Need help forming a REALISTIC college list for an 'average excellent' student

As a male with his current stats and probable high test scores, I would think Vassar would be a match. Dickinson, Colby, and Bates as well. I’d consider Skidmore and Clark U safeties academically.

I think the list is good as it is and he is going to get into plenty of those schools with merit, if it’s offered. He’s a high performing male student and athlete. And as the coiner of the phrase, it’s “average” excellent. The quotation marks matter. He’s excellent though:-) Hope he gets into Bates, he can meet my D!

If a kid with a perfect gpa,ranked 1st in class, projected top test scores, and possibly a recruited athlete is average, then help the rest of us…

What is the team doing as far as recruiting? Seems like that would be a starting point.

He may want to consider some smaller D3 universities like U Rochester (which gives merit money) and has a pretty good soccer team. Tufts as well, but they do not give a lot of merit money. Run the NPC there to see if it would be affordable.

I would also suggest that you encourage him to study for the PSAT and possibly pay for a few sessions with a tutor - not so much to review the material but to learn some of the strategies for test taking. It may make the difference between NMF and commended.

“If a kid with a perfect gpa,ranked 1st in class, projected top test scores, and possibly a recruited athlete is average, then help the rest of us…”

A 36 ACT is the 99.96% percentile. WAY above average – excellent actually.

At Brown, that 36 ACT gives you a 28% chance of being admitted. Being valedictorian gives you a 19% chance of being admitted. As an applicant to Brown, this kid is totally average. People just don’t get this.

With a $10k EFC, your dream school is a selective LAC that would recruit your kid as a D3 soccer player and which has the money bags to meet full need. Many of those (like the NESCAC schools) have been mentioned above.

Merit money is more aimed towards lowering the net price for families without large “need” but who are unable/unwilling to pay the big EFC the formulas spit out.

If you get merit money, it reduces your need. So merit plus need-based aid kind of becomes just need based aid at the end of the day.

Juniata College is a college that changes lives and fits a lot of your son’s requirements. The author of “The College Solution” which is a very good book and website on the financial aspects of college admission, had her daughter attend Juniata and her daughter also played soccer for them. Had a great college experience and with merit and aid, it was affordable. I have a student currently there who is having a positive experience.

Also what about Haverford College, I know the location isn’t rural but it is on the “main line” in Philly (so not in the city center) and is a very pretty campus. Other than location it fits your son’s requirements. My husband and I had brunch with the president a few months ago and he told us that financial aid is very good at Haverford with them aiming for as little loans as possible. Haverford meets 100% of demonstrated financial need and the average amount of loans at graduation is $14K which is less than the national average of $27K.

Although not in the Northeast, I would look at Miami of Ohio. Financial aid will not be great but merit is very good. My students have received full tuition and depending on major a bit more so only paying less than the cost of room and board. I also am liking Baldwin-Wallace these days-they have been very generous with merit to make it affordable for my families.

A helpful website I learned from The College Solution is DIY College Rankings. The author has some good tools for creating lists plus she has a whole section on the recruited athlete for D-III schools that my families have found helpful. Here is the link: http://diycollegerankings.com/

I think you have crafted a very good list for a strong applicant. Your biggest challenge is going to be getting in front of coaches. Many of the D3 schools recruit heavily from their local region because they lack the resources to go further afield.

Also, although some of those schools have club soccer, it is much more of an intramural level of play endeavor, so if he wants to play, it really has to be on the team, and most of those schools do not take many walk-ons. Which is all to say that attending camps this summer is probably key if that’s a driver.

I suspect he would have some nice choices even without soccer, so while it’s a nice hook, it seems like he could do fine in admissions without it. But if he wants to play, that’s where he’s going to need to focus in the coming months.

I say this as a parent of a soccer player who had a list with at least half the same names on it. DS ultimately ended up having to decide if a spot on the roster - and a chance to play in college -was going to drive his school choice. For kids who have always played a sport, that can be a tough spot to be in.

Just an anecdote: I have a friend who has 2 sons who were both excellent soccer players. Older S was recruited athlete at Brown (D1), younger at Bowdoin (D3). I think the younger one was the better student, the older the better soccer player. My friend thinks her S at Bowdoin got the better education. He also had the advantage of not having to play all year round at an intense level. :slight_smile: They were in need of big need-based $$, both schools came through.

Neither of these kids were a val or sal, although they both did well. They did have the advantage of being in front of NE-based coaches. The younger one had to miss some big showcase for some reason–injury? illness?–and apparently that did limit his choices somewhat. He was being courted by the U of C and MIT, though…and some people think they don’t recruit athletes…

Some (many?) colleges apply merit money against the student contribution (student loans and/or work earnings expectation) and/or unmet need (based on “need” defined by the college) before reducing need-based financial aid grants. So merit money may be helpful when combined with need-based aid at some colleges.

Check each college’s financial aid pages to see if it says anything on this matter, or contact each college directly with the question.

OP- what are your priorities? Soccer or academics? As your son matures- agewise and emotionally/intellectually- his priorities will change. My gifted runner son’s did. Overall I think he should only look at schools where he will be among his academic peers (honors programs at flagships have these, regardless of the state) then look at soccer opportunities. Do not sacrifice academics for soccer.

I’m not familiar with the “in-state” academy teams, but will your S be playing in the academy playoffs and championship(s) in June and July? With the academy championship(s) will be played at the National Training Center in Carson, CA. Obviously, these playoffs and championship(s) rounds would be unbelievable opportunities for exposure to college coaches at a critical juncture (between Sophomore and Junior years).

I’m finding this to be very true. Honestly, he really doesn’t think he wants a big state school, so the idea of finding an honors college within a state flagship is unappealing to him. Without that option, it’s hard to find LACs he could (almost) certainly get into that meet our financial need (or close to it). My older son had this problem too…he had two safeties, but only in the sense that he knew he’d be accepted…he absolutely didn’t want to go to either of them, and I know an ideal safety is one you’d actually consider if accepted.

@wis75 He and I both agree his priority is academics. I would be very against the idea of him choosing his college based on where he could play as the primary or only factor. That said, he definitely identifies as a student-athlete and very much wants to keep playing at a competitive level, if he can.

@sushiritto The tournament you’re referring to is one level above his club team (he actually has a teammate who has been invited up). His club attends two showcase tournaments a year, one of which was cancelled due to a big snowstorm this year, unfortunately. One is in Vegas, and one is in Portland. Sometimes, they also go to a San Francisco showcase. I assume, however, that div III coaches at colleges in the NESCAC or Liberty league are not traveling to the west coast for these.

I’m thinking a ‘how serious are you about playing soccer in college’ conversation is in order. He’s been focusing far harder on studying for AP exams than researching ID camps…which is, in my opinion, how it should be, but he should know he needs to give soccer more focus if he’s serious about it.

I agree with having a discussion with your S about soccer. Unless he gets invited up to the top level academy team, the probability of soccer being a hook is much smaller. The fact of the matter is that there are far fewer college soccer programs for men (e.g., only 6 men’s teams in the “Pac-12” and one of them is SDSU) than women, which makes it difficult even for players at the top academy level to play D1 or D3 soccer.

Nonetheless, his stats are still amazing and that alone will keep him “in the game.”

Yes, IMO. But we liked having a guaranteed full tuition option or two in the back pocket.

And merit + need-based aid at schools where he’s way at the top of the applicants can be very good, as was pointed out earlier.

Soccer anecdote. My nephew played in HS and continued with the sport more casually in college and beyond. He broke his arm playing in college in the PNW. Ten years later he was still in the same major metropolitan area but living in the suburbs. He broke his other arm playing soccer- close to the same U hospital he had gone to years before- they had records from ten years ago. We’ll see what happens in the next decade…

There are plenty of serious soccer players out there and your son may find those at his level doing the club sports at a big U where his academic program best suits him.

@wrldpossibility I went to Bates and so did my husband. It’s a great community and your son sounds very much like a Batesie to me! When we went there in the late 80’s/early 90’s it didn’t have the level of athletics it does today but I know it has come up a great deal. In fact the men’s lax team is #1 and undefeated right now. You should definitely have your son talk to the coach there and try to visit. A few things about Bates - it is VERY cold in the winter but this isn’t so bad because there’s a lot to do on campus and people have fun with it. It is definitely pretty liberal politically but you will find that people are tolerant and open to discussion. Lots of people study abroad and there are great options. Also their Short Term is amazing. Lots of people do a 4-1-4 plan where they have a Jan Term but I love that Bates does a 4-4-1 so the short term is during the best weather and people can enjoy it.

I think your son has a very good shot at Bates and will love it!

My daughters were only middling athletes, so I have no experience with athletic recruitment. But considering his academic achievements alone, I’d say he’s in very fine shape. The question is whether he is an “average” smart kid or a true high-end applicant. And from here forward that question will turn on the SAT and/or ACT scores.

If his SAT/ACTs come out aligned with the rest of his stats, say a 1570 SAT or a 35 ACT then he becomes a legitimate contender for a slot at the reach schools (including Amherst and Pomona) on his list. Not a shoo-in by any means, but definitely a contender.

He probably wouldn’t get into into all his reaches, but if he applied to all of them I bet he’d get into one or more of them.

In fact he may wish to think about some of the rural Ivies if his scores come in that good. Based on what he’s looking for, I’d say Dartmouth fits the bill nicely as a candidate to be his highest reach. It’s technically a university, but it’s the smallest of the Ivies and the most LAC-like. You could consider it to be the biggest and shiniest LAC in the northeast. And it’s definitely rural.

Anyway, congratulations on having raised a (so far) high-achieving son. If he keeps performing at the same level he has so far, come Acceptance Day he will have many fine colleges falling all over themselves, vying for his affection.

@LMC9902 We are partial to Bates too! I didn’t attend there (I was at a LAC on the west coast) but my sister and her husband are both Bates alum, so they’ve been encouraging S to consider Bates for some time now. They absolutely loved their time there (that would have been in the late 90s).

@Scipio thank you! We really haven’t been considering Ivies yet, mostly because we prefer the offerings of a LAC, but we’ll take a harder look at Dartmouth as a possible high reach. Of course, we won’t bother adding an Ivy until after SATs/ACTs.

If finances are an issue, the East Coast is quite a distance so travel would be limited for him.

For travel expenses, he knows he could not return home as often as his brother (on our own coast) but he does have grandparents who have committed to helping with travel costs if he chooses to go to the east coast, and he has family in Massachusetts he could be with for shorter breaks.