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Okay, so you’re saying that 100k/year at age 25 is sucker money. Laughable.</p>
<p>lol@$100,000 being sucker money.</p>
<p>I don’t care at what point you are in life. $100,000 salary is wayyyyyyyyyyyyy more than what you should need to live comfortable financially. </p>
<p>I guess that I’m of that opinion because I’ve been poor all my life, lol.</p>
<p>Engin, I think only 1% of Americans earn $100,000 or more a year.</p>
<p>^No the top 3% makes $300.000+.</p>
<p>"I worked as an engineer for a while, and now I’m back in school getting an engineering PhD.</p>
<p>Are your parent right…yea, on some levels, but the thing is that it is very complicated. You can’t graduate with an engineering degree maintaining a 3.0, get a job, and be set for life. This just won’t happen. You’ll be downsized and have trouble finding a new job. Some of the new grads out of school will have skills you don’t have. It’ll be tough to compete.</p>
<p>The thing is you must do better in school. You must do better like around at least a 3.4 or 3.5, so you have a shot at Engineering grad school, an MBA program, or even law school or Med school. PhD in engineering actually do quite well as either Professor or in industry. Professors can make $200K(with consulting)…this is no different than a doctor and you don’t have all the debt because PhD in engineering are usually paid for by the school…you get a stipend and they pay tuition. PhDs in industry can make 150K to well…millions a year. Engineers who have an MBA can also do exceeding well taking top level management positions. The thing is to get these degrees and suceed as professors or in industry, you must have good communication skills and you must do very well in your undergrad program. You parents are right that this will not be easy.</p>
<p>I don’t know what is easy though. Med schools want a very top GPA and Pre-med is just as hard as engineering. Doctors go into tons of debt that engineers don’t get. Doctors can be in training getting paid a rather low salary for years until they make a high salary. Lawyers can graduate and make 30K or 40K year. "</p>
<p>Someone else mentioned something that some engineers do not have to deal with…risk and stress.</p>
<p>If a lawyer screws up…either someone is in jail when they should not be OR someone is free when they should not be.</p>
<p>If a doctor screws up?..that could mean someone’s life.</p>
<p>If that I-Banker screws up?..well, you all can watch the current news on that.</p>
<p>If a software engineer screws up?..we just re-install the last version of the application and go back to our development environment and fix the bug and run 100 more tests until we get it right and then re-deploy the software.</p>
<p>^</p>
<p>Aye! Is not that simple! What if that engineer messed up the bridge design or the code for the predator drone? Engineers must manage risk just like everyone else and many times their decisions may cost the lives of others.</p>
<p>Yeah, if GT really believes what he said about risk for engineers, that’s pretty scary. If anything, engineers - yes, even software engineers - often are responsible for the lives of people… perhaps many hundreds or thousands of people, perhaps millions.</p>
<p>Then again, the danger that engineers put people in is less personal than the other kinds, so I can see what he’s saying. Engineers don’t ever need to meet the people using their products, that is, the guys who buy the stuff off-the-shelf or use it in the world. I guess it shouldn’t make a difference, but I know I would be more careful if I saw the guy I was about to cut open than if I was helping code a robotic arm for surgery. Well, having thought about it, maybe not anymore…</p>
<p>Since we are comparing other professions, it is time to pull out President Hoover’s 1954 speech:
Engineering … it is a great profession. There is the fascination of watching a figment of the imagination emerge through the aid of science to a plan on paper. Then it moves to realization in stone or metal or energy. Then it brings jobs and homes to men. Then it elevates the standards of living and adds to the comforts of life. That is the engineer’s high privilege.</p>
<p>The great liability of the engineer compared to men of other professions is that his works are out in the open where all can see them. His acts, step by step, are in hard substance. He cannot bury his mistakes in the grave like the doctors. He cannot argue them into thin air or blame the judge like the lawyers. He cannot, like the architects, cover his failures with trees and vines. He cannot, like the politicians, screen his shortcomings by blaming his opponents and hope the people will forget. The engineer simply cannot deny he did it. If his works do not work, he is damned…</p>
<p>On the other hand, unlike the doctor his is not a life among the weak. Unlike the soldier, destruction is not his purpose. Unlike the lawyer, quarrels are not his daily bread. To the engineer falls the job of clothing the bare bones of science with life, comfort, and hope. No doubt as years go by the people forget which engineer did it, even if they ever knew. Or some politician puts his name on it. Or they credit it to some promoter who used other people’s money … but the engineer himself looks back at the unending stream of goodness which flows from his successes with satisfactions that few professionals may know. And the verdict of his fellow professionals is all the accolade he wants.</p>
<p>And if you think professional politicians and rock stars have the eternal fame, don’t fool yourself. A building or a sculpture might endure longer. Remember the Shelly poem Ozymandias:</p>
<p>I met a traveller from an antique land
Who said: Two vast and trunkless legs of stone
Stand in the desert. Near them, on the sand,
Half sunk, a shattered visage lies, whose frown
And wrinkled lip, and sneer of cold command
Tell that its sculptor well those passions read
Which yet survive, stamped on these lifeless things,
The hand that mocked them and the heart that fed.
And on the pedestal these words appear:
“My name is Ozymandias, king of kings:
Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!”
Nothing beside remains. Round the decay
Of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare
The lone and level sands stretch far away.</p>
<p>I threw what I said about risks because I truly have no problems with the money that doctors, lawyers and I-bankers make. I don’t want to group all engineers because some engineers mistakes caused the Challenger to blow up years ago in flight.</p>
<p>That is why I mentioned SOFTWARE engineering. Outside of any software need for like space or aircraft, we don’t have to have as much “risk” on humans. Hell, in the business/financial world (a lot of my pre-INTEL experience) our software was mainly to help corporations make more money (by providing data for decisions).</p>
<p>So I am just fine with with doctors and lawyers (and all of that post 4-year schooling) incomes. They can have it and that extra risk. I am fine with engineering.</p>
<p>^ Risk is just as important in software engineering as in any other. I mean, all engineers make some things where risk isn’t a serious concern, and not all engineers ever do, but some do. I mean, pacemakers have software. Radiation machines have software. Airplanes have software. Software has killed plenty of people, and the scary thing is that software is probably the least-developed of any of the “engineering” type fields.</p>
<p>Summary: not all software is for financial stuff.</p>
<p>Financial software is probably the riskiest of all. Just imagine a line that puts a 0 in the wrong place, costing the firm millions or billions; at that point you are simply let go.</p>
<p>That’s only assuming you value the bottom line over human life.</p>
<p>The bottom line is human life. A number in the wrong place might wash away a family’s life savings.</p>
<p>“Engineers” at financial firms writing said software that we have been talking about are not dealing with families’ savings. They are dealing with corporate profits. Unless of course a family hired a high dollar financial analyst to write proprietary software for them.</p>
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<p>Just want to say this was a management mistake as the engineer at Morton-Thiokol in charge of the o-rings hadn’t given the OK for a launch.</p>
<p>Also, great quote from Hoover there mrego. Hadn’t seen that in its entirety before.</p>
<p>No, they are not dealing with families’ savings. Corporate revenues and profits tie directly to the larger economy.</p>
<p>Think of a hedge fund working for a pension fund. The engineers and analysts must make sure their models are correct or else they could end up draining life savings away.</p>
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hmm … I’d suggest that your parents check the enrollment (and HS stats) of the engineering students at MIT, Caltech, Stanford, Cornell, Purdue, Michigan, Texas A&M, UIllinois, etc etc … a ton of great students in the US attend engineering schools and then lead very rewarding and successful careers. I’d suggest you purse what you find interesting and compelling … and then your job may be fun … having a job that is merely collecting a paycheck sounds like a living H*** to me. </p>
<p>One other suggestion would be to look for schools with engineering and other majors your parents like better … you have a couple years to pick a major … if your school has many majors than your options are kept open longer. (FYI - when I created my school list a million years ago I looked for schools with 5 disparite majors, one of which was engineering in case I changed my mind … this approach helped define my list and kept my options open … and as a sophmore I did consider switching to a non-engineering major (ultimately I stayed in the engineering school).</p>
<p>I have worked on data warehouses for companies like Wyeth Pharmaceuticals. The data warehouse was basically made to monitor the federal governments prices so that Wyeth stayed within a range to keep from getting sued for more money than they were getting sued for currently.</p>
<p>…not stop from being sued period…just so their profits FAR outnumbered what they would be sued for.</p>
<p>My dream was to become a Engineering Manager. I’ve been one for ten years! I can tell you for sure, your parents are correct. Your expected to know everything for less money than most other managers. You spend a lot of your free time keeping up with technology. Become a Business major and you can become an over paid boob!</p>