Throughout it, Allen emphasizes the need for a “spike” to boost your application if you really want a chance in getting admitted to Ivy level schools. But I’ve heard so many stories on here about kids who didn’t have anything overly mind-blowing/amazing in their apps but were able to tell a compelling story through their ECs, essays, and letter of recommendations and still got in without winning big awards, etc. What do you guys think, do you need to compete at international levels, get published in big scientific research magazines, etc. to have a real chance? (What about a school like Brown - my dream school?)
No, you don’t.
While many Ivy League admits do have “spikes,” you have to realize that most students at these schools are normal kids who are passionate about the things they do. You can get in with just a compelling story, good ECs, essays, and letters of recommendation (although a hook can help you stand out within a large applicant pool of qualified kids).
A school like Brown has to view you as a better candidate than others and, for some, there is the caveat that you have to be stronger than others equally likely to accept their offer of admissions. I don’t think everyone at a place like Brown has an international award-but they offer Brown something else that Brown wouldn’t have gotten from the candidates Brown denied (who would have accepted Brown’s offer). I don’t buy the idea that the essay can compensate for the international award unless the essay provides information to the school that suggests the student does have that something (say produced a well regarded and successful TV commercial) that suggests the student will be wildly successful. In other words, I don’t believe that quality of essay has much to do with acceptance rates but information contained in the essay, which isn’t available in other parts of the application, could make a difference.
Incidentally, that blog is sickening.
@lostaccount what do you mean by that? (your second post)
@azwu331 thank god for that. im definitely a normal kid who happens to be passionate about a few things (none of which im completely exceptional at, not enough to win huge awards for) so hopefully ill be able to fall under that umbrella 8-|
“I don’t buy the idea that the essay can compensate for the international award unless the essay provides information to the school that suggests the student does have that something (say produced a well regarded and successful TV commercial) that suggests the student will be wildly successful.”
Try turning that around: A national or international award or some rare accomplishment can’t compensate for a shallow essay or a lack of the real attributes the colleges want to see.
You don’t need to be spikey. You do need to be the sort who challenges himself, aims for some impact and can show some judgment n his presentation. Know what your college targets look for. Start with their own words, not those guys trying to make a dollar off the process.
@lookingforward in the article he said being well rounded wont be good in admissions… is that true?
When “we’ll rounded” means “I’m doing a bunch of activities so I can get into college,” then you have a problem.
@1golfer1 thats not what i mean, i genuinely am interested in a lot of things but im hoping it wont hurt me? like i pla y piano, am in mock trial, have an internship with a local neuroscience professor, etc. so theyre kind of in different fields (im wanting to go into cognitive neuroscience so ill have to play up the internship…)
From my perspective, depth and breadth are good. It can represent a willingness to be engaged in various things, an openness, versus just the self serving or what your hs offers when the bell rings. The notion kids should be pointy drives me nuts. If you really look at what the colleges promote, it IS a roundedness. (But not just easy things to rack up lines under the Activities section.)
Some things you do because they advance your own interests or future goals.Then things you do as part of your groups (hs clubs, a team, performance, etc, or your religious or cultural group, maybe scouts, etc.) And things you do for your community.
It takes both pointy and round kids to make a class - there’s no right answer here, except that trying to make yourself either for the purposes of gaining an edge in admissions is probably a fool’s errand.
@NickFlynn true!
The neologism “spike” really bugs me–it’s undefinable, vague, and pernicious if it leads to more teenagers being strategic rather than driven. Cheng himself spent so much energy grooming himself as an applicant that it appears he never really stopped to think about whether he really loved all that high-level science he was doing, and thus it comes as little surprise that in the end he quit doing science altogether and started a business to market the one thing he was truly passionate about: the commodification of college admissions.
Necessity shouldn’t be a concern because as an individual applicant, all you need to know is sufficiency. One archetype that’s sufficient to get you to HYP. And Allen did provide an archetype that’s sufficient. You can go along that line if you like it, or look for other successful archetypes if you are not that sort of student.
However, a compelling narrative is very very close to necessary. It’s necessary for 99% of the applicants unless you’re an IMO medalist that wrote a New York Times best seller about your experience at London Olympic. Pointy students do get an advantage there because their narrative can be very simple yet convincing.
So in your case you may need to find a way to convincingly explain why you play piano & do mock trial & research about neuroscience at the same time. This is apparently trickier if you’re well rounded. Like what the article says, it is hard to avoid “I’m a well-rounded person who’s decent at everything” kind of narrative.
The activites will speak for themselves.
Another thing that would help is to look at your achievements on a national or global level all the time. People in school have their rankings about how important something is, and 99% of them don’t go to HYP (adjust the number if you’re from a good school).
For example, if you want to do some drama, being the president/director or just an actor in the school drama club makes a huge difference in how much peer respect you can get, but for AOs they are the same. On the other hand, both a state Olympiad winner & a national Olympiad winner can feel really good being called genius everywhere he goes, but AOs know the big difference. Unless you’re from a very good school like Philips Academy, the in-school value system can be very different from AOs’.
This is important for well-rounded students because too often they thought they are “good in everything” while the truth is they are “better than average in everything”. 90th percentile is not enough.
@lookingforward I agree that showing is more important than saying, but I think not every type of activity list can speak that easily. (Not saying that well rounded lists can’t, but I’m afraid some “well rounded” lists can’t)