mother refuses to give info for CSS Profile

Paying for College
1

hi so my mother is really old and has antiquated ideas about financial aid and where all her information is going. for the past two years i’ve been able to get her information for both the FAFSA / CSS Profile. However, this year she has gotten extremely paranoid and while I was able to get processed the FAFSA, she refuses to give me the necessary information for the CSS Profile. Adding more complications, she hasn’t filed her taxes because her tax guy has been continuously lying to her and she’s in denial and refuses to do anything about it until he reaches out to her and gives her back her documents but she won’t do anything about it. I am completely dependent on her to pay for college as i am POOR and cannot afford the school I go to by myself at all.

Because of these issues and her refusal to do anything about it, I have decided that I want to take out as many loans as I can just so I can have more independence in my life away from her despite the debt that is already singing my name. Like I said previously, the FAFSA has been processed but I just decided to do this now, so I am not really sure if i can even get loans at this time considering the FAFSA has been processed. I emailed my schools finaid already but they’re horrible at responding (as per usual.)

Because of the time frame, I’m 100% sure she’ll get audited if her taxes ever get filed which makes it even harder for her to believe that it’s fine for her to give me the information for the CSS Profile. My school requires the CSS Profile for any aid at all and I am so frustrated because I can’t seem to get any independence or help from my mother. Please, if you have any advice to give, it would be greatly appreciated.

PS: pls do not speak on relationships you know nothing about :slight_smile:

2

How old are you and how much money do you need? Start there.

Then, have you already taken out the federal loans for this coming year? You do realize that nobody is going to lend you more than that- right?

Who is going to co-sign your loans if not your mother?

3

Talk to your school. If you have the FAFSA completed, and it is similar to the prior two years, the school might (might!) be willing to award you similar financial aid. Your only hope is to ask and explain that your mother will not update the information.

If you have the FAFSA filled out, you can take out the student loans for your year (junior?)

4

@blossom i’m 21!
and no i didn’t realize that because i didn’t know that. she was never my co-signer as my previous loans are under my name and my name only. however, i am not sure i can get the loans without the CSS Profile which is the issue- right?

5

@twoinanddone ohhh okay, so loans are dependent on the FAFSA? sorry im a little clueless about this. the whole issue is so new to me i’m not entirely sure on all the technicalities.
and yes, it will be my junior year :slight_smile:

6

Do you have any other relatives that can talk to her? You say she is really old - how old is really old? If she has recently become paranoid, and difficult to deal with, it might be a sign of dementia. I know easier said than done, but if she is willing to let you take care of things for her (particularly if you can get her to sign a power of attorney), it might benefit you both to do so. If not, you might contact her doctor - he can’t tell you anything about your care, BUT he CAN listen to anything you have to say about her condition, and then when he sees her he can do an assessment.

Let her know that waiting for her tax preparer to contact her is a bad idea - SHE is the one that is responsible for paying any back taxes, and any penalties that accrue. If he has completed her tax return, he is legally bound to give her copies - WHEN IT IS FILED. If he has not, he is legally bound to return her documents, so that it can be completed elsewhere. If it is not filed, you will run into problems with the FAFSA next year, assuming you can convince her to release the information at that point.

Unfortunately if your mother is as old as you suggest, the tables might be turned fairly soon, and you might be caring for her. I wish you both luck.

7

@degreesbyfees

How much loans do you need? You can take a federally funded direct loan of $7500 if you are a junior or a senior…and really that is IT for loans in your name only. If you need more than this amount, you would need a qualified cosigner. Do you have a qualified cosigner who is willing to co-sign college loans for your?

What years has your mom not completed her taxes? If you are a junior on 2018-2019, she would need 2016 taxes completed. Are those done?

For 2019-2020, you would need 2017 taxes completed…but that is for the academic year beginning fall 2019. Having said that, unless she filed for an extension for 2017 tax completion…she is late.

Getting the federally funded $7500 loan is yours only…and available by completing the 2018-2019 FAFSA for this academic year. This has NOTHING to do with the CSS Profile. BUT if your mom hasn’t done her 2016 income taxes, you could have issues as the school will either expect you to use the IRS DRT, or get a 2016 tax transcript.

So…answer these questions.

  1. How much in loans do you need?
  2. Has your mom completed and submitted her 2016 tax return?

Where is your dad in this saga?

Is there any other family member who could help you get this info from your mom…and anyway…what are you missing for the Profile that wasn’t on your already sub,itted FAFSA?

8

@thumper1
thanks for the reply as it was incredibly informative. i need as much as I can take. my tuition falls in the 65000 range, but I know now getting loans for all that is impossible. finding any way that I can minimize the cost is my main goal.

she has given her tax guy her 2016 documents but even after repeated communications from him that he was going to get to them (jan), had actually done them (march), was going to send it to us (june&july)… he has not returned her documents, has become completely unresponsive, and has lied to both her and me about actually filing and returning the documents. ( i apologize if that was redundant). he also has not filed any kind of extension on the 2016 taxes and she has not done her 2017 taxes and has not filed an extension for those either.

there is no father in this tale, they got divorced in the 80s and he hasn’t been in this picture once. i have a sister, but she and my mother aren’t on talking terms. The missing info on the CSS is home/mortgage based & retirement based. She (my mother) has said that she has no idea who out there will come into contact w/ her information (particularly retirement) and doesn’t trust her family not to come and take whatever she has left because it’s “human nature” and thus has refused to give me those 3 items of information to complete the CSS Profile.
Another reason why I am so fixated on the CSS Profile is bc the previous two years I was awarded a grant from my school which my mother now deems less important than her concerns about privacy. (& to each their own but you can see where this gets really cornered.)

9

@CTScoutmom your answer about the loans was incredibly helpful so thank you. I don’t have another qualified co-signer in my family so I guess that’s where my road stops with that one. she is also about to be 71 years old.

10

Look online for the contact information of your local Better Business Bureau.

Call the office of the tax preparer and let them know that you have reported them to the BBB to open an investigation into their business practices. And that you have retained a lawyer to seek damages (if they ask what damages, say it’s the penalty for late filing… and whatever else the lawyer deems appropriate in this case. Perhaps malpractice if your preparer is a CPA).

You do not need to hire a lawyer in order to threaten someone with legal action. This should all take under five minutes and then you can get back to focusing on YOU.

Your dad was divorced from your mom in the 1980’s and you are only a college junior? Can you clarify this?

Have you sat your mom down and told her that without her cooperation you will need to take a leave of absence from college? What exactly is her plan for you if you can’t complete your degree?

11

@blossom
okay, your info about contacting the BBB was very useful, thank you.
to clarify, I was adopted when my mom was 50.
She and I have had various talks about how her lack of cooperation makes it incredibly difficult for her or me to continue having a relatively comfortable life. However, she has said its her money so we will do it her way and thats a valid argument i suppose. She says she’ll continue to try and pay for it out of pocket, but realistically she is putting herself into a situation where she wont be able to care for herself or the home in the future due to lack of finances.

12

Even if they divorced in 1989…how could you then be only 21 years old?

13

@thumper1 okay sorry i got the date wrong, it was in 1979. and again, i was adopted when my mother was 50. i used father as an umbrella term for my other two sisters, my bad. i was raised under a single mother essentially.

14

I see your clarification now.

I think your only option is to take a leave of absence from your school for a year…and get this all sorted out. The tax situation for 2016, 2017 and 2018 need to be completed. Your school isn’t going to award you any need based aid without those 2016 taxes completed. The vast majority of colleges require either use if the IRS DRT or the tax transcript…without one of those for,the 2016 tax year, it’s likely you won’t see aid for the 2018-2019 academic year.

Have you checked your student portal? It’s possible you have been selected for verification.

I would also strongly suggest you talk to a trusted relative, another adult, perhaps a clergy person…someone…about this situation. You need someone to help you help your mom.

15

Let me just get the familial facts clarified.

You are the adopted daughter of a single mom; your mom has never been married since her divorce from a man in 1979 who is not attached to you in any way shape or form. You were born in 1999 or thereabouts. You have two older sisters. Your mom is 71.

Your current college costs approximately 65K per year. You have been receiving need based aid, plus your federal loan, plus whatever your mom could pay out of pocket.

To be clear- I’m not suggesting some version of your “various talks” where you discuss her unfiled taxes, her unwillingness to provide information to financial aid, etc. I’m suggesting that you sit down and let her know that without her cooperation you will be taking a leave of absence from college (it’s really your only option, so it’s not a threat- that’s what you’re going to need to do) and that you’d like her help in figuring out what your life is going to look like without college or without a degree. That’s what you need to be discussing- not having yet another “various talk” about how it’s her money (which it surely is) or it’s on her to file her taxes on time or pay the penalty (again, that’s her problem) or how she doesn’t want her family knowing how much money she has.

But a clear discussion where you say :Mom, I can’t get aid for next year without your cooperation. I am taking a leave of absence. Now what?"

if she is under the illusion that there is a bank out there who will lend 50K to a 21 year old without a co-signer, collateral, or a credit history, she needs to be disabused of that. And if she is under the illusion that your college will increase your aid because she is uncooperative with her tax information, again you need to tell her that this is a fantasy.

16

@blossom @thumper1
thank you both for your thorough and supportive feedback, it was incredibly helpful and you have given me a lot of solutions/advice to mull over and execute.
i appreciate the candor you both provided for my situation, wish me luck and i send you both positivity! :slight_smile:

17

I am yet to fill out my first FAFSA or CSS (will soon though), and I’m not an CPA or tax attorney, but what are the chances that the OP can tell her mother she can no longer claim her as a dependent on her yet to be filed taxes. Will that allow her to receive any more financial aid? Of course, she’ll be on the hook for all expenses, but that might not be any different than it already is…

18

@PepperJo

Tax filing status has absolutely NOTHING to do with dependency for financial aid purposes.

Even IF the mom doesn’t declare the kiddo on the mom’s taxes, the kiddo will still be required to provide her mom’s financial information on the FAFSA and Profile forms.

19

Dependency for tax purposes follows very strict rules. If she is a dependent, she is not entitled to simply tell someone they can’t claim her. And as thumper1 points out, dependency is irrelevant for financial aid. A student can move out at 18, and fully support themselves, and still be required to provide parental information. In fact, the formulas are that way to discourage people taking a gap year in order to establish such independence for aid purposes.

20

Please contact your sister, and let her know what is happening, because the two of you are going to have to care for your mother, or find someone else to do so. She is worried about what family members are going to do with her money, yet she has given her tax documents to a tax preparer who hasn’t done anything with them!

While reporting him to the Better Business Bureau is a good idea, threatening to report him to the IRS for being in violation of Circular 230 is a much stronger threat. Circular 230 are the regulations governing tax preparation and doing business with the IRS. If he is paid to file tax returns, he is subject to them, and risks heavy fines if he ends up on their radar. Once they assess a penalty, they may review his book of business to see how many others he’s treated this way.

As for your mother, please talk to her doctor. If these are early signs of dementia, and it is progressive, you could find yourself in a position where you can’t return to school at all, because you are likely to become her primary caretaker if she can’t care for herself. Right now, she may be very adept at covering her lapses, but changes in personality, apathy, and paranoia are all early signs that something may be wrong. When my father was no longer able to cover for my mother, we discovered taxes hadn’t been filed for 7 years - yet my mother insisted they had, and that the IRS was lying or wrong (I’m a tax consultant, I recognized the clues when I discovered a final default notice in my father’s name, saying he owed almost $50,000 in back taxes from a single year). You want those taxes filed, because if they are not completed by three years after the due date, she will forfeit any refund, and if she owes, she racking up penalties and interest. If you just finished your Sophomore year, then you were in college in 2016, which means you most likely qualify her for the American Opportunity Credit - that’s $2500 for each year that she is essentially throwing away, if she doesn’t file those returns.

If she knows she’s not doing well mentally, and is trying her best to hide it, telling her you can’t return to school might be a turning point. It might be relatively easy to maintain the façade during summer break, but if you don’t return to school, she will be faced with maintaining it much longer. And if you do return to school and she is having trouble, you run the very real risk of being called home to care for her in an emergency. That’s hard enough to do as a full adult, with the ability to drop everything; it’s entirely different if it happens to you in the middle of the semester, or worse a week before finals. This is the type of thing nobody thinks about when adopting or having kids at 50.