<p>Would it be worth it to get both a master's degree in engineering and an MBA after undergrad? Several schools offer this option, and it usually does not extend your time in school by all that much. I've heard from some of those in industry that many tech companies will want both degrees as you climb higher up the ladder. I thought it might also open up some more career opportunities if you weren't sure where you wanted to go after undergrad.</p>
<p>If you want to go into Operations/Management or make the "real big bucks" in engineering, a M.B.A will help.</p>
<p>Its not essential to earn one right out of college if you work with a company for a few years and show interest, usually the company will fund your advanced studies.</p>
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Would it be worth it to get both a master's degree in engineering and an MBA after undergrad? Several schools offer this option, and it usually does not extend your time in school by all that much. I've heard from some of those in industry that many tech companies will want both degrees as you climb higher up the ladder. I thought it might also open up some more career opportunities if you weren't sure where you wanted to go after undergrad.
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<p>That's a tough call. In general, I tend to shy away from double-majors or double-degree programs because, the fact is, employers don't really care. Sadly, you don't really get that much of an edge with a double-degree. I have seen plenty of people with double-degrees lose out on job offers with tech/engineering companies to people who had only the lone MBA. </p>
<p>That's why I can't really agree that companies really want the double master's. The truth is, most operations managers don't have double-masters. Many have just the MBA. Some of them have no master's degree at all. </p>
<p>My take on it is that the double does open some doors. But whether it's really worth the extra time and effort is debateable. The truth is, once you have an MBA, you probably won't want to go back to doing regular engineering again, which therefore means that it won't really matter that much whether you have a master's in engineering. It's a nice thing to have in your back pocket, but as far as the extra effort you need to spend to get it, I am not sure that is it the best use of your time. You may find that you are better off taking that time and instead using it to do more networking or participating in more MBA clubs, etc.</p>
<p>What about a masters and then law school for something like patent law. I think it seems like a lot, but people say that a lot of firms and clients expect their patent lawyers to have some kind of higher degree in engineering.</p>
<p>See, even that is questionable in value. I agree that having an advanced tech degree may help you if you ultimately become a patent lawyer. The issue is whether it's really worth the effort. Getting an advanced technical degree is no walk in the park. It's a lot of work. </p>
<p>So getting such a degree just to be able to improve your employability as a patent lawyer (should you become one) seems to be an extraordinariy inefficient use of your time. First off, there is no guarantee that you will actually become a patent lawyer once you graduate from law school. First off, there isn't even any guarantee that you will get a law firm job offer at all once you graduate from law school. Some law school grads, especially the ones who got low grades at a low-tier law school, don't get any offers from firms. Even if you do get into a firm, that doesn't mean that you will be doing patent law work. As a first-year associate, you are going to be assigned to whatever comes up. You're not going to have a lot of power to pick your projects. If the firm decides to put you on a personal injury case, then that's what you're going to do. If the firm decides to put you on a criminal defense case, then that's what you're going to do. If you do good work, the firm will keep you on, and as you gain seniority, you will have more power to pick your projects. But that may not happen. You may not do good work. A recession might occur. A number of things might happen that will cause the law firm to lay you off. </p>
<p>Now, I agree that having an advanced tech degree increases your chances of getting an offer from a law firm that specializes in patent law, and also increases your chances of being assigned to a patent law case once you're in the firm. But the point is, there are no guarantees. You can have a PhD in engineering from MIT and a Yale law degree, and still end up doing personal injury or civil rights law or other things that have nothing to do with patents. Becoming a successful patent lawyer requires that you actually work on patent law cases, but there's no guarantee that you will actually get that kind of work. </p>
<p>My point is, getting an advanced engineering degree if you have no intention of actually working as an engineer seems to me to be a highly inefficient use of your time.</p>
<p>What's the average salary for someone with a BS in engineering plus an MBA?</p>
<p>interesting..bump</p>
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My take on it is that the double does open some doors. But whether it's really worth the extra time and effort is debateable. The truth is, once you have an MBA, you probably won't want to go back to doing regular engineering again, which therefore means that it won't really matter that much whether you have a master's in engineering. It's a nice thing to have in your back pocket, but as far as the extra effort you need to spend to get it, I am not sure that is it the best use of your time. You may find that you are better off taking that time and instead using it to do more networking or participating in more MBA clubs, etc.
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I agree with you. In terms of ROI, an MBA is probably worth more than a Master's in Engineering. However, getting into an MBA program usually requires 2-5 years of work experience. From what I hear, MS Engineering degrees may not require as much work experience as an MBA and it may be more number/stat based. You can also do a MS Engineering part-time.</p>
<p>So suppose I graduate with a PharmD and I need 2-4 years of work experience before starting an MBA program, wouldn't it be worthwhile that I do a MS ChemE degree part-time while working full time? With a PharmD and MSChemE, I could be qualified to work in sales & marketing, research & development, or manufacturing in a pharmaceutical company. Also if I no longer wanted to stay inthe pharmaceutical industry, with a MS ChemE I could get into many other industries as it is a versatile degree.</p>
<p>thanks for the example, polo</p>
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You can also do a MS Engineering part-time.
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<p>Well, you can also do an MBA part-time.</p>
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So suppose I graduate with a PharmD and I need 2-4 years of work experience before starting an MBA program, wouldn't it be worthwhile that I do a MS ChemE degree part-time while working full time? With a PharmD and MSChemE, I could be qualified to work in sales & marketing, research & development, or manufacturing in a pharmaceutical company. Also if I no longer wanted to stay inthe pharmaceutical industry, with a MS ChemE I could get into many other industries as it is a versatile degree.
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<p>Well, first off, let me say that if you can get any degree (whether part-time or full-time) that is paid for by your employer, then I would recommend to take it. After all, why not? </p>
<p>However, my point is that an MBA is really a 'capstone' degree in the sense that, from a career standpoint, it tends to supercede all other degrees you may have earned. That's because an MBA is a strong signal to the market that you want to enter management, and once you enter management, whatever other degrees you have just aren't going to matter very much. The only thing that will really matter is the quality of your work. </p>
<p>What I am saying is that you shouldn't fall into the trap of becoming a "degree-collector". The best way to make yourself employable in any industry is just to do good work and build a strong network. I've seen lots of people with highly impressive academic backgrounds nonetheless not get the job they want, getting beaten out with people with quite mediocre educational backgrounds, but who had strong work records and good contacts.</p>
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However, my point is that an MBA is really a 'capstone' degree in the sense that, from a career standpoint, it tends to supercede all other degrees you may have earned.
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Agreed.
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That's because an MBA is a strong signal to the market that you want to enter management, and once you enter management, whatever other degrees you have just aren't going to matter very much. The only thing that will really matter is the quality of your work.
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I just read in the latest edition of Fortune that Generation X is having a hard time moving through management because the Baby Boomers are trying to work into their 60s. It said how some of the Generation X could put in countless hours and have superb quality work, but if upper management is looking to protect themselves, Generation X will not be given a chance.
It seems to me that dual non-business degrees broaden the fields that you can work it, which could be advantageous. If the quality of your work is good and you have the ability to enter more fields than your competition, then its less likely for something to impede your rise through management as you could one industry and get into another.
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The best way to make yourself employable in any industry is just to do good work and build a strong network.
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By working full-time and going to school part-time for an advance degree, you give up nothing in network building. You probably have the potential to build an even wider network because you will have contact with fellow graduate students and professors.
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I've seen lots of people with highly impressive academic backgrounds nonetheless not get the job they want, getting beaten out with people with quite mediocre educational backgrounds, but who had strong work records and good contacts.
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Sure. I've seen this happen too. But I'd rather strive for strong work records, good contacts, AND a highly impressive academic background.</p>
<p>some random googling turned up this article:</p>
<p>any opinions?</p>
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I just read in the latest edition of Fortune that Generation X is having a hard time moving through management because the Baby Boomers are trying to work into their 60s. It said how some of the Generation X could put in countless hours and have superb quality work, but if upper management is looking to protect themselves, Generation X will not be given a chance.
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<p>Yeah, but you can always start your own company, which is what I think young people with the right psychological profile and aggressiveness ought to do. Keep in mind that a company is nothing more than a proxy between your talent and the marketplace. If your talent is good enough, then you can sell directly to the market, bypassing the middleman. Look how well it worked out for the founders of Google. Now obviously most people will not be as successful as those guys, but there are plenty of other people who work as successful small business entrepreneurs. </p>
<p>But you don't even have to found the business yourself. You just join a company that somebody else founded. Google has created thousands of new jobs, almost none of which are occupied by Baby Boomers who are trying to hold onto their positions, because Google didn't even exist a decade ago. </p>
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By working full-time and going to school part-time for an advance degree, you give up nothing in network building. You probably have the potential to build an even wider network because you will have contact with fellow graduate students and professors.
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<p>I agreed that if you can go part-time and get your company to pay for it, then you have little to lose. </p>
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Sure. I've seen this happen too. But I'd rather strive for strong work records, good contacts, AND a highly impressive academic background
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<p>Well, look, it seems to me as if you've made up your mind, and if that's the case, I suppose there is little point in having this discussion. Seriously, if you've already decided on this course of action anyway, then why are you asking for advice?</p>
<p>However, I stand by my point which is that degrees of a certain level are an investment of diminishing returns. For example, once you already have one master's degree, having another isn't going to give you much of an additional boost. There is little to be gained by just being a degree collector.</p>
<p>Furthermore, you discount the fact that everybody only has 24 hours in the day. Sure, if we could do it, I would like to work out 3 hours a day, read every single book known to mankind, get every single college degree out there, go to every single party, and basically do everything in the entire world. But you can't do it. There are only so many things you can do with your time. Which is why I think that once you already have one degree, getting more degrees isn't all that valuable, and that the returns-on-investment of your time will probably be higher by doing other things.</p>
<p>Let me add the following to my previous post. </p>
<p>The truth is, hiring is a quite arbitrary process. You can be the most qualified person for the job, with the best grades, the best education, and even the best experience... and still see somebody else get a job instead of you, somebody who is nowhere near as qualified as you are, but who just managed to 'click' with their interviewer. Interviewing is, by its nature, an extremely arbitrary process. For example, if somebody just didn't like the color of tie you wore to the interview, or you revealed that you're a Yankees fan when the interviewer is actually a Red Sox fan, or something else equally arbitrary, you may not get the job no matter how qualified you really are.</p>
<p>With that said, you should probably be working on something that will actually help them to land the job. Like improving your interview skills. Like doing more recruiting and networking. Getting a graduate degree in engineering is no walk in the park . It's a lot of work, and you need to assess whether the time and money you would spend on getting it is really worth it.</p>
<p>Let me give you an example. I know a lot of people who got combined MBA's and MS engineering degrees from MIT. But not all of them got the job they really wanted. In fact, quite a few were actually quite unhappy with what they got, particularly when they found out they got beaten out for the job they wanted by somebody who only got a single master's. Some of them even said that they felt they would have been better off not getting that engineering MS at all, and instead using that time to work on their interview skills, or to do more recruiting and networking. They spent a lot of time doing a lot of engineering work, and if they can't get the job they want, then it's all for naught. </p>
<p>That's why I say that degrees are an economic good of rapidly diminishing returns. Once you have one master's degree, getting a 2nd or a 3rd is really not going to do much for you.</p>
<p>Some companies I've seen offer two tracts beyond the entry level positions: technical and managerial. One requiring the MS, and the other the MBA, obviously. How do these two paths compare/contrast? Are these types of career ladders common at all?</p>
<p>Sakky, I agree on basically everything you have said.</p>
<p>I think I am in a rare situation though. While there are diminishing returns on multiple Masters degrees, I believe that a MS ChemE is well worth it because my PharmD is too specific. A MS ChemE for me opens a significantly greater number of doors.</p>