<p>My roommate and I have been having a discussion about her financial aid, and she said I could post here and ask for your advice. </p>
<p>We go to a private school (56k total COA) that obviously does not meet full need. Her EFC (according to my school) is around 12k. Her family makes around 80k a year.
She gets, per year:
9700 grant from our school
500 TAP
2000 in Unsub Staffords
3500 in Sub Staffords.
Last semester she took out 16k in PLUS Loans. This semester is closer to 19k. She's a premed who wants to be some kind of fancy dentist or psychiatrist. She REALLY loves it here and wants to stay but I really think the debt she's taking on is crazy. Can you help us a) find a way to maybe approach the school about giving her better FA and b) give her advice in general about what she should do?</p>
<p>She did not take out these loans…her parents did. What are her parent’s feelings about this level of debt (which does seem excessive for their income level, unless they have other assets)? Is this sustainable for them or are they likely to run out of borrowing power before year 4? </p>
<p>This family is accumulating debt on an annual basis which exceeds the typical undergrad’s total debt for 4 years! I think that should have been thoroughly discussed before they allowed her to commit to this school…so many kids start at the pricey school and then finish at the public school, or can’t afford to finish at all. If this is a possibility, obviously it would make more sense to transfer to a SUNY before next year’s boatload of debt is added. The fact that she is pre-med is another very good reason not to load up on debt now.</p>
<p>First of all…those Plus Loans are her PARENTS’ debt…not hers. Has she made some kind of agreement with her parents that SHE will pay those back? </p>
<p>If she is somehow responsible for those loans, then this plan is a VERY bad idea. She will have too much debt once she finishes her education. </p>
<p>As a current student, the school has NO incentive to improve her FA package. It sounds like her stats weren’t that great for the school since the school was not motivated to give her much aid…just about $10k. </p>
<p>What school is this? I can see that it’s in NY.</p>
<p>As much as she may like this school, she needs to leave it unless her parents are going to responsible for this debt. There’s also a concern that her parents may not continue to qualify for these huge loans since their income is not that high.</p>
<p>The family is borrowing about $40k per year. That’s just ridiculous. And it will ruin their lives.</p>
<p>Understood, definitely. This is what I have been telling her. She does plan to repay the loans herself and I don’t think her family will be unable to borrow it, they own their house and cars and have no other debt. However they will not actually be able to afford the loans. </p>
<p>While I know this is a less than ideal situation, since it would be nearly impossible to convince her to leave the school, do you know of any sort of tactics she could use to ask for more $$, even just 2000$? I mean, she doesn’t even get a work study, doesn’t it seem like they messed up on her FA?</p>
<p>I don’t think the educational system does nearly enough to educate parents at the beginning of the FA process about the “big picture”. I think most people believe that if they are offered a plus loan year 1 that this means that they will qualify for years 2,3, and 4. They think the system is watching out for them - it isn’t. They think the incentive to see the student through to graduation will force the school to bridge any financial gap - it won’t. Hopes and Dreams have a way of obscuring common sense.</p>
<p>*While I know this is a less than ideal situation, since it would be nearly impossible to convince her to leave the school, do you know of any sort of tactics she could use to ask for more $$, even just 2000$? I mean, she doesn’t even get a work study, doesn’t it seem like they messed up on her FA?</p>
<p>The school is Fordham. *</p>
<p>I like Fordham but it is NOT worth this kind of debt… NO WAY.</p>
<p>Her parents are making a HUGE mistake cooperating by taking out these Plus Loans. If she is unable to pay those loans back (which it’s very likely she will be unable to), THEY will legally have to pay for them. </p>
<p>Fordham probably has enough low income students (with EFCs below a certain number) that they reserve work-study for them. However, that doesn’t stop HER from getting a job herself to minimize how much debt she needs. </p>
<p>Does she realize that she’s going to need to borrow another $200k for med or dental school? </p>
<p>Does she realize how little new doctors earn? </p>
<p>I don’t think they “messed up” her FA. Fordham never claims to meet need and the info we received clearly showed that they expect families to use Plus Loans to pay for college. It also sounds like her stats weren’t that high for the school…that further suggests why the school didn’t give her much aid.</p>
<p>Does she realize that these loans will impact her parent’s ability to borrow or pay for other needs they have…replacing a car or a roof, sending other children to college, retiring debt free, etc? No job is ever completely secure and she certainly can’t guarantee that she will actually be able to afford the monthly payments (the Plus loans alone will be several thousand dollars if they continue borrowing at this rate) on these loans either! There are many college grads with experience who are unable to find full-time, steady employment and most that do couldn’t afford that level of payments. Imo, she’s almost certainly heading for disaster and jeapodizing her family’s future as well. It’s time to grow up before it’s too late.</p>
<p>I hope you will show her this thread, encourage her to play with the loan calculators on finaid.org, to make a projected budget, and to read some of the stories in the news recently or on the Project on Student Debt website…these are real people whose lives have been ruined by the loans they took as young adults. It’s tempting to believe that won’t happen, but the fact is that borrowing large sums for a “dream school” often turns into a nightmare that lasts for decades. Here are some links to get you started:</p>
<p>In the end, it probably won’t help…people can be very foolish in pursuing their heart’s desire so try not to worry about her predicament too much or risk damaging your friendship over it.</p>
<p>Is there a state school your friend could commute to and still be your roommate if you guys rented an apartment?</p>
<p>When you add up her Plus Loans, her grants, and her loans, it sounds like her parents aren’t even paying their EFC…and it sounds like the Plus Loans include the EFC which the student is supposed to pay back as well.</p>
<p>Right now, she’s on track to borrow $140k in Plus loans …AND…about $30k in federal loans. On what planet would borrowing $170k for undergrad be ok? None. Not even half as much would be ok. An undergrad shouldn’t borrow more than about $30k TOTAL for all 4 years.</p>
<p>BTW…how much are you borrowing? If you’re not borrowing too much, can’t you see how unreasonable her debt level is? Can’t you use that as some kind of guideline?</p>
<p>I agree that there is a LOT of debt being amassed here. It is good that you are trying to help your friend with some information. Certainly if she plans to go to medical school, it would be best if her undergrad debt was as small as possible. Her debt load sounds staggering to me, and I would not support it with my own kids.</p>
<p>BUT in the end, this decision is between your friend and her parents. Yes, some folks blindly take out huge loans for whatever reason. If this is her family’s choice, that is the way it is. I would encourage you to have your friend speak with her family about the amount of debt they are willing and able to assume…AND what this will mean for everyone’s future.</p>
<p>mom2collegekids- She lives too far away to commute, but she may become an RA next year (here, it works through recommendations and she got recommended so I think her chances are good). Do you guys think if she has an RA job it would make it worth it to stay? Also I am not borrowing anything to go to school, I have a scholarship, otherwise I wouldn’t be here. Luckily for me I found this website junior year and knew early on I wanted to take on as little debt as possible. For her it seems inconceivable to leave the school and frankly I feel horrible being the one “debbie downer” that is posing these scenarios which to her seem paranoid (She said a couple times “but I feel like I know a lot of people who borrowed so much to go to college and theyre fine.”</p>
<p>Anyway, I honestly think I’m going to show her this thread then drop the topic, but thank you all for your advice.</p>
<p>* If this is her family’s choice, that is the way it is. I would encourage you to have your friend speak with her family about the amount of debt they are willing and able to assume…AND what this will mean for everyone’s future. *</p>
<p>From an earlier post, it sounds like the parents won’t be paying back ANY of the Plus Loans. It sounds like there is an agreement that the STUDENT is supposed to pay back the Plus Loans for the parents. </p>
<p>I know that legally, the Plus loans are the parents responsibilty, but this student has promised her parents that SHE will pay them back. It’s obvious that NO ONE in the family has done the math and realizes the staggering debt that is involved. It looks like they all are counting on some mega doctor’s salary to pay it back. But, as we all know, newish doctors don’t earn the kind of money to pay back $400k in loans (undergrad and med school).</p>
<p>I think it’s very nice that this friend is offering some financial info. BUT ultimately the decision belongs to the friend’s family…not the OP of this thread. Yes, the debt seems high to most of us (it IS high) but that is THEIR family decision, not ours.</p>
<p>I just think it’s sad that the parents are signing these Plus loans (or in similar cases, co-signing loans) which is really going to bite them in the tush in the future. The D may have promised to pay the loans, but as we all know, you can’t squeeze blood out of a turnip, and if the D doesn’t have the money to make the payments, her $80k per year parents aren’t likely going to be able to pay them back either. </p>
<p>Yes, there’s nothing that the OP can do directly, but if she can show her friend this thread, she may be able to help her friend understand what a trainwreck this plan is. </p>
<p>I don’t know if there is a SUNY or CUNY that this girl can go to that will be much cheaper, and still be able to live with this roommate (the OP).</p>
<p>It really sounds like this girl needs to move back home and just commute to a local state school for college.</p>
<p>Hopefully, the OP can show her friend this thread and there will be a realization that this is just a bad plan.</p>