<p>My dad thinks that liberal arts colleges only churn out art majors :rolleyes: Although he's completely supportive of where I want to go for college, I think he's queasy about the idea of artless me going to a liberal arts college. </p>
<p>But I think I set it straight for him by going through some websites and showing him the offered majors :)</p>
<p>I'm really interested in applying to some liberal arts colleges because of the intimate classroom environments and the fantastic opportunities/atmosphere they provide. However, while I have convinced my dad that I'm not an aspiring artist, I'm not too sure myself on which liberal arts colleges have great science departments.</p>
<p>While I definitely want to minor in humanities, my main interest lies in conservation biology, environmental science, or psychology. </p>
<p>I've looked up the websites of most of the top liberal arts colleges, but since they all claim to have "top notch" facilities and departments, I'm having trouble differentiating. Any insight on liberal arts colleges with strong science departments would be extremely appreciated :)</p>
<p>Off the top of my head: Swarthmore, Williams, Reed, Carleton, St Olaf, Rhodes (read about Curmudgeon’s daughter who turned down Yale for Rhodes and has just been accepted into Yale Medical School)… LACS are by no means for the artsy students!</p>
<p>You could point out that most college guidebooks put Harvey Mudd College in the LAC group. They don’t even offer majors in any of the arts. Or most social sciences. Or much of anything not math or science related. But their holistic view of education puts them in the LAC field.</p>
<p>Excellent suggestions so far for environmental science. Carleton, Middlebury, and the Maine LACs are perhaps the best of all LACs for environmental science, in fact.</p>
<p>The following would also be worth investigation. It is by no means a comprehensive list.</p>
<p>Allegheny
Colgate
College of the Atlantic*
Colorado College
Conn College
Davidson
Denison
Eckerd
Oberlin
Skidmore
Warren Wilson*
Wesleyan
Whitman</p>
<p>It’s just one data point, but a friend’s kid got into the Physics PhD program at MIT after going to Williams for undergrad, so I assume Williams is decent in science.</p>
<p>Consider Dartmouth. It may be LAC-like enough to suit you but university-like enough to satisfy your dad. USNews ranks it number 1 among national universities in undergrad teaching.</p>
<p>Go to your local Library and check out College That Change Lives by Loren Pope. Let your Dad flip through that for an overview of LACs – many in there are very good in science. Rhodes, mentioned earlier in this thread, is one in there.</p>
<p>Percentage of grads getting PhDs in Engineering, Science, and Math</p>
<p>PhDs and Doctoral Degrees: ten years (1994 to 2003) from NSF database
Number of Undergraduates: ten years (1989 to 1998) from IPEDS database
Formula: Total PhDs divided by Total Grads </p>
<p>Note: Does not include colleges with less than 1000 graduates over the ten year period<br>
1 34% California Institute of Technology<br>
2 ** 24% Harvey Mudd College **
3 16% Massachusetts Institute of Technology<br>
4 ** 10% Reed College **
5 9% Rice University
6 ** 8% Swarthmore College **
7 8% Princeton University<br>
8 ** 7% Carleton College **
9 7% New Mexico Institute of Mining and Technology<br>
10 7% University of Chicago<br>
11 7% Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute<br>
12 7% Case Western Reserve University
13 6% Harvard University<br>
14 6% Carnegie Mellon University<br>
15 6% Johns Hopkins University<br>
16 ** 6% Haverford College **
17 ** 6% Grinnell College **
18 6% Cornell University, All Campuses<br>
19 ** 5% Kalamazoo College **
20 5% Stanford University
21 5% Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology
22 5% Yale University
23 5% Cooper Union<br>
24 ** 5% Oberlin College **
25 ** 5% Lawrence University **
26 ** 5% Bryn Mawr College **
27 ** 5% Williams College **
28 ** 5% Pomona College **
29 4% Colorado School of Mines<br>
30 ** 4% Bowdoin College **
31 ** 4% Earlham College **
32 4% Brown University<br>
33 4% University of Rochester
34 4% University of California-Berkeley<br>
35 ** 4% Wabash College **
36 4% Duke University
37 4% Worcester Polytechnic Institute
38 ** 4% Amherst College **
39 4% Stevens Institute of Technology
40 ** 4% St Olaf College **
41 ** 4% Hendrix College **
42 ** 4% Beloit College **
43 4% University of Missouri, Rolla<br>
44 4% University of California-San Francisco<br>
45 ** 4% Occidental College **
46 4% Alfred University, Main Campus<br>
47 ** 4% Allegheny College **
48 ** 4% Whitman College **
49 ** 4% College of Wooster **
50 4% SUNY College of Environmental Sci & Forestry<br>
51 ** 4% Mount Holyoke College **
52 ** 4% Bates College **
53 4% College of William and Mary
54 ** 4% Knox College **
55 ** 3% Franklin and Marshall College **
56 3% Georgia Institute of Technology, Main Campus<br>
57 3% Washington University<br>
58 3% Long Island University Southampton Campus<br>
59 ** 3% Macalester College **
60 3% University of California-San Diego<br>
61 3% Dartmouth College<br>
62 ** 3% Wellesley College **
63 3% Trinity University<br>
64 ** 3% Juniata College **
65 ** 3% Ripon College **
66 3% University of California-Davis<br>
67 3% Florida Institute of Technology
68 3% Polytechnic University<br>
69 3% Michigan Technological University<br>
70 3% Columbia University in the City of New York
71 3% Lehigh University<br>
72 3% University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign<br>
73 ** 3% Centre College **
74 ** 3% Hampshire College **
75 3% University of Pennsylvania<br>
76 ** 3% Wesleyan University **
77 3% University of Michigan at Ann Arbor
78 ** 3% Colorado College **
79 3% Bucknell University
80 ** 3% Davidson College **
81 3% Northwestern Univ<br>
82 3% Texas Lutheran University<br>
83 ** 3% St John's College (both campus) **
84 ** 3% Furman University **
85 ** 3% Hope College **
86 2% Clarkson University
87 2% University of Virginia, Main Campus
88 2% Illinois Institute of Technology<br>
89 2% Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State Univ<br>
90 ** 2% Union College (Schenectady, NY) **
91 2% University of California-Santa Cruz
92 ** 2% Lafayette College **
93 2% Brandeis University
94 2% University of Dallas<br>
95 ** 2% Rhodes College **
96 2% University of Notre Dame<br>
97 ** 2% Middlebury College **
98 2% University of Wisconsin-Madison
99 ** 2% Colgate University **
100 ** 2% Hiram College **
</p>
<p>If you look at the 8% rate for Swarthmore, consider that only about a third of the graduates are in science, math, and engineering. Thus, their PhD rate for those students is higher than for MIT graduates.</p>
<p>I’ll second Connecticut college- they have a huge arboretum for research (great for environmental science) and a Science Leaders program- they’re trying to recruit women/minorities and they have a freshman seminar just for the science leaders. My host was in the program. She’s very much a science gal, and some of the stuff looked fab:</p>
<p>Haverford ¶ and Wesleyan (CT) are phenomenal for science at LACs. Wesleyan These two routinely get some of the highest amounts of Howard Hughes grant funding, and have fantastic departments (Wesleyan has great environmental science and psychology). </p>
<p>Thanks everyone for your replies! This is beyond helpful.</p>
<p>coureur: That’s really interesting. I haven’t taken a close look at the Ivies yet because I’ve been told that they often have bigger class sizes and less undergrad opportunities. A friend of mine goes to Dartmouth so I’ll be sure to ask her about it.</p>
<p>susanr64: Wow, I didn’t know that. Even Stanford doesn’t have a Zoology department.</p>
<p>smartalic34: Thanks for the wiki quote. I reiterated it to my dad and he’s trying to change his original definition of liberal arts colleges now. I’ve told him that all of those subjects (with the exception of math) interest me and he’s warming up to the idea. </p>
<p>Longhaul: I just reserved the book in my local library. I appreciate the suggestion and will have fun flipping through it and feeding it to my dad.</p>
<p>warblersrule86/Yurtle: I took a look at all those links and Connecticut college seems like a beautiful place. I’m glad you guys listed these colleges since my knowledge is rather limited I’m only familiar with the top liberal arts colleges that are more commonly talked about on CC, so all these suggestions are great!</p>
<p>interesteddad: Thanks for the statistics. I also showed my dad and now he’s finally convinced that I’m not actually harboring some secret desire to be the next Van Gogh :)</p>
<p>And to everyone else that I couldn’t get to in my post, I also give out my thanks! It’s great to know that there are so many liberal arts colleges out there that will allow me to pursue my interests in both humanities and science.</p>
<p>Would you say that having a great environmental science department correlates to having a good biology department as well? I currently want to pursue conservation (specifically marine conservation), but am indecisive about my major and the exact pathway I want to take.</p>
<p>One group of colleges that doesn’t get mentioned all that often is “Masters Universities”. These are schools where the highest degree is a masters degree (although some have limited doctoral/professional programs). These schools have the “feel” of a LAC but they don’t fall into that category for some reason.</p>
<p>DD is getting her engineering degree at Santa Clara University which is the #2 (according to USNews) Masters university in the west (behind Trinity-San Antonio). Santa Clara has a highly regarded engineering program and is located smack in the Silicon Valley. The nice things about this school…smaller classes, very good accessibililty to the professors, and no teaching assistants teaching classes. All classes are taught by the professors. </p>
<p>Check out the Masters Universities. They are so under represented on this forum…and there are some excellent schools amongst them.</p>
This is beyond helpful.</p>
I’m only familiar with the top liberal arts colleges that are more commonly talked about on CC, so all these suggestions are great!</p>