ugrad school at Stanford's graduate biology program is Stanford...I think its safe to say thats not how all (or even many) Stanford biology grad students feel about ugrads.
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Are these really the kinds of disclaimers necessary for reporting hearsay? I would have thought that was entirely obvious from the fact that I mentioned some casual conversations I'd had while interviewing for PhD programs at both Stanford and MIT.</p>
<p>I think that admitted student weekends are monumentally more useful for students admitted to two schools as great as Stanford and MIT than stereotype slinging on an internet message board. But while I'm here, I'm going to sling some stereotypes of my own, for sure.</p>
<p>^ Well we do have to remember that nothing is for sure, and every statement anyone ever utters is too broad. Why not write disclaimers instead of having content? The former is less likely to produce invalid claims. </p>
<p>(Hope the sarcasm is sensed.) :)</p>
<p>out of curiosity, mathboy, where do you go to college? Are you an MIT student?</p>
<p>Nope, I go to UC Berkeley, but hang around the forums of all the amazing math/science/engineering schools. =]</p>
<p>Also, which place is more materialistic? Which place does student tend to care less about superficial aspects like: clothes/ makeup/ computers/car... where lower income people can more easily be accepted socially?</p>
<p>I think it depends on the groups you hang out with. To be perfectly honest, the first few days here I thought I was going to be living with the children of really financially successful adults and that a lot of students here were really wealthy. Especially when people were talking about water polo as a sport...I thought it was a thing only rich people did (I was very ignorant lol) and that a few celeberties children were living in our dorm (won't disclose whom because it wouldn't be wise on the internet) On the water polo thing it turns out it's just because I'm from the East Coast and things are a little different on the west coast. I'd say that about 20-30% percent of the class would be classified as either low income or low-middle income students (and we also have quite a few Questbridgers) and those that are wealthy don't show it. Frosh aren't even allowed to have cars so there's no differentiating like that. The only noticable thing is how many northfaces there are here...but other than that as long as you don't hang out with the "snobs" (there are snobs at every college) you'll fit in just fine. I think classism is one of the smallest problems Stanford has to deal with to be perfectly honest- racial self segregation on the other hand is a different story.</p>
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Also, which place is more materialistic? Which place does student tend to care less about superficial aspects like: clothes/ makeup/ computers/car... where lower income people can more easily be accepted socially?
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There are certainly people at MIT who are very concerned with things like fashion, but most people aren't concerned.</p>
<p>MIT's student body is more working-class than many of its peer schools (though I don't know about in comparison to Stanford specifically), so being from a low-income background is neither unusual nor shameful. A large number of my friends, even those from higher-income backgrounds, worked for pay during college, and almost everybody was responsible for his/her own spending money, so we were pretty sensitive about not doing expensive things as a group.</p>
<p>Hey! Northfaces are awesome. They might be expensive but they are totally worth it. A thin northface jacket has saved me many times when I have crossed the Harvard Bridge. And they last years.</p>
<p>Wait Morsmordre - you're kidding about the "racial self segregation" thing, right? I've never been to Stanford but it just seems so bizarre that such a phenomenon would be a significant issue in such a place in this day and age.</p>
<p>Well as a black person I can attest to the fact that we like to hang around people like us.</p>
<p>All of the people I know at MIT practice 'race-blind' friendship...</p>
<p>I would agree that pretty much no one cares about cars, clothes, makeup, computers etc. that I've met, with a few qualifications:</p>
<p>People that care about cars, care about them in the context of 'that car is really awesome, when I graduate and make a lot of money I will buy one'. People that brag about their cars brag about all the cool upgrades that they did themselves.</p>
<p>People that care about clothes care about how utilitarian they are - like 'oh man that belt is awesome, you can fit like 8 multitools and your cell phone on it' or 'oh man I wish I had as many pockets as you do!'. Other people that care about clothes care about having awesome outfits for parties, or staying extremely warm in the winter.</p>
<p>People that care about computers care about processing power, what OS you're running, what games you play, and whether you built it yourself. No one really cares about brands - the only time I've actually had a conversation about computer brands was in the context of 'Thinkpads are so reliable, I spilled water on mine like four times and it's totally fine' or 'look at that girl's Alienware laptop, she could've gotten so much more processing power for so much cheaper, like seriously that's a waste of money'.</p>
<p>Makeup? I've gotten 2 responses. One is 'you're so much prettier when you don't wear makeup' and the other is 'wow, your makeup for this party is really cool!'</p>
<p>So, maybe it's just my friends, but no one I know really cares about having expensive things. It's more respectable to stalk Reuse and build your own expensive things than it is to buy them in my experience.</p>
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Well as a black person I can attest to the fact that we like to hang around people like us.
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<p>So am I, and I can attest to the fact that only those of us who are uncomfortable with our identity prefer to hang around people like us.</p>
<p>Aceflyer, I'm not kidding at all. I'm surprised you would think so. I've heard this is a problem at other top colleges as well, though not MIT specifically. Ethnic theme dorms do not help one bit to assauge this.</p>
<p>I hear that Stanford has some kind of "Golden Bubble" or something.</p>
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Aceflyer, I'm not kidding at all. I'm surprised you would think so. I've heard this is a problem at other top colleges as well, though not MIT specifically. Ethnic theme dorms do not help one bit to assauge this.
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<p>That's very interesting. I must say that this is the first time I've heard of this as a problem at America's top institutions. All I can say is that my own experiences have never given me cause to even suspect the existence of a significant amount of racial self segregation. But maybe MIT is different, or maybe it's just because I'm naive or ignorant.</p>