My father will not let me visit colleges

Parents Forum
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<p>There are generally two reasons to visit schools before you apply–(a) so that you can decide whether you like a school and (b) to show the school that you’re interested. In a post on another thread, you had indicated that you were interested in the following schools:</p>

<p>UIUC
Penn State - University Park
Purdue
UW Madison
UMich Ann Arbor
Virginia Tech
RPI
Carnegie Mellon
Cornell
Duke
UPenn
Columbia
Princeton </p>

<p>As to the second reason, most of the schools on your list–state schools and ivies–don’t care if you show interest, so if your father is adamant about no/few visits, I would not even discuss visiting those schools. In terms of CMU, Duke and RPI, on the Common Data Set, CMU says that it considers the level of an applicant’s interest as an “important” factor–here’s the link to the page <a href=“http://www.cmu.edu/ira/CDS/pdf/cds_2010_11/c_firstyear_admission.pdf[/url]”>http://www.cmu.edu/ira/CDS/pdf/cds_2010_11/c_firstyear_admission.pdf&lt;/a&gt;, as does RPI <a href=“http://www.rpi.edu/about/cds/CDS2008_2009.pdf[/url]”>http://www.rpi.edu/about/cds/CDS2008_2009.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Duke doesn’t say whether interest matters one way or another.</p>

<p>I think that I would do everything I could to show interest in RPI and CMU short of visiting (attend a nearby college fair, email one of the professors about a question you might have, email the admissions officer about a question you might have, see if the schools will be visiting somewhere near you etc.) and then show your father the data about interest being important. Maybe you can convince him to let you visit at least one of them. In addition, as megan12 has suggested, see if you can get him to compromise on the number of schools you will be applying to. </p>

<p>Finally, although you might not want to add to your list, I would also suggest that you consider schools that might give you significant merit money, because $30,000 is not going to be enough for many of the schools on your list unless you get financial aid (I know you said that you can dip into your family income, but in this economy, it might be a good idea to have some other options). I think that both Case Western and U Rochester are schools to consider in terms of merit aid.</p>

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<p>Momothree</p>

<p>From the ops list I am not sure I see any true safeties but I guess I don’t really know. Also given the calibre of the schools op is applying to he may not get any merit. Uiuc may be a safety but we are living in strange times. Also there are so many excellent mid level engineering school and the stats may be good for merit. Additionally if the father is so controlling ad to limit the number of applications then he may limit selection when the op only gets into a couple of schools?</p>

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<p>I am posting again because I was working off the short list at the beginning of the thread not the one immediately above. I see safeties aplenty on the above post.</p>

<p>I completely and wholehearted ly agree w everything midatlanticmom says!!! Cwru is an excellent choice.</p>

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<p>My advice to you would be to pick your battles carefully. You probably won’t get your dad to agree with everything you want, so figure out where he might agree to change his mind.</p>

<p>Since you live in Illinois, don’t worry about not visiting the reach schools that are far away. Princeton, Penn and Cornell would not expect you to visit, and won’t care if you don’t. It is expensive to travel East. While I agree that in an ideal situation you would visit schools, I think you should consider compromising on this one. Maybe you could visit ones that are driving distance away.</p>

<p>Do you need his permission to apply to five schools, or his money? If it’s a money issue, then I agree with the posters above – pay for it yourself. Would he really have a problem with your paying for applications yourself? Is he super controlling, and threaten to disown you or not pay for college if you disobey him? If that’s the case, then there are other, more serious issues here.</p>

<p>For some of the colleges you are considering, your dad might be right – they may have very stats-driven acceptances. So agree with him there. For others, like Princeton, he’s wrong. But if nothing will convince him otherwise, just don’t talk to him about it. </p>

<p>If an alum calls you up for an interview, will your dad actually prevent you from going? He may not believe in them, but will he punish you if you have one? This is an issue where it may be a nonissue – just go meet with an alum for an interview, and his opinion is irrelevant. </p>

<p>Are there any teachers in your school who would be supportive of your dreams? Find them, and confide in them, use them as your sounding board (or just keep coming back here). We often say on CC that we need to accept the kid on the couch. Perhaps you need to accept the dad on the couch and try not to change him, but just work around him. Of course you are right in many of these issues, but some old dogs don’t want to learn new tricks.</p>

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<p>Whatever you do, keep UIUC on your list…UIUC is strong re: Astronomy and Physics. Although you may want to add Purdue for Engineering, keep the flagship U on your list. There are only a handful of flagship U’s that are considered really good schools…Illinois is certainly one of them, and when it comes to tallying up the costs, unless you get merit aid from one of the non-Ivys on your list, it will probably be the most affordable option. Good luck to you!</p>

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<p>Another option might be to ask the alumni representative if a telephone interview would be possible. Could you have a telephone interview without it being considered disobedience?</p>

<p>A telephone interview might also be a good idea if you would otherwise be dependent on your parents for transportation to the interview.</p>

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<p>I’m of two minds about campus visits. I’ve taught at universities all my life and I’m very skeptical of what you really find out by going on a campus tour and looking at the classroom buildings, dining halls, and so on. It’s nice to be in attractive, well-maintained surroundings but the meat of the academic enterprise is in the people and the back-and-forth of the classroom, and this is hard to discern when you’re on a tour. Possibly an overnight stay with students would be more enlightening, especially if you attended classes, but even then you are seeing only a tiny sliver of what most schools have to offer. On the other hand, if you’re going to be studying something that requires special facilities–a particular kind of theater, or lab–or in a field where the individual faculty you will study with really matters (as it does in some arts fields) then a visit could be very helpful.</p>

<p>My S, who is majoring in computer science, applied to a variety of schools with excellent CS programs. I told him that once he was admitted, he could visit the serious prospects, but he declined to do so before making his decision. He’s been happy in his choice. For my D, who will possibly major in dance, the situation is more complicated because not all schools have dance programs and the physical layout of the teaching space is more important for the success of the program. So in her case, we’re visiting the schools that interest her provided they are within a couple of hours driving distance. It’s been a kind of fun momma-daughter bonding experience but I’m not sure it’s going to be determinative when it comes time for her to pick a college.</p>

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<p>I wasn’t “allowed” to go to college at all for a few years. I had to work my way through community college to get my parents to change their minds and let me finish my bachelors. When I could go, my parents threw a FIT when I wanted to apply to more than two colleges, and I was only allowed to go on college tours if I went by myself, funded the trip alone, and didn’t miss any school or work. I applied to four colleges overall and went on one visit before I made my choice. I didn’t see the school I went to until after I’d already sent the deposit. Somehow I managed to find the PERFECT college for me anyway, and I graduated this past spring. I really think a lot of people make this a lot more complicated than it really is-- a sort of paralyzed-by-choices kind of mentality. For the people who don’t have the money or time to put as much into college choice as the typical CCer, the world doesn’t end and they work with what they have to find the right school and create a good college experience there. The way we do things on this website is not the ONLY way to make an informed choice. If you can’t get your father to bend you will just have to find a way to work with what you’re given just like the millions of the rest of us out there.</p>

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<p>Love that! Nicely said perspective Emaheevul07 and congrats on your graduation!</p>

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<p>Thanks. :)</p>

<p>Where I come from, most people have a fair amount of money and their kids do go to college. But to these people, the idea of going on multiple college tours (or in many cases, any at all) and applying to even five, much less more, colleges is CRAZY. It simply isn’t done-- and we think back on our college years just as fondly as anyone else. While I definitely understand the benefit to doing those kinds of things if you can, the average, TYPICAL college student DOES NOT and they still make it. It saddens me to see people so stressed out over things like that, thinking that this is the only way to go, when to most people the kind of college process CC kids go through is sheer madness. What we do here at CC is not what most people do.</p>

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<p>Since this student won’t qualify for fa, the dad may be concerned that applying to pricey schools will be a waste. The dad may be fine with the child spending 30k per year from grandpa, but he may have no intention of contributing himself…so he thinks that UIUC and other big merit schools are fine. The whole interview issue suggests that he knows those schools are need based. What is he saying? Does he think interviews are only held on campus and require a visit??? Maybe he doesn’t know that local alums do those.</p>

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<p>Keep in mind that the parents who post here are not necessarily representative of what is “typical.” That being said, one thing that immediately came to mind for me as I read your post is the possibility that your dad is concerned about how much all that visiting will cost. </p>

<p>Each of our daughters visited schools in a specific geographical area that they felt drawn to, along with schools that were within three hours of home. This was done so as to minimize cost of visiting - it involved air travel, car rental, hotel stays, etc. And let me tell you it ADDS UP; the campus visits eliminated any vacation for our family those years. And we are not by any means wealthy. It involved a huge financial sacrifice on our part. </p>

<p>Perhaps your dad is trying to be realistic in his assessment of cost involved and for some reason is unable to say that to you. </p>

<p>We limited the number of schools our kids could apply to as we were the ones shelling out the cash for application fees. Another reason was the “making a decision” factor. We had heard too many stories of kids applying to ten or more colleges, being accepted to all or most of them, and then having difficulty making a decision. Ten or more colleges is, IMHO, too many. I know that others here will disagree with me and that’s OK. Just giving you a perspective from someone who isn’t made of money.</p>

<p>Having said that, visiting colleges totally eliminated the desire, on the part of both our children, to apply to some of those colleges they visited. You can get a really good sense of the campus culture through those visits.</p>

<p>One more thing to consider. If my child was an average student, and hadn’t shown academic committment, I wouldn’t see the importance of college visits nearly as much as having a child that has tons on the ball- and that means across the board academic excellence and committment.</p>

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<p>At nearly every decent school around 90%+ say they would go their again. It is very hard for any major school to suck so bad you would not like it after a year. It’s college. There is always stuff to do and people to do it with. I think people have WAY over complicated things looking of some holy grail of schools. Read three guidebooks and look at some pix and you have a pretty good idea of what to expect. No need to overthink it. It’s like trying to decide which beach in Hawaii is best. It’s Hawaii–they are all better than anything in central Illinois.</p>

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<p>Obviously you’ve never been to Lake Bloomington! </p>

<p>Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using CC App</p>

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<p>My gut tells me the dad…</p>

<p>1) only wants the cost to be $30k per year (the money given to student from Grandpa), and he knows that those name schools are costing $55k+ per year…and he doesn’t want to pay the $25k difference.</p>

<p>2) He doesn’t want to pay for campus visits to school that he knows won’t be affordable. (Family income, family savings, student college money all adds up to very high EFC).</p>

<p>3) He thinks that interviews require a campus visit. Otherwise he has not reason to refuse those. If a school arranges an in-town interview, what could be his objection??? </p>

<p>Toasted…ask your dad how much he’ll spend “over and above” your grandpa’s money (about $25-30 per year). If he has little intention of spending much more than the college fund, I think you’ll know a lot more.</p>

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<p>Having seen your list, I would worry less about visiting schools before you apply and more about trying to get a few more applications out there. Your list is almost all reaches. Yes, you have good stats, but these schools are all too selective for you to feel very safe about the process.</p>

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<p>You can, however, learn a lot about schools online. You have to dig past the glossy photos on the home page (like the glossy photos in the brochures) to see what the culture is like. For example, Purdue & UIUC, while both top engineering schools, vary in size & atmosphere. Purdue does not have as many activities going on as Illinois does. UIUC is big enough to be a city unto itself. </p>

<p>Look to see what social/religious/athletic clubs are available, what concert series come to town (or are presented by the music department of the school itself), and so forth. Do you want to participate in a sport or the marching band? Greek life? Does the m/f ratio matter to you? Do you want to be at least within bus distance of a larger city or are you fine with being out in the country/small town for months on end? </p>

<p>All this is in addition, of course, to the school’s reputation in your desired major!</p>

<p>Edit: just read posts on page 2. Agree with astrophysicsmom–keep UIUC on your list, it’s a GREAT engineering school and you are so lucky to be in-state to get the tuition break! I know you may want to go “away” but really, UIUC is a fine school.</p>

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<p>College visits are helpful more from a standpoint of figuring out what the city looks like… One can memorize the entire mit.edu web site without ever understanding what it means to live in Cambridge (I lived there for a few months on a work assignment - MIT can’t really be described in terms common mortals can understand. I had a heck of a time visiting a friend working there and trying to make sense of the cartoons people put on their office doors :-). That was far more of a culture indicator than any 100 web sites.</p>

<p>Another reason for those of us who ‘sheltered’ their children is to show them that, well, sure, there’s parts of the country where people don’t live in expensive suburbs, don’t all drive luxury cars, and don’t all wear brand name clothes and the like. How can you explain Tulane or New Orleans to someone from Ohio? How can you explain ‘small LAC’ to someone whose high school has nearly 5,000 kids?</p>

<p>And, of course, the weather, the culture, and all that.</p>

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<p>I think he is close to being very right. You don’t need more than 5 schools looking at you for admission. If you pick correctly, then they all will want you. Pick 2 reasonable reaches, 2 matches and a 1 safety. With this process you will make better decisions about where you want to go. Only exception is if it doesn’t cost you a thing to apply and you are willing to pay for all the transcripts and fees to send SAT/ACT scores. </p>

<p>Visiting schools can be of some benefit to you. You will be able to see if you like the campus. You don’t need to visit for them to pick you. Once again you should do it on your dime and not dads.</p>

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<p>[College</a> Applications - How Many Schools Should I Apply To?](<a href=“College Board - SAT, AP, College Search and Admission Tools”>How to Finalize Your College List – BigFuture | College Board)</p>

<p>A short take on it from collegeboard. Op I didn’t say this earlier but both my older two started with a list about as long as yours. But they had no trouble doing the research on the campuses, the financial aid situation, classes, etc. in order to narrow the list. The oldest applied to 4 because he had 4 choices, all very similar that he pretty much knew he’d get accepted which he did – so safety/matches. The second had 5. One reachy, 3 matches and a safety. He got into 4. So they each ended up with 4 to think about, compare finaid, and decide from.</p>

<p>We did do some visits with both but we didn’t do an all-out Quest - more to solve the big/small, rural/urban question and in conjunction with other activities. They both traveled to their number one choice on their own for an overnight. It seemed fair to us and a good way to see if they could navigate getting to and from so far from home and we figured it would either solidify their decision or change their decision. In both cases it solidified their research and perceptions. That visit happened after acceptances senior year.</p>

<p>Take the time to do a little research and come up with a meaningful list and then sit down with your dad and talk to him about what you’ve learned. Definitely take the time to go visit Illinois and Michigan if you aren’t too far away and can borrow a car…that will give you an understanding for BIG and you might be able to do it in a day or see if the college will allow you to overnight if they are too far away. This will also allow you to form your own perceptions untainted by your neighbors, classmates, random posters.</p>